Texas School has new strategy for school shootings - everyone fight back

Queasy1 · October 13th, 2006, 03:35 PM

link

	Quote:
	BURLESON, Texas (AP) -- Youngsters in a suburban Fort Worth school district are being taught not to sit there like good boys and girls with their hands folded if a gunman invades the classroom, but to rush him and hit him with everything they got - books, pencils, legs and arms. "Getting under desks and praying for rescue from professionals is not a recipe for success," said Robin Browne, a major in the British Army reserve and an instructor for Response Options, the company providing the training to the Burleson schools. That kind of fight-back advice is all but unheard of among schools, and some fear it will get children killed. But school officials in Burleson said they are drawing on the lessons learned from a string of disasters such as Columbine in 1999 and the Amish schoolhouse attack in Pennsylvania last week. The school system in this working-class suburb of about 26,000 is believed to be the first in the nation to train all its teachers and students to fight back, Browne said.

Displaced Bama Fan · October 13th, 2006, 03:47 PM

Sweet! I need to get elected to our school board in Katy and push this idea.

bamanut_aj · October 13th, 2006, 03:48 PM

I like it.

bamahuey1 · October 13th, 2006, 03:58 PM

When I was in the military we used to get briefings on how to handle certain situations such as hijackings if we were on a plane, etc. Prior to "9-11", as service members, we were told not to fight back or provoke the hijackers. Of course, after "9-11" we were told to resist, fight back, and try to subdue the terrorists. Personally, I like the idea of fighting back. Granted, some democrats and liberals might not like it, but is there anything they do like? If (God forbid) my child was to find themselves in that situation maybe they could flee during the chaos. Good policy. Unfortunately, they'll probably face some scrutiny, and bad press from some of the media.

BamaJeff · October 13th, 2006, 03:59 PM

Good idea.

Bama Reb · October 13th, 2006, 07:19 PM

IMO, it's always better to stand up and die fighting than to leave yourself to the mercy of a terrorist.

Ldlane · October 13th, 2006, 08:46 PM

I'm still thinking about this plan. But, could the school be held liable for teaching students to put themselves in "harm's way" in such situations?

Bama Reb · October 13th, 2006, 08:56 PM

	Quote:	ldlane
	I'm still thinking about this plan. But, could the school be held liable for teaching students to put themselves in "harm's way" in such situations?

If the students are in this situation, are they not they already in harm's way? And if so, the teachers have not put them there, but rather are simply giving them another way out.

Queasy1 · October 13th, 2006, 09:06 PM

	Quote:	ldlane
	I'm still thinking about this plan. But, could the school be held liable for teaching students to put themselves in "harm's way" in such situations?

Are they any more harms way than this?

	Quote:
	William Lassiter, manager of the North Carolina-based Center for Prevention of School Violence, said past attacks indicate that fighting back, at least by teachers and staff, has its merits. "At Columbine, teachers told students to get down and get on the floors, and gunmen went around and shot people on the floors," Lassiter said. "I know this sounds chaotic and I know it doesn't sound like a great solution, but it's better than leaving them there to get shot."

Couldn't the teachers be held liable for having the students cower at the mercy of their assailants?

The only other option would be to tell the students to run...that may work best for elementary school kids and younger as long as they have a way out...but what if they don't? Jr. High and older along with teachers could potentially overpower/distract a gunman enough to allow more kids to live.

Schools are a target for these crazed gunmen because they know that they are going into an environment where their victims are likely not going to fight back. If they know ahead of time that kids are being taught to fight them, they are less likely to prey on schools.

Ldlane · October 13th, 2006, 09:09 PM

	Quote:	Bama Reb
	If the students are in this situation, are they not they already in harm's way? And if so, the teachers have not put them there, but rather are simply giving them another way out.

Scenario:

Gunman comes into the room. He tells students and teacher to "sit and be quiet" and "nobody gets hurt!" Student rush the shooter he shoots and kills two or three. The students overtake the gunman and the gunman is arrested. Is the school "liable" for the two or three students that are shot and killed?

Not saying that I disagree with the plan, but playing "devils advocate". Simply because I am liable under law for the safety and welfare of my students while they are anywhere on school grounds. If the student is under my supervision I have to know where they are at all times if they are at my school. If I tell them to do something that may harm them, then I am liable.

Displaced Bama Fan · October 13th, 2006, 11:38 PM

What's that old joke about families from the North, v. families from the South, v. families from Texas when they are being mugged on the street.

What would you do if your family was robbed @ gunpoint on the street?

The northerners...not enough information...was the guy a drug addict, was he hungy?

The Southern - BANG!

The Texan - BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG! <clip dropping, reloading> BANG, BANG,BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG!

Texan's Daughter - "Nice grouping Daddy"

TexasBama · October 14th, 2006, 09:40 AM

Bama Reb · October 14th, 2006, 09:51 AM

	Quote:	ldlane
	Scenario: Gunman comes into the room. He tells students and teacher to "sit and be quiet" and "nobody gets hurt!" Student rush the shooter he shoots and kills two or three. The students overtake the gunman and the gunman is arrested. Is the school "liable" for the two or three students that are shot and killed? Not saying that I disagree with the plan, but playing "devils advocate". Simply because I am liable under law for the safety and welfare of my students while they are anywhere on school grounds. If the student is under my supervision I have to know where they are at all times if they are at my school. If I tell them to do something that may harm them, then I am liable.

Certainly a "darned if you do, darned if you don't" scenario. But what if you discouraged action on the part of your students, and the gunman decided to use them for target practice? Would you feel just as strongly then that you had properly provided for their "safety and welfare"?
IMO, preparedness for this type of scenario is similar in nature to that of a tornado rapidly approaching the school. Every person, whether student, teacher or administrator, must already have their plan of action in place, and it must be carried out immediately, without taking up valuable time debating the consequences. The students must not have to wait until they are told to respond. Any active response must be carried out immediately, thereby catching the attacker off guard and unprepared. "Chance favors the prepared mind."