He was that, but he also cast the money changers out of the temple. What is your take on that? again, just curious what you believei don't see how any of what i said is in conflict with that. In my view, Jesus was the personification of love and grace.
i think the money changers stuff is a message to folks who would promote religion for self enriching means (and imho, that includes self/ego gratification as well as monetary enrichment).He was that, but he also cast the money changers out of the temple. What is your take on that? again, just curious what you believe
Thats the point I have come to as well. I have been apart of Baptist, Assembly of God, Catholic and now attend an Episcopal church. The views of mainline protestantism allow me to not get focused on the small stuff, arguing over free will vs predestination, what it means to speak in tongues, what it means to have apostolic authority, is it really Jesus body and blood in the elements...etc, it gets real tiring.for me, after seeing and participating in many strains of christianity, the only consistent truth i can see is that of approaching the world and its inhabitants with love and grace. i honestly don't spend a lot of time worrying about the details beyond that because trying to do the previous part consistently keeps me pretty busy.
similar path here. after a period of non-affiliation, i ended up in the Episcopal Church (back in 2000)Thats the point I have come to as well. I have been apart of Baptist, Assembly of God, Catholic and now attend an Episcopal church. The views of mainline protestantism allow me to not get focused on the small stuff, arguing over free will vs predestination, what it means to speak in tongues, what it means to have apostolic authority, is it really Jesus body and blood in the elements...etc, it gets real tiring.
I could see that. That is what they were doing. I honestly never thought about it in that broad a perspective. I guess what I'm really asking is, do you believe him casting out the money changers conflicts with his message of "love and grace"? If so, how do you justify the two?i think the money changers stuff is a message to folks who would promote religion for self enriching means (and imho, that includes self/ego gratification as well as monetary enrichment).
This may not be at all what you are referring to, but aren't there some things worth debating? Just for example, it has become popular to label Jesus as a "good guy" or a "prophet". In my opinion, if you label Jesus as either of those, you've missed the boat. Jesus cannot be just a good guy. He cannot be a good prophet. The man is quoted as saying, "I and the Father are one." He claimed to be God. It's either the truth, or it's the ramblings of a nut or a liar.Thats the point I have come to as well. I have been apart of Baptist, Assembly of God, Catholic and now attend an Episcopal church. The views of mainline protestantism allow me to not get focused on the small stuff, arguing over free will vs predestination, what it means to speak in tongues, what it means to have apostolic authority, is it really Jesus body and blood in the elements...etc, it gets real tiring.
i don't see that as being in conflict with love and grace. and just to throw it out there, i do not read the Bible trying to get literal meaning out of it, but guidance. Its why i don't spend a lot of time worrying about the small stuff.I could see that. That is what they were doing. I honestly never thought about it in that broad a perspective. I guess what I'm really asking is, do you believe him casting out the money changers conflicts with his message of "love and grace"? If so, how do you justify the two?
Just for example, it has become popular to label Jesus as a "good guy" or a "prophet".
I know.... but it is becoming popular amongst the "Christian" community. And just the fact it's been around awhile does not make it a valid conclusion. If I told you I was the Creator of the Universe, would you think I was a good ole' boy? Of course not! Somebody would site an article about it, and you all would make fun of me for 2 or 3 days.... right?iirc, he is seen as such by Jews and Muslims. That view has been around for a while.
i gotcha... thanks for answering my questions.i don't see that as being in conflict with love and grace. and just to throw it out there, i do not read the Bible trying to get literal meaning out of it, but guidance. Its why i don't spend a lot of time worrying about the small stuff.
does this mean I'm evangelizing?i gotcha... thanks for answering my questions.
you might be.... i'm not biting though!does this mean I'm evangelizing?
Certainly there are, Jesus is the person who makes Christianity unique. To have another view of Christ would make a person not a Christian. That is a far cry from debating and anathematizing each over about things like what I already named-which does happen.This may not be at all what you are referring to, but aren't there some things worth debating? Just for example, it has become popular to label Jesus as a "good guy" or a "prophet". In my opinion, if you label Jesus as either of those, you've missed the boat. Jesus cannot be just a good guy. He cannot be a good prophet. The man is quoted as saying, "I and the Father are one." He claimed to be God. It's either the truth, or it's the ramblings of a nut or a liar.
i've got time, i know all 6 verses to "Just As I am" and i'll wear you down with the interlude.you might be.... i'm not biting though!
IMO, the capacity for great good or horrible evil exists within us all; I have issues with my faith when attempts are made to put a "face" on something spiritual. Do I believe in a higher power? Absolutely. But I don't think it's what or who many people think it is. I do not believe there is a horned devil with a spiked tail in spritual form roaming the earth with his minions to steal our souls by whisperring bad intentions in our "ears". I think that comes from inside each of us, and attributing it to an outside force is an excuse. "Satan" exists within all of us. We have the free will to decide to do good or bad.I believe all the evil in the world is generated entirely from within the psyche of mankind. We've got so much capacity for badness within ourselves, we don't need to attribute those impulses to an extracorporeal entity.
As for Santorum, I believe when a candidate starts going "too" religious he loses the bulk of the voting populace. It makes the fundamentalists happy, but alienates those of us who don't march to the beat of that drum. I know if Romney started talking about the more fundamental beliefs of the LDS, he'd be practically run out of the campaign on a rail.
there are SIX verses to Just As I Am? My hymnal only has FIVE.... I'll have to research this! OR you could just go ahead and sing!i've got time, i know all 6 verses to "Just As I am" and i'll wear you down with the interlude.
Maybe by Muslims...I can't speak for them. But not by Jews. And Satan is completely different from Christianity too. He is not against God at all. A good analogy is that Satan is the "prosecutor" of the heavenly court. He will put stumbling blocks in our path, but he wants us to succeed in getting past them.iirc, he is seen as such by Jews and Muslims. That view has been around for a while.
Satan is the prosecutor? and he wants us to succeed? this is new to me. what is your affiliation, if you don't mind?Maybe by Muslims...I can't speak for them. But not by Jews. And Satan is completely different from Christianity too. He is not against God at all. A good analogy is that Satan is the "prosecutor" of the heavenly court. He will put stumbling blocks in our path, but he wants us to succeed in getting past them.