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  1. #27
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by DocCrimson View Post
    Fair enough. I could have sworn that I'd seen several comments in articles stating that the SEC had said it should have been a penalty. I would have been disappointed if he'd been flagged, but could have lived with it as a decision given the helmet-to-helmet contact. But I was most assuredly yelling at my TV when they were complaining that it was an inappropriate hit. My read on it was that he left his helmet too far forward, but was actually charging with his shoulder, but when AM turned his head, it resulted in helmet-to-helmet contact. I've seen that called many times, but I've also seen it missed (or intentionally not called) plenty of times as well. I was just saying that the real issue regarding the media has to do with a terrible interpretation of when someone should be suspended. Dial clearly wanted to get a free shot on the QB, but it was well within the rules to block him. The helmet-to-helmet hit in that situation would never have resulted in demands for a suspension in the example I gave.
    Actually, from Marty's post from the interview with Shaw on Smashmouth, it appears you are correct. What still bothers me about the helmet to helmet is how on earth a defender can possibly avoid it when he's 6" taller. How can he get low enough to avoid it without going dangerously low? It's a conundrum without an answer in the rulebook...
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  3. #28
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    Re: No link: But Scarbinsky is reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by DiamondDust View Post
    From Steve Shaw:
    WOW... The SEC got it right on Murray becoming a Defender after the Interception.
    (Still didn't look to me like Dial lowered his head for the hit, problem is a lot of people forget
    that football is a contact sport, and there are violent collisions.)

  4. #29
    BamaNation First Team BayouBama75's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    I thought helmet to helmet was only a penalty on defenseless player. Running backs and blocking are allowed H-H contact. Once Murrary moved towards the ball carrier he was no longer a defenseless player unless there is some rule that say QBs are always defenseless.

  5. #30
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by BayouBama75 View Post
    I thought helmet to helmet was only a penalty on defenseless player. Running backs and blocking are allowed H-H contact. Once Murrary moved towards the ball carrier he was no longer a defenseless player unless there is some rule that say QBs are always defenseless.
    Even if you're not classified as defenseless, you're not supposed to lead with the helmet. In this case, what went from being a punishing shoulder tackle ended up as helmet-to-helmet. I may have crimson colored glasses, and I wouldn't have been enraged about it getting called, but I would have been disappointed. I agree with Earle to an extent. You can't expect people to tackle without getting the helmet into the body sometimes, even with perfect form. I also agree that we need to reduce the frequency of concussions. I see brain injured patients almost every day at work, and it's much harder to successfully treat people for mental health issues when they have a history of brain injury. And for those of you who have debated this issue, ANY concussion is considered a mild traumatic brain injury. Whether or not you have residual deficits from mTBI is another issue.

  6. #31
    BamaNation First Team BamaFanInTally's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    I'm all about player safety, within reason. It looks like the intent of CFB and Pro Football is to turn the game into a friendly game of badminton. When you play big time, big boy football in the SEC, you better tighten the straps pretty tight.

  7. #32
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by DocCrimson View Post
    Even if you're not classified as defenseless, you're not supposed to lead with the helmet. In this case, what went from being a punishing shoulder tackle ended up as helmet-to-helmet. I may have crimson colored glasses, and I wouldn't have been enraged about it getting called, but I would have been disappointed. I agree with Earle to an extent. You can't expect people to tackle without getting the helmet into the body sometimes, even with perfect form. I also agree that we need to reduce the frequency of concussions. I see brain injured patients almost every day at work, and it's much harder to successfully treat people for mental health issues when they have a history of brain injury. And for those of you who have debated this issue, ANY concussion is considered a mild traumatic brain injury. Whether or not you have residual deficits from mTBI is another issue.
    I've actually had several concussions, the worst when I was 15. I don't think I have any issues, but how would I know? BTW, here is the moment of impact posted on another site. It appears to be an amateur pic...


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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by BayouBama75 View Post
    I thought helmet to helmet was only a penalty on defenseless player. Running backs and blocking are allowed H-H contact. Once Murrary moved towards the ball carrier he was no longer a defenseless player unless there is some rule that say QBs are always defenseless.

    In Aaron Murray's defense... It wasn't so much that he was defenseless,
    as much as he was clueless.

