Will brain injury discoveries radically change football?

Ldlane

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Nov 26, 2002
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According to an NFHS study from 2008-2009:

Per 100,000 Injury Exposures the rate of Concussion incidences are:

Football - 52
Boy's Ice Hockey - 43
Girl's Lacrosse - 39
Girl's Soccer -35

Boy's Lacrosse -32
Boy's Wrestling - 22
Girl's Basketball - 20
Girl's Field Hockey - 18
Boy's Soccer - 17
Girl's Softball - 15
Boy's Basketball - 9

My biggest complaint to our local officials on "officiating" is that they let Girl's Basketball get way out of hand as far as allowing mad scrambles for the ball and allowing the game to become to physical. The response has been, "It is very hard to officiate Girl's basketball in the first place, so it is hard for the officials to control the game."
 
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gmart74

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It does seem like girls are brutal to each other and the refs just stand there looking like idiots. Girls throw elbows any chance they get. brutal savages. however those injury rates really dont have all that much to do with head injuries. i would guesstimate a substantial % of those injuries are ACL due to women's skeletal structure and muscle development.
 

Ldlane

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It does seem like girls are brutal to each other and the refs just stand there looking like idiots. Girls throw elbows any chance they get. brutal savages. however those injury rates really dont have all that much to do with head injuries. i would guesstimate a substantial % of those injuries are ACL due to women's skeletal structure and muscle development.
That is a concussion study.


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TIDE-HSV

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It does seem like girls are brutal to each other and the refs just stand there looking like idiots. Girls throw elbows any chance they get. brutal savages. however those injury rates really dont have all that much to do with head injuries. i would guesstimate a substantial % of those injuries are ACL due to women's skeletal structure and muscle development.
It's really not so much about muscle development. Plenty of male football players get popped ACLs who have excellent surrounding muscle development. However, the anatomy of the female knee (femoral "key-hole" arch) does predispose to non-contact ACL ruptures. Contact-wise, the rates are about the same as for men...
 

TIDE-HSV

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Helmets should not be used as offensive or defensive weapons.
True, but with a full face guard and a supposed "anti-concussion" helmet, that temptation will always be there. There's a strong argument to be made that less protection might mean, in the end, more. It'll probably be a surprise to many here, but leading with the head was taught as proper technique back in the '60s. I can't count the number of times I've heard Coach Bryant comment on his Sunday show "That's putting the old Ridell on him!"
 

Ldlane

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Concussion Study


According to the 2009-10 High School Sports-Related Injury Surveillance Study, more than 140,000 high school athletes suffer a concussion each year. The study, conducted by Dawn Comstock, Ph.D., director of the Center for Injury Research and Policy at Nationwide Children’s Hospital in Columbus, Ohio, also indicated that the incidence rate for concussion is highest among football players. The next two highest rates among boys sports are ice hockey and lacrosse. In girls sports, the incidence rate is highest in soccer, gymnastics and lacrosse.
 

saraelizabethua

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My law school had a symposium on this issue a few weeks ago... They had a panel of sports law attorneys/professors, a former NFL player (Todd Wade), and a sports medicine doctor. The panelists said all of the usual things, but the doctor pointed out a lot of the other factors NFL players face have exasperated their medical issues. The doctor played devil's advocate most of the time, which was surprising to me.

Regarding the lawsuits being brought against the NFL, I tend to agree that they accepted a certain level of risk. Unless the coaches knew (or should have known) that a player was concussed and made him play anyway, I don't think a player can just come back and sue the NFL. There should have to be extenuating circumstances.
 

gmart74

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One thing that keeps jumping out at me isnt the head to head collisions. It is the head to ground collisions, especially on sacks or tackles where the back of the helmet slams into the ground. If they could redesign the helmet or make neck rolls mandatory, it may prevent up to half of the concussions.
 

CHATTBRIT

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Dec 3, 2003
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One of the biggest issues discussed in the Real Sports segment was the recommendation to reduce contact during practice by having only one day a week of real hitting. They said this would greatly reduce the brain damage. They evidenced this by showing the MRI of one player at the beginning of the season compared to one taken at the end of the season. There was marked reduction in the cognitive thinking part of the brain. (Not being a neurologist I take them at their word).

Soccer also has significant numbers of players with concussive symptoms from heading a speeding football, hitting heads when going for a ball, etc.
 

Crimson1967

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Nov 22, 2011
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According to an NFHS study from 2008-2009:

Per 100,000 Injury Exposures the rate of Concussion incidences are:

Football - 52
Boy's Ice Hockey - 43
Girl's Lacrosse - 39
Girl's Soccer -35

Boy's Lacrosse -32
Boy's Wrestling - 22
Girl's Basketball - 20
Girl's Field Hockey - 18
Boy's Soccer - 17
Girl's Softball - 15
Boy's Basketball - 9
Interesting the girl's version of the sports have a much higher concussion rate than the boy's version. Baseball isn't listed, wonder what it is compared to softball?
 

