Pay For Sterilization For Horrible Parents

[gmart74]

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I understand the eugenics and racial issues of this country, but please explain to me why this guy is wrong for what he is saying. I agree that we can't continually have terrible parents produce more and more children that are stuck in terrible conditions with no hope to escape. How do we fix it? I agree with his assertion- Liberal fixes have all failed.

Pay problem parents not to breed - mayor | World News | News.com.au

	Quote:
	AN outspoken Kiwi politician has proposed a new solution to the country's child abuse problem - pay the "appalling underclass" not to breed. "That there is a group within our society who give their children no hope nor opportunity from the moment that they are born," the regional mayor wrote on the New Zealand radio website where he broadcasts as a talkback DJ. Mr Laws argued that "liberal methods'' of beating the problem had failed.

[It's On A Slab]

	Quote:	gmart74
	I understand the eugenics and racial issues of this country, but please explain to me why this guy is wrong for what he is saying. I agree that we can't continually have terrible parents produce more and more children that are stuck in terrible conditions with no hope to escape. How do we fix it? I agree with his assertion- Liberal fixes have all failed. Pay problem parents not to breed - mayor | World News | News.com.au

The fallacy: The assumption that middle to upper income parents can't be bad parents. I know legions of them.

[gmart74]

yes, but middle class and rich people don't cost me more and more of my own money when they have kids. i agree that there are crappy parents across all ranges of people. however at some point we cant keep using taxes to pay for people's kids.

[CrimsonNan]

"They" should have gotten hold of the Octamom before she had eight MORE children.

[MasterShake]

New Zealand is sorta going through the opposite of what we are going through. They had about 9 years of liberal government now have a very strong conservative prime minister and the conservative party is growing by heaps. They got extremist over there the same as we do.....

[RogueElephant]

	Quote:	CrimsonNan
	"They" should have gotten hold of the Octamom before she had eight MORE children.

True

[NYBamaFan]

Lost me at "appalling underclass"

This is a pretty offensive phrase. Imagine any public figure calling the poor in America the "appalling underclass". No matter the point of the discussion, they are bound to stop listening to the message when they hear something like this.

I come from a poor family. We are generally poor because we are a military family. We serve and protect, and that doesn't pay much. I hope that we would never consider payment to keep families like mine from reproducing. Someone might get desperate enough to take the money, and the country would be the worse for it...

[gmart74]

if you had kept reading you would have seen where he addressed the issue as poor, horrible parents, not just poor people.

that is the problem with putting up your guard before hearing somone's entire point. sometimes you miss the important parts.

	Quote:
	Mr Laws said a report in New Zealand's Dominion-Post newspaper yesterday had incorrectly attributed the view to him that all those who got welfare should be sterilised. Mr Laws wrote on the website "that most welfare beneficiaries are good parents" but it was the problem ones who should be offered money not to breed.

makes a difference huh....

[It's On A Slab]

	Quote:	gmart74
	if you had kept reading you would have seen where he addressed the issue as poor, horrible parents, not just poor people. that is the problem with putting up your guard before hearing somone's entire point. sometimes you miss the important parts. makes a difference huh....

We had a kid who was in my daughters' high school, came from a broken home, middle class family. The kid joined a Mexican gang, shot up a rival's house while high on meth, kiilled three people, and is in a max security prison for the rest of his life.

His background would certainly exempt him from these stipulations....that being poor(which is family obviously was not). His biological parents failed him miserably, and now the state must keep him locked up and we're all paying for his upkeep as taxpayers.

[gmart74]

im more concerned about the 1000 children born into hopelessness rather than the one kid that makes bad choices.

i guess what baffles me is why do we find it so terrible to try to reduce the worst of the worst? what is it about our society that paralyzes us into inaction when it comes to workable solutions to extreme poverty/drug use/parental abuse of children? If we are talking about any other subject than having babies, no one has a problem with eliminating bad behavior. (multiple dui- cant drive a car, pedophile- isn't allowed near children, etc etc) It is only when it comes to the subject of putrid parents bringing forth children into the world to continue and escalate the cycle of despair that all of us pucker up and refuse to do anything? why?

[NYBamaFan]

	Quote:	gmart74
	if you had kept reading you would have seen where he addressed the issue as poor, horrible parents, not just poor people. that is the problem with putting up your guard before hearing somone's entire point. sometimes you miss the important parts. makes a difference huh....

No - that is why some people need to learn that a message with things like this will turn a reader/listener off so much that their message has no chance of being well received or understood. It is his fault that he phrased it as he did, not mine...

[gmart74]

i look for knowledge even from people i violently disagree with. you look for any reason to stop listening. we all have our own style i guess.
most of your posts are fairly well thought out even though i disagree with them quite a bit. i think with emotional subjects, we should all spend extra effort understanding the other person's point instead of allowing our emotions to deafen us. it seems to me like you are allowing your emotions to immediately turn you off to the guy's point instead of giving him the benefit of the doubt. the article phrased things in a way that gave the worst part of his quote first (basic journalism/writing class there- lead with the attention getter). so basically you are allowing the author of the article to turn you away from the story before you even know the whole story. since you seem to be one of the more rational posters on here i wouldn't have expected you to allow yourself to be manipulated like that.

i guess that is part of the problem with subjects like this. we are so emotional about these subjects, and so beaten down over slavery etc that as soon as a guy makes his point about sterilization i guarantee you most people would stop listening and immediately think he is talking about genocide or hates all black people or hates all poor people when that is not his point at all. we have to do something about this subject and it only moves us forward if we give everyone full consideration of their idea instead of refusing to listen in the first place.

[NYBamaFan]

	Quote:	gmart74
	i look for knowledge even from people i violently disagree with. you look for any reason to stop listening. we all have our own style i guess....

I guess so, which is why I will not bother to read the rest of this post after this comment.