News Article: Conservatives trust in science has declined sharply

selmaborntidefan

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Isn't this about evolution?
Define evolution.

When dozens of scientific fields (genetics, biology, archaeology, etc.) are producing evidence that the world was not created the way the Bible says it was,
I find this amusing - in light of the fact the Bible never really tells us the HOW. "On the first day.." etc. - such does not necessarily lend itself to the notion God (assuming His existence at this point) could not have used science.

I don't know how old the earth is. Guess what? Neither does anybody else. The only real question is whether you think it was thousands, millions, or billions.

I don't know - and to tell you the truth I don't care. It makes not an iota of difference. Proving the earth is billions of years old does not prove the non-existence of God. I'm in the camp of theologian B.B. Warfield from Princeton in the late 19th, early 20th century. I'm open to the TRUTHS of science, psychology, theology, the humanities, etc.

I'm not open to the non sequitor assumptions of such science.

the shortcut is to distrust science altogether.
And that is just as wrong as making scientific pronouncements ex cathedra statements from the pope.

Unfortunately, there's a lot of baby to throw out with that bath water.

True. But junk science is junk science - even if the name on it is Darwin, Bohr, or Einstein (I'm only using names people would necessarily know, not taking a position on specifics of their different theories).
 

Tider@GW_Law

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Heh. The guy who doesn't understand the private sector sees only solutions in government activity. What a surprise. Whatever non sequitur floats your boat, dude. Care to venture a guess at how many people with PhDs I know who work at NIH and tell me it's just like every other government bureaucracy with the way it wastes money?
I keep forgetting how much you know about me.

In terms of NIH folks, I'm guessing you will claim to know everybody there and that they've all privately confessed to you how terrible the federal gov't is, how they are just wastes of space, and how their entire existence is just a leech on society.

Did I get that right?
 

selmaborntidefan

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I don't care for the Christian fundamentalist influence in politics at all.
Activists like any other solitary issue group.

But, I consider their influence less offensive than the green activists who want to cripple this country with regulations that serve no purpose.
The purpose they have is to control. What's funny to me is how many greens make fun of fundamentalist Christians and are themselves every bit as fundamentalist and irrational - only in reverse. I've long said the only thing worse than a fundamentalist is a backward fundamentalist.

(To be fair, I am a fundamentalist if that term means holding to certain truths is indisipensable to the Christian faith - like the Resurrection of Jesus. Otoh - if fundamentalist means I condemn CCM because I think it's "worldly" or occupy my time with banning pornography, I'm not).

Government cannot solve climate change.
Government can't balance a checkbook (rim shot!)

In my experience government can't even order copier toner efficiently. (Our solution was to order all new copiers once we ran out of toner. No joke.) This is not the crowd I want "solving" anything.
We agree.
 

Bodhisattva

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I guess I missed that proof :rolleyes:
Yep, you totally did. You may want to read what has been written. And then perhaps comprehend.

I keep forgetting how much you know about me.
Big government, social engineering, the Constitution-is-very-malleable kind of guy, right?

In terms of NIH folks, I'm guessing you will claim to know everybody there
Nope.

and that they've all privately confessed to you how terrible the federal gov't is, how they are just wastes of space, and how their entire existence is just a leech on society.
Nope. But, they do recognize that, in spite of their best efforts, government is monumentally inefficient. This is true in DoD and NIH and everything else the government does, including the many bureaucracies who influence health care. Your problem is that you refuse to see the obvious.

Did I get that right?
Heh. Really? Not even close.
 

uafan4life

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I guess I just have a problem when someone cherry picks which science they choose to believe because it conflicts with their ideology.
Man, I laughed out loud at that one. Multiple times. :biggrin: Of course, I find the humor in irony to be some of the funniest there is, especially when the irony is unintended. :biggrin2:

Sent from my Asus Transformer using Tapatalk
 

Bama_Dawg

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I don't know how old the earth is. Guess what? Neither does anybody else. The only real question is whether you think it was thousands, millions, or billions.

I don't know - and to tell you the truth I don't care.
Is this what you really believe? That scientists haven't definitively proven the Earth is more than a few thousand years old?
 

Tider@GW_Law

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Nope. But, they do recognize that, in spite of their best efforts, government is monumentally inefficient. This is true in DoD and NIH and everything else the government does, including the many bureaucracies who influence health care. Your problem is that you refuse to see the obvious.

Heh. Really? Not even close.
I guess you proving me right on 1 out of 2 isn't bad.

