Question: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCAA?

bamatex82

All-SEC
Oct 5, 2001
1,769
211
182
Greenville, TX
"find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCAA?

The talking heads on ESPN keep spouting the line that the NCAA is trying to find the money before they suspend Manziel. NCAA doesn't have legal standing to cause someone to "show them the money." Historically all the NCAA has to do is to BELIEVE that money was transferred based on the evidence. They have levied sanctions on several occasions with less evidence than what they have on Manziel. So, what are they waiting on with Manziel?

Personally, I think they don't want to kill the golden goose. I think the NCAA are the ones feeding the media the mantra "find the money = suspension, but not until then." What gets me is why the media has not called them out on their hypocrisy. Oh, I forget! The media doesn't want to kill the golden goose, either, so they willing spread this nonsense, too. :mad:

I agree with Dez Bryant. He should get mad if Manziel is not suspended.
 

Snuffy Smith

All-American
Sep 12, 2012
3,539
641
162
Huntsville, AL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

I did see in one of the ESPN articles that stated regardless of whether or not there was money that changed hands IF he knowingly signed articles that were going to be sold or used for a 3rd party to profit then that is a violation. I am sure they could come up with a way for that to carry only say a 2 game suspension (wink, wink) - sorry there have been so many that I really don't know which one it was so I don't have the link.
 

davefrat

Hall of Fame
Jun 4, 2002
5,172
3,893
282
Hopewell, VA
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

The talking heads on ESPN keep spouting the line that the NCAA is trying to find the money before they suspend Manziel. NCAA doesn't have legal standing to cause someone to "show them the money." Historically all the NCAA has to do is to BELIEVE that money was transferred based on the evidence. They have levied sanctions on several occasions with less evidence than what they have on Manziel. So, what are they waiting on with Manziel?

Personally, I think they don't want to kill the golden goose. I think the NCAA are the ones feeding the media the mantra "find the money = suspension, but not until then." What gets me is why the media has not called them out on their hypocrisy. Oh, I forget! The media doesn't want to kill the golden goose, either, so they willing spread this nonsense, too. :mad:

I agree with Dez Bryant. He should get mad if Manziel is not suspended.
I saw it posted somewhere that even signing an agreement such as the one manziel was witnessed signing is an ncaa violation. anyone more in the know have info on that?

that said, of course the ncaa doesn't want to suspend johnny hangover.

if he plays against us and we totally destroy aTm, it wouldn't surprise me to see the ncaa then miraculously suspend him for something they uncovered.

bottom line is the ncaa is about as trustworthy as whitey bulger at this point.
 

Snuffy Smith

All-American
Sep 12, 2012
3,539
641
162
Huntsville, AL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

Found it... http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_...ny-manziel-signed-two-more-sessions-sourcesIt is not known where in its investigation the NCAA is, as both the NCAA and Texas A&M cited policy in declining comment. If the NCAA finds that Manziel has violated Bylaw 12.5.2.1 -- accepting money for promoting or advertising the commercial sale of a product or service -- he could be ruled ineligible. Even without proof of Manziel handling cash, he still could be found in violation of NCAA Bylaw 12.5.2.2. That bylaw requires a student-athlete to make every effort to stop the sale of products featuring his or her likeness.
 

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
10,615
4,540
187
44
kraizy.art
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

Johnny is clearly in violation of NCAA rules. There is ample precedent for the NCAA acting based on what is currently public known.

The thing that people are trying to wrap their mind around, is how the post Cam Newton NCAA will act. We all knew up until that case, that if a family member shopped a player, he was acting as an agent, and the player was no longer an amateur. It was something we had trouble wrapping our minds around, but the Means cased forced a certain reality upon us. The player could have no knowledge, and the team could have no involvement, and it still could be a violation.

The Cam Newton case established a whole new set of rules, a new standard of proof, that basically said if you can't show me where the money is, no rule was broken. It's kind of like saying you might have proof (witnesses) of an assault, but if you can't show a dead body you don't even have an assault case. This is the logic being applied here.