Ldlane

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Well, last evening one my girls hit her head and I have my first Concussion on my team for the year.
 

We_are_Bama

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I have a concern that we are only one legal case away from high schools dropping football. The first time someone successfully sues a high school for damages related to a football injury that results in a large settlement will cause most if not all high schools to evaluate there participation in all sports. Many high schools cannot afford the cost of liability insurance if court cases become common.
Really? Are you aware that when parents allow their son/daughter to play high school sports, they are generally asked to sign a waiver? Once they sign that, they thereby waive the right to sue the school, team, or coach, for injuries their child might receive while participating in a sports activity.
 

TIDE-HSV

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Really? Are you aware that when parents allow their son/daughter to play high school sports, they are generally asked to sign a waiver? Once they sign that, they thereby waive the right to sue the school, team, or coach, for injuries their child might receive while participating in a sports activity.
I have had the occasion to look into the question of whether a parent can waive the right of a child to sue for tort. However, the last time I looked, only a small minority of states (ten, I think) would enforce such a waiver and dismiss a suit brought on the child's behalf. Alabama, at the time, was not among them. There's an overlapping concept where public schools are concerned, and that's sovereign immunity. The crown (government) may be sued only to the extent permitted specifically by law. Most states have a form of limited liability. For example, the last time I looked at it, incorporated municipalities had a limit of $150K (may have been raised by now). Worst case I ever saw was where a member of the HSV PD T-boned a lady pulling out onto Memorial Parkway from Sam's Club. He was driving in excess of 90 mph, no lights, no siren and was driving to a call outside his area with no clearance. He had been in two previous wrecks where he was at fault and had been suspended. Limit of liability - $150K. His pockets were, naturally, empty. So, the liability of public schools, being part of government is limited by statute. I just don't know what that limit is currently. Private schools, however, are a different matter. They typically insure themselves to their financial limit because it's never safe to depend on that waiver...
 
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CoolBreeze

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According to an NFHS study from 2008-2009:

Per 100,000 Injury Exposures the rate of Concussion incidences are:

Football - 52
Boy's Ice Hockey - 43
Girl's Lacrosse - 39
Girl's Soccer -35

Boy's Lacrosse -32
Boy's Wrestling - 22
Girl's Basketball - 20
Girl's Field Hockey - 18
Boy's Soccer - 17
Girl's Softball - 15
Boy's Basketball - 9
Wow, that is very revealing. Thanks for posting! My first thought on this subject would be go back to leather helments to limit one's propensity to lead with the head when tackling. But studying your post leads me to believe that science and technology combined with rules/coaching changes may be the only thing to correct this about our beloved sport.
 

Al A Bama

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I've always wondered about toddlers constantly falling down and hitting their head on the floor. I wonder how many TBI's are happening at such a young age when the brain is still developing. Maybe we should stop walking.
If football goes the way of gladiators in the Roman Colosseum, what are we going to do?

I just can't watch a soccer game on TV. It's too boring. With so many injuries in soccer, well it would need to be outlawed also. How about basketball? When I was in high school we played the game in what we called a cracker box. One player going full speed ran into a brick wall. Yes, resulting injury was a concussion. How about rugby?

Maybe we should not be crawling on the floor as a toddler! Mom might accidentally drop a jar of pickles on our head. Yes, a concussion.

Maybe we should outlaw driving. There are just too many accidents with all kinds of injuries and too many deaths also.

There are also a lot of boating accidents, so we may need to outlaw fishing, skiing, etc. Aren't there a lot of hunting accidents? Aren't there many plane crashes. We just can't have flying anymore. It's tooooo risky. So, our government needs to outlaw living or at least let everyone become a wimp! Oh, that's risky also.

Living in the world or on this earth is a risky business. Maybe we should just stop bringing little ones into this cold, cruel world. Someone may say something bad about them and bully them. I guess we should go the route of the dinosaurs.
 

JDCrimson

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We dont have to worry about it going away per se. But we do have to worry about it being like NASCAR such that they became so consumed with safety that no one really wants to watch anymore with the Car of Tomorrow developments, etc.

As for football, this is an area where uniform changes might actually make a difference. If you changed the color of the uniform in the area where it is legal to hit I think it would actually promote sounder tackling technique and it would certainly give the officials a visual guide to go by where anything above the numbers is a foul. I would probably make it a lesser foul though like 5 or 10 yards with facemask still being 15 yds. I would also get rid of the cut blocks too. Any play you need to set up by blocking someone below the knee is not a necessary.

I dont think the games pose as much risk as practice. Some of the equipment used at the HS level is pitiful and dangerous. But I dont see how you can argue to take away the helmet as an effective solution. We could not stomach the accidental or non-intentional paralyzations that would come from such a move now that players are as big and fast as they are - not to mention the guys who are still willing to deliver the cheap shot (which you wont ever get rid of btw).
 

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