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  1. #27
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Alasippi's Avatar
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by gwilliams View Post
    Dial is so much bigger and stronger that Murray bounced off Dial like a spring. Murray is actually kind of small.
    I don't think Murray's as small as Quinton is big

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  3. #28
    BamaNation Hall of Fame bamacon's Avatar
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    This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    "If We Hadn't Lost Colt... Part II"

    starrring Aaron Murray

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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    what is to be gained by the University of Georgia asking the SEC to look at this hit. that is what is being reported here in Atlanta. It is like Uga is looking for official justification for the loss.
    to 16 and beyond........

  5. #30
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    LOL! Visit their pages and see how many single causes they've identified. Basically they just ran out of time. Every once in a while, someone will remember that they had 350 yds rushing put on them...
    yeah, the loss hurts, and they're looking for something that makes it hurt less.

    The fact is, some calls went for them, some against them...just like us.

    but giving up 350 yards rushing? c'mon, you gotta know what lost the game for you when that happens.

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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    With the way we operate these days I could see the rule changed from

    "one who because his physical position and focus of concentrationis especially vulnerable to injury."

    to

    "one who because his physical condition and focus of concentration is especially vulnerable to injury."

    It makes for a more fair playing field for everyone no matter your size!

  7. #32
    BamaNation First Team fundytide's Avatar
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    I decided to make a new thread because it's becoming obvious that folks are posting in threads and not bothering to read any posts above where they're inserting a new post. Like it or not, here's what the NCAA says in its definition: "one who because his physical position and focus of concentration is especially vulnerable to injury." As you can see, it's ridiculous. It can cover any player who happens to be looking in the other direction. (IOW, no crackbacks.) In Shaw's statement, I can't tell if he's saying that Dial led with his helmet (I happen to think he didn't, no matter what Steve says) or if Murray were defenseless because he was off i La-La land...
    Good point, Earle. So, two conditions have to be simultaneously met (physical position AND focus of concentration). It seems to me that in the case of Dial hitting Murray, BOTH are not met. Murray is jogging toward the ball carrier (Dix) so his physical position is not 'defenseless' by any stretch of the imagination. It's not like he is layed-out, airborne trying to catch a pass.

  8. #33
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    I don't think anything will come of this. The game is over and people just need to let it go.

  9. #34
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by fundytide View Post
    Good point, Earle. So, two conditions have to be simultaneously met (physical position AND focus of concentration). It seems to me that in the case of Dial hitting Murray, BOTH are not met. Murray is jogging toward the ball carrier (Dix) so his physical position is not 'defenseless' by any stretch of the imagination. It's not like he is layed-out, airborne trying to catch a pass.
    I think no flag was thrown for two reasons. First, the official could see that Dial actually turned and led with his shoulder, and as been pointed out, at his height, some helmet to helmet contact was inevitable. The second reason is that, even though Murray was distracted, he had absolutely no right to be so. I see a lot of the UGA boards that he wasn't involved in the play. Well, he should have been. He should have been attempting a tackle. Shaw's statement makes zero sense. First he says that they to break it down frame by frame, which they haven't done yet, then he states that it should have been flagged as a PF. On what grounds? And how does he know at a glance, without breaking it down. Talk about muddying the water...
    "The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity. - Ellen Parr"

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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    .....I see a lot of the UGA boards that he wasn't involved in the play. Well, he should have been. He should have been attempting a tackle.....
    We should not assume players like QB's and kickers are bystanders after their "role" is over all of the time. I saw Foster make a vicious tackle in the Auburn game. It looked so natural that Verne and Gary didn't notice it was Cade who made the solo tackle.

  11. #36
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by CapstoneTider View Post
    We should not assume players like QB's and kickers are bystanders after their "role" is over all of the time. I saw Foster make a vicious tackle in the Auburn game. It looked so natural that Verne and Gary didn't notice it was Cade who made the solo tackle.
    Back several years ago, the last Colquitt in that line of punters that UT had was prancing around like a drum major in front of our bench after he'd punted and the ball was still live. One of our guys - it may have been Harper - almost knocked him out of his jockstrap. He kept his head on a swivel after that...
    "The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity. - Ellen Parr"

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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    Back several years ago, the last Colquitt in that line of punters that UT had was prancing around like a drum major in front of our bench after he'd punted and the ball was still live. One of our guys - it may have been Harper - almost knocked him out of his jockstrap. He kept his head on a swivel after that...
    Roman is a goodie. Yeah those Colquitt's kept coming, he was probably waiving at his siblings. Which I could see that

  13. #38
    BamaNation First Team fundytide's Avatar
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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    I think no flag was thrown for two reasons. First, the official could see that Dial actually turned and led with his shoulder, and as been pointed out, at his height, some helmet to helmet contact was inevitable. The second reason is that, even though Murray was distracted, he had absolutely no right to be so. I see a lot of the UGA boards that he wasn't involved in the play. Well, he should have been. He should have been attempting a tackle. Shaw's statement makes zero sense. First he says that they to break it down frame by frame, which they haven't done yet, then he states that it should have been flagged as a PF. On what grounds? And how does he know at a glance, without breaking it down. Talk about muddying the water...
    If you use the Baccari Rambo tackling standard, one could argue that Murray WAS involved in the play. Murray wanted a piece of Dix about as much as Rambo wanted a piece of Lacy in the open field.

    In my opinion, Dial's block was on the edge but it doesn't quite meet any of the standards necessary to be either a penalty or punishable action.

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    Re: This is the actual NCAA definition of a "defenseless player..."

    Quote Originally Posted by fundytide View Post
    If you use the Baccari Rambo tackling standard, one could argue that Murray WAS involved in the play. Murray wanted a piece of Dix about as much as Rambo wanted a piece of Lacy in the open field.

    In my opinion, Dial's block was on the edge but it doesn't quite meet any of the standards necessary to be either a penalty or punishable action.
    What should he have done? A. Block him lightly B. Bypass him and block #4? C. Just stand there and think about it.

    I really believe he did the the instinctual thing that has been coached to him over the years. And it really looks like a clean hit, so the only argument is if players should take pity when delivering a blow, and is that what we want football to become?

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