Will brain injury discoveries radically change football?

DocCrimson

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We dont have to worry about it going away per se. But we do have to worry about it being like NASCAR such that they became so consumed with safety that no one really wants to watch anymore with the Car of Tomorrow developments, etc.

As for football, this is an area where uniform changes might actually make a difference. If you changed the color of the uniform in the area where it is legal to hit I think it would actually promote sounder tackling technique and it would certainly give the officials a visual guide to go by where anything above the numbers is a foul. I would probably make it a lesser foul though like 5 or 10 yards with facemask still being 15 yds. I would also get rid of the cut blocks too. Any play you need to set up by blocking someone below the knee is not a necessary.

I dont think the games pose as much risk as practice. Some of the equipment used at the HS level is pitiful and dangerous. But I dont see how you can argue to take away the helmet as an effective solution. We could not stomach the accidental or non-intentional paralyzations that would come from such a move now that players are as big and fast as they are - not to mention the guys who are still willing to deliver the cheap shot (which you wont ever get rid of btw).
Amen about cut blocks. As for games vs. practice, at least at the college and pro level, games seem to result in significantly more concussions per day. The collisions in practice are significant primarily for OL and DL, with repeated hits to the head that seem to have a cumulative effect. Where I used to work at Dartmouth, they were participating in some fascinating studies regarding helmet impact and cumulative brain injuries, measuring the impact forces high schoolers and college kids are undergoing. It's rather frightening stuff when you look at the sum data. Ideally, improved impact-softening gear will make enough of a difference to prevent more Dave Duerson, Junior Seau - type issues.
 

CapstoneTider

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I am starting to change my mind and believe that big money and wealthy influence will stop this out of control train at some point. It'***** the peak and has stabilized. We will see millions in promo video's of NFL greats instructing youngsters, improved helmet, mandatory tests after big hits, and stricter rules like mandatory retirement. To the owners, this is about money, be it liability or loss of ticket sales. That will motive them to protect their mostly expendable commodities.

At some point ESPN is going to realize that they have a conflict of interest and will shut the pie hole a bit.

Bottom line- football is the most entertaining game on the planet and creme will always rise to the top
 

TIDE-HSV

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Amen about cut blocks. As for games vs. practice, at least at the college and pro level, games seem to result in significantly more concussions per day. The collisions in practice are significant primarily for OL and DL, with repeated hits to the head that seem to have a cumulative effect. Where I used to work at Dartmouth, they were participating in some fascinating studies regarding helmet impact and cumulative brain injuries, measuring the impact forces high schoolers and college kids are undergoing. It's rather frightening stuff when you look at the sum data. Ideally, improved impact-softening gear will make enough of a difference to prevent more Dave Duerson, Junior Seau - type issues.
IDK. In the end, the trauma is really caused by the brain rattling around inside the cranium. Short of having the head encased in some huge pneumatic device, making play impossible, I don't see how that can be be accomplished by any gear. In fact, there's a lot of thought now that more minimal head gear might be better...
 

DocCrimson

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IDK. In the end, the trauma is really caused by the brain rattling around inside the cranium. Short of having the head encased in some huge pneumatic device, making play impossible, I don't see how that can be be accomplished by any gear. In fact, there's a lot of thought now that more minimal head gear might be better...
Reducing the size of headgear may help reduce frequency of helmet-to-helmet collisions, but increasing the cushioning is at least as important. Some of the newer inserts that are used for certain players seem promising, but they're not widely used. Current helmet size is in some ways dictated by spinal issues, and are supposed to enable easy stabilization of the spine. Reducing helmet size too much removes that safety feature. Relying on people to learn not to use their head by minimizing headgear seems like a disaster waiting to happen in my opinion. If you minimize headgear protection, people may eventually learn to avoid hitting with their head, but the ground and gravity won't have the same reservations about contact. Whiplash and head-to-ground concussions would skyrocket without adequate headgear.
 

JDCrimson

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Reducing the size of headgear may help reduce frequency of helmet-to-helmet collisions, but increasing the cushioning is at least as important. Some of the newer inserts that are used for certain players seem promising, but they're not widely used. Current helmet size is in some ways dictated by spinal issues, and are supposed to enable easy stabilization of the spine. Reducing helmet size too much removes that safety feature. Relying on people to learn not to use their head by minimizing headgear seems like a disaster waiting to happen in my opinion. If you minimize headgear protection, people may eventually learn to avoid hitting with their head, but the ground and gravity won't have the same reservations about contact. Whiplash and head-to-ground concussions would skyrocket without adequate headgear.
I agree with this... There is no way to know how many concussions occur based on HTH contact or result from contact with the ground. I dont see how you can limit the HTG contact unless we want transform in flag FB.

I just dont understand how we can harangue over this so much - sure we need to make the game safer - but statistically its not like you are doomed to a life of drool mouth if you play the sport. If you really want to get upset about something, explain to me why 1 in 88 kids is being diagnosed with autism. Where is the national outrage over that!?

Its really amazing to me see what gets sensationalized now - everything has to be a national crisis... How did we make it 15 minutes ago???
 

Sabine Free Sta

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Maybe we fans of big boy football are the dinosaurs. The game has changed a lot in the past. I bet there were old timers who complained about the loss of the flying wedge for decades afterwards. Haven't heard any complaints about that lately.
 

B1GTide

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Players feel invincible encased in their pads/helmets. Take away the pads and helmets and play will change - injuries will be fewer and less severe.
 