I am still amazed that you have friends in every organization that comes up around these topics even after you've somehow forced the inefficiency of their employer and all manner of other political topics into your conversations with them. I can't imagine being friends with someone like that. Maybe I dodged a bullet on you never taking me up on a single invitation to grab a beer.
 

gmart74

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I guess I just have a problem when someone cherry picks which science they choose to believe because it conflicts with their ideology.
LOL. please apply that statement to dems and economics. or dems and gun control. or dems and crime.

if you truly had a problem with it, you would be utterly disgusted with the dem party. of course you really just hate republicans and want to only apply it to them. i'm fine with that but at least be honest with yourself as to your real motivations.
 

Bodhisattva

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I guess you proving me right on 1 out of 2 isn't bad.
Heh. Dude, you're an 0-fer. If you translate that into 1 for 2, no wonder you love government "solutions".

I am still amazed that you have friends in every organization that comes up around these topics
You're very easily amazed. I've lived in/around DC for almost 20 years. There are hundreds thousands of government employees here. You realize that, right? You think it's hard to run into to government workers? You should have paid more attention to your surroundings when you were here. Four neighbors on my same street work for different government agencies. Reality, dude.

even after you've somehow forced the inefficiency of their employer and all manner of other political topics into your conversations with them. I can't imagine being friends with someone like that.
And I can't imagine being friends with one so clueless about the government they worship. Government is inefficiency. When I meet up with friends/colleagues, talk of our jobs come up. (Does that amaze you too?) And it is natural to laugh at the way government does things (like, as I mentioned earlier, buying an office-full of new printers instead of just buying toner). That you seem to think government works well is a testament to how little perspective you have. I deal in how things are, not in magic pony land where the social engineers know better than everyone else.

Maybe I dodged a bullet on you never taking me up on a single invitation to grab a beer.
Sadly (or whatever), meeting you for a beer was never a priority, and I just could never work it into my schedule.
 
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Tider@GW_Law

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You're very easily amazed. . . . Reality, dude.

Sadly (or whatever), meeting you for a beer was never a priority, and I just could never work it into my schedule.
Ah yes of course, well you found something else that has amazed me, which is that you have 10 hours a day to spend on the internet but not an hour for a beer.

BTW: Your toner example would be a violation of govt procurement law.
 

Bodhisattva

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Ah yes of course, well you found something else that has amazed me, which is that you have 10 hours a day to spend on the internet but not an hour for a beer.
haha. Pathetic straw man, dude.

BTW: Your toner example would be a violation of govt procurement law.
Heh. The irony is awesome! If only you had such concerns about the government violating the Constitution, costing taxpayers trillions of dollars, instead of focusing on a few thousand dollars of printers. Eh, I'll express your concerns to the branch chief in my office that made that call.

And I would hope that that kind of stupidity would be illegal. But, it happened. And while this is minor, almost daily I see tremendous waste of taxpayer money. I regularly have contractors go over budget. Why? Because the government will just pay more. It's stupid. Construction on the same 200-yard section of road on base has been going on for more than two years. Pure waste. All this should bother you. That should cause you to question your faith that the government does anything well.
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Is this what you really believe? That scientists haven't definitively proven the Earth is more than a few thousand years old?
Have they proven it is 4.6 billion and 300 days?

No.

I'm speaking theoretically.

I neither know nor care. What difference does it make?

You don't know, either - and neither does anyone else. There's just guesses and estimates.
 

selmaborntidefan

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What is the science that democrats cherry pick regarding gun control and crime? I'm honestly curious.
The notion that gun control REDUCES crime?

Washington DC has some of the strictest gun control laws in the land. It also has violence out the wazzuu.
 

Bama4Ever831

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There are two side to every story...

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/28/opinion/mann-climate-change-email-attacks/index.html?iref=allsearch

Ironically, as these attacks have grown, the scientific facts have become ever clearer. Climate scientists know the world is warming and human activity -- particularly burning coal and oil -- is the primary driver. The idea of addressing climate change threatens some people in the fossil fuel industry. And a vocal minority of corporate interests and their ideological allies are spending a lot of money to hijack the public debate about climate change.
I call all this the "scientization" of politics. Attacks on science and scientists are an effort to advance a political agenda, not an effort to better understand science or the risks it uncovers. The tobacco industry did it when scientists linked cigarettes to cancer. The lead industry tried to discredit a scientist who found that lead exposure hurt children's cognitive abilities.
In the most infamous episode, somebody stole thousands of e-mails and documents from leading climate researchers, including me. They cherry picked key phrases from the e-mails and published them out of context, like a black-and-white political attack ad with ominous music. Fossil fuel industry-funded groups gleefully spread the e-mails online and badgered the mainstream media into covering the "controversy" they had manufactured.
I think there are VERY few people that have actually read a single primary source article on this issue. So to think most of you have already dismissed something based on a dailymail.co.uk article is quite sad...
 
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