The case against Johnny might be stronger than the case against Cam (although we all know that Cam wasn't the only one at Auburn in violation of NCAA rules). It is abundantly clear what he did, there are witnesses, there are thousands of autographs, and there's a rule which clearly states the player does not have to receive money. But, it's a fool me twice situation. Cam's dad shopped him, he said he shopped him. Cam said his dad is the reason he went to Auburn. Cam's dad was his agent. We're forced trying to learn new interpretations, and the new interpretation is that if you can't prove money exchanged hands, there's nothing to see here. Unless of course it's textbooks...
 

jthomas666

Hall of Fame
Aug 14, 2002
22,587
9,642
287
60
Birmingham & Warner Robins
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

Johnny is clearly in violation of NCAA rules. There is ample precedent for the NCAA acting based on what is currently public known.
. . .

The case against Johnny might be stronger than the case against Cam (although we all know that Cam wasn't the only one at Auburn in violation of NCAA rules). It is abundantly clear what he did, there are witnesses, there are thousands of autographs, and there's a rule which clearly states the player does not have to receive money. But, it's a fool me twice situation. Cam's dad shopped him, he said he shopped him. Cam said his dad is the reason he went to Auburn. Cam's dad was his agent. We're forced trying to learn new interpretations, and the new interpretation is that if you can't prove money exchanged hands, there's nothing to see here. Unless of course it's textbooks...
I agree that it's an open and shut case based on the evidence we have. There's no money trail, perhaps, but there is more than sufficient evidence to establish that a deal was made for JM to receive money for autographs. End of story.

The real elephant in the room, though, is the Ed O'Bannon case. The Manziel situation is the other side of that legal issue, and the LAST thing the NCAA wants to do is find them stuck between two lawsuits, particularly when losing both suits would effectively end the NCAA.
 

Ole Man Dan

Hall of Fame
Apr 21, 2008
8,982
3,421
187
Gadsden, Al.
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

I saw it posted somewhere that even signing an agreement such as the one manziel was witnessed signing is an ncaa violation. anyone more in the know have info on that?

that said, of course the ncaa doesn't want to suspend johnny hangover.

if he plays against us and we totally destroy aTm, it wouldn't surprise me to see the ncaa then miraculously suspend him for something they uncovered.

bottom line is the ncaa is about as trustworthy as whitey bulger at this point.
Love the reference to Whitey... Like JFF Whitey did as he pleased.
 

Snuffy Smith

All-American
Sep 12, 2012
3,539
641
162
Huntsville, AL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

I agree that it's an open and shut case based on the evidence we have. There's no money trail, perhaps, but there is more than sufficient evidence to establish that a deal was made for JM to receive money for autographs. End of story.The real elephant in the room, though, is the Ed O'Bannon case. The Manziel situation is the other side of that legal issue, and the LAST thing the NCAA wants to do is find them stuck between two lawsuits, particularly when losing both suits would effectively end the NCAA.
Not a lawyer - don't even play one on TV, but I really don't understand how that law suit could have any legs. Maybe one of our legal eagles can enlighten us. The NCAA and member institutions do not enslave these kids. They and their parents sign scholarship agreements with them that provide them education and other benefits which are worth a minimum of $20K a year - probably 5X that for programs like Stanford. They know going in what they are signing up for and gladly sign up for it.
 

FAYETTE4BAMA

1st Team
May 15, 2003
652
4
0
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

It's all behind us now. Les and the LSU team voted that JFF can play against Bama. Nothing to see here.....move along!:cool2:
 

bamaslammer

All-American
Jan 8, 2003
4,440
1,104
282
Argo, AL, St Clair
www.kirkwoodhouse.com
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

College football is driven by TV money, TV money is driven by big stars in big games, Nobody is bigger than Manzel right now. The TV people won't let the NCAA suspend him unless proof of payment becomes very public. In other words the NCAA isn't even really looking for it. It would take an independant news agency finding it to sell newspapers or clicks. Once public the NCAA would like have it's hand forced but nothing short of that will result in a suspension.

This may sound like college football is out of control, it's not entirely, but their are always a select few players that are deemed "too big to fail". Just so you know there is a clause in there, There never has been nor ever will be any Alabama player that is to big to fail.
 

davefrat

Hall of Fame
Jun 4, 2002
5,172
3,893
282
Hopewell, VA
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

College football is driven by TV money, TV money is driven by big stars in big games, Nobody is bigger than Manzel right now. The TV people won't let the NCAA suspend him unless proof of payment becomes very public. In other words the NCAA isn't even really looking for it. It would take an independant news agency finding