SCOTUS announces Prop 8 and DOMA rulings this morning...

So will they drop the equality bomb? Either way they decide is sure to spark outrage and elation in equal parts... which I suspect is why they're waiting until the final day of the term to release these decisions; it gives them a chance to escape before the firestorm.

For those interested, the best livestream can be found at http://www.scotusblog.com/ starting at 9am EST (decisions released at 10am).

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

cuda.1973 said:

Part of VRA goes down, win for Shelby Co.

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It's almost as if multiple events of significance can happen at once.

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

My take: DOMA is almost certainly going down. And while dismissing Prop 8 would be the safe move, I actually don't think they'll do that. But whether or not they throw it out, I expect gays in CA to reclaim the right to marry tomorrow. The big question, if they do issue one, is how limited their ruling will be.

I came across an interesting way of framing the debate that I haven't seen aired on this forum yet: maybe the problem isn't discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation but rather on the basis of gender.

Slate: What Is Anthony Kennedy Thinking?

The gender-discrimination argument is not complicated. Imagine Alice applies for a license to marry Charlie and it is granted. Yet if Bob applied for a license to marry Charlie, he would be denied. The crucial difference between Alice and Bob is, of course, their gender—not their sexual orientation. In fact, as we all know, homosexuals have long been free to marry members of the opposite sex. Thus, Kennedy is wrestling with the possibility that Bob is being discriminated against because he is a man and not because he is gay. And, if so, should the court apply the same level of heightened protection it traditionally applies whenever the government treats men and women differently?

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Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

Tide1986 said:

Interesting argument, but Kennedy of course should consider why a gender discrimination argument is applicable to marriage but not applicable to other practices that practically separate the sexes.

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Seeing how marriage has long been held to be a fundamental right, Kennedy may indeed feel inclined to examine the issue with heightened scrutiny.

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

bamacon said:

I wonder why gay marriage proponents lose every time it is on the ballot (even in CA) if it is Soooooo popular?

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Um, I'd check in on Maine, Maryland, and Washington if I were you. Times are a-changin', my friend.

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

BamainBoston said:

I think you are setting yourself up for disappointment. And don't forget, if DOMA goes down because it is the states--and not the feds--who get to define marriage, that is not necessarily a victory for your cause.

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It's true that they could knock down DOMA on the grounds of state's rights and uphold Prop 8 with the same argument. That might be the cleanest way out of this question. I feel this would sidestep several fundamental issues, and it's obviously a road I hope they avoid.

It gets trickier if they try to strike down Prop 8 and restrict the effects to California alone. The Ninth Circuit basically said that it violated equal protection for a state to extend marriage rights to one group, only to later take them away. But the Court didn't seem moved by that reasoning during oral arguments, so I don't expect them to concur with the Ninth. Now, they could throw out the case and let the Ninth's decision stand.

Or... there's a slim chance they could issue a landmark decision a la Loving v. Virginia ruling that it's unconstitutional for states to deny equal marriage rights to gays and lesbians. Given the current makeup of the court, I'm not optimistic about this. But for the next 13 hours, I will remain hopeful.

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

DOMA ruled unconstitutional (5-4) on equal protection grounds.

DOMA singles out a class of persons deemed by a State entitled to recognition and protection to enhance their own liberty. It imposes a disability on the class by refusing to acknowledge a status the State finds to be dignified and proper. DOMA instructs all federal officials, and indeed all persons with whom same-sex couples interact, including their own children, that their marriage is less worthy than the marriages of others. The federal statute is invalid, for no legitimate purpose overcomes the purpose and effect to disparage and to injure those whom the State, by its marriage laws, sought to protect in personhood and dignity.

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Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

Looks like they vacated the Ninth's decision too. Does that mean it falls back to the CA court's ruling (against Prop 8)?

Re: SCOTUS to announce Prop 8 and DOMA rulings tomorrow

BamaPokerplayer said:

So what just happened? The court ruled that if a state allows gay marriage, that those couples can receive federal benefits?

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Yep. And CA gets its gay marriage back.

Kennedy and I agree that punting Perry back down is weaksauce. Today ends up being a significant step towards equality, though not the bold leap many were hoping for. Either way, it's Pride week in SF, and there will be much celebration.