TIDE-HSV

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Players feel invincible encased in their pads/helmets. Take away the pads and helmets and play will change - injuries will be fewer and less severe.
Wonder what the concussion/injury rate is for un-padded OZ rules football, or, for that matter, English rugby. I haven't looked, but it might be interesting...
 

Ldlane

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Wonder what the concussion/injury rate is for un-padded OZ rules football, or, for that matter, English rugby. I haven't looked, but it might be interesting...
Seventeen concussions were recorded, accounting for 25% of all reported injuries. The incidence rate for concussion was 3.8 per 1000 athlete-exposures (95% confidence interval, 2.0–5.7) or 11.3 per 100 player-seasons (95% confidence interval, 5.9–16.7). Of the 17 concussions, 14 were Cantu grade 1, 2 were grade 2, and 1 was grade 3. Concussions accounted for 25% of all days lost from rugby participation due to injury.
Excerpt from Journal of Athletic Training:

Concussion in Rugby: The Hidden Epidemic
 

B1GTide

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So, 11.3 for every 100 player-seasons translates to a given player getting one concussion every 8.4 seasons of play (including practices). That seems to be pretty low. One of every two players would experience a single concussion over a 4 year HS rugby playing career. Wonder how HS football compares.

Interesting stats here: http://www.momsteam.com/health-safety/concussion-rates-high-school-sports
 
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Ldlane

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So, 11.3 for every 100 player-seasons translates to a given player getting one concussion every 8.4 seasons of play (including practices). That seems to be pretty low. One of every two players would experience a single concussion over a 4 year HS rugby playing career. Wonder how HS football compares.

Interesting stats here: http://www.momsteam.com/health-safety/concussion-rates-high-school-sports
Pretty much the same stats from the NFHS report. I think the difference in Football as opposed to rugby is that because you do wear "protective" gear you tend to use that gear to bring down the opponent. In other words, there aren't many players in rugby that want to "lead with their head" in a "head to head" hit as opposed to "helmet to helmet" which you see in football.

That's it! Bring back the leather helmets!!! Can they be white?
 

buzzincuzzin

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Knee injures were the biggest concern for a long time. Equipment and rule changes were implemented but the biggest change was an advancement in treatments after the fact. I really expect more of the same.
 

Dallas4Bama

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Like it or not, and I don't, the sports time as we know it is coming to an end. There will come a day when parents won't even consider signing their children up for football. The numbers in some areas are already falling off with kids looking to sports which while competitive don't deteriorate the body as badly. Golf and tennis are gaining popularity among kids and teens in some areas. Eventually football will be looked at as a backwards and at some point even a racist sport. At that point it will go the way of dog fighting.
 

BamaPokerplayer

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IDK. In the end, the trauma is really caused by the brain rattling around inside the cranium. Short of having the head encased in some huge pneumatic device, making play impossible, I don't see how that can be be accomplished by any gear. In fact, there's a lot of thought now that more minimal head gear might be better...
You seem to have as much info on this as anyone. Not to put you on the spot, but what do you think is the best way to fix the problem?
 

Ldlane

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Like it or not, and I don't, the sports time as we know it is coming to an end. There will come a day when parents won't even consider signing their children up for football. The numbers in some areas are already falling off with kids looking to sports which while competitive don't deteriorate the body as badly. Golf and tennis are gaining popularity among kids and teens in some areas. Eventually football will be looked at as a backwards and at some point even a racist sport. At that point it will go the way of dog fighting.
My Basketball player that got hurt the other night has had 3 concussions. This was her first for Basketball, the other two was "breaking horses".
 

Huckleberry

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I think the concern about diagnosed (i.e. noticeable) concussions is a valid one, but it's not the likely end to the sport of football as we know it. Concussions get the headlines because the symptoms can be so dramatic and the plays that caused them can be shown on TV over and over again. The real danger is the idea that it's the little hits (that happen hundreds of times a year to every football player above the age of twelve or so) that might lead to severe symptoms years later. When it's accepted that the simple act of a kid's helmeted head hitting the ground or another player over and over again causes minute brain damage each time it occurs, you can bet that parents will put a stop to their child playing football. Wait and watch the what happens if the Surgeon General equates the damage to young brains from the repeated typical contact in tackle football to drops of water eventually wearing a hole in concrete.

We can wail over the perceived lack of toughness in today's world, but that won't salve my soul when the game I love goes away. It doesn't take much litigation to change things. Try to find lawn darts in the toy section or a child riding a bike without a helmet. The phrase "won't someone think about the children" has become a mocking line in our society, but the thought behind it holds tremendous sway with today's parents. I teach elementary school and you can bet not a single one of the kids in my class would be allowed to play organized football if society accepts that doing so presents an inherent and likely danger of eventual brain damage. Sissified society or not -- real threat of brain injury or not -- public perception will rule. And if youth football dies, so does college and professional, at least as we know it.

The real issue is not the one hit that causes a TBI. It's the thousands of little hits in youth football that don't seem to matter at the time that are beginning to cause real concern.
 
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Dallas4Bama

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My Basketball player that got hurt the other night has had 3 concussions. This was her first for Basketball, the other two was "breaking horses".
40 years ago no one would even think twice about what you just said. Today a good number will cringe and wonder why anyone would let a child get on a horse that hasn't been saddle broke.
 

Ldlane

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40 years ago no one would even think twice about what you just said. Today a good number will cringe and wonder why anyone would let a child get on a horse that hasn't been saddle broke.
Out here "Rodeo" is a primary sport.
 

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