    Murray put himself in a bad spot by chasing after the play, and Dial reacted with
    heavy contact.
    The TV morons... Danielson and Lindquist seem to get it wrong more often than not.
    They couldn't admit they were mistaken, so they started the crap that Dial should be suspended for the hit.
    Vern & Gary are the ones who should have earned a suspension,
    they allowed their bias to get in the way of analysis and calling the game.
    Vern & Gary seem to always get it wrong when Alabama is playing...
    Morons like this inserting themselves into the game is wrong on so many different levels,
    Last edited by Ole Man Dan; December 14th, 2012 at 12:55 PM. Reason: format

  9. #34
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    Actually, from Marty's post from the interview with Shaw on Smashmouth, it appears you are correct. What still bothers me about the helmet to helmet is how on earth a defender can possibly avoid it when he's 6" taller. How can he get low enough to avoid it without going dangerously low? It's a conundrum without an answer in the rulebook...
    That was my point about the Dial on Murray hit all along. He clearly didn't lead with his head but the height differential made some helmet contact probable to even inevitable. The only way Dial was going to effectively avoid some helmet contact in that matchup was to launch his body into Murray's torso which is a dirtier block in my opinion. If Dial goes low, you are talking about the possibility of Murray having one or both of his knees shredded.

  10. #35
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    I've actually had several concussions, the worst when I was 15. I don't think I have any issues, but how would I know?
    It really is hard to know if you have issues from TBI. People who become cognitively limited often don't realize the difference - it just seems like everything is harder. Same goes for mood issues from TBI.

    It's also hard to predict who will have what effects, and for how long. As a general rule, if someone was to sustain a concussion with brief loss of consciousness, it was the first brain injury sustained, and they began having difficulties following that concussion, the vast majority of difficulties should resolve within 1 year. When you combine mental health issues to that concussion, things get very confusing. Brain injury can cause or exacerbate mental illness and mental illness can complicate resolution of likely TBI residuals. Same goes for multiple concussions, although most of the time changes should have developed within a few weeks of the concussion, although some difficulties may be hard to spot until years down the road. For example, if you have repeated brain injuries with only mild memory loss, will it only become more obvious how much damage it did after you grow older and your brain naturally degenerates as well?

  11. #36
    BamaNation All-American Al A Bama's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Looks like they made the correct decision.

    When they mentioned both teams, was UGA's hit on A. J. or the finger/s in Millner's eyes under consideration?
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  12. #37
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by Al A Bama View Post
    Looks like they made the correct decision.

    When they mentioned both teams, was UGA's hit on A. J. or the finger/s in Millner's eyes under consideration?
    That's a really good point. I don't imagine they presented UA's proposed punishment to UGA for them to vet. So of all the plays on the UGA side that could have resulted in discipline, I would bet on the eye-poke.

  13. #38
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    Quote Originally Posted by DocCrimson View Post
    It really is hard to know if you have issues from TBI. People who become cognitively limited often don't realize the difference - it just seems like everything is harder. Same goes for mood issues from TBI.

    It's also hard to predict who will have what effects, and for how long. As a general rule, if someone was to sustain a concussion with brief loss of consciousness, it was the first brain injury sustained, and they began having difficulties following that concussion, the vast majority of difficulties should resolve within 1 year. When you combine mental health issues to that concussion, things get very confusing. Brain injury can cause or exacerbate mental illness and mental illness can complicate resolution of likely TBI residuals. Same goes for multiple concussions, although most of the time changes should have developed within a few weeks of the concussion, although some difficulties may be hard to spot until years down the road. For example, if you have repeated brain injuries with only mild memory loss, will it only become more obvious how much damage it did after you grow older and your brain naturally degenerates as well?
    If I told you my IQ you wouldn't believe me. Memory? I've been fluent in more than one language for many years, and read a number, but I did manage to learn conversational Norwegian at 68. (I'm 73 now, or will be Sunday). With the first concussion, I didn't regain full consciousness until the next day. The other three were milder, with my only being dazed (and with enormous headaches)...
    "The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity. - Ellen Parr"

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  14. #39
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    Re: Scarbinsky reporting that the SEC is not going to suspend Dial..

    I thought it was 3/1 he played. Thread "thread" plays out the strong points and also the league is NOT going to put the attention on themselves by suspending before a game for the ages if the don;t have to. Normally he would have been suspend due to the lobying, which I can't stand, but they are not going to cave in before a game like Bama vs ND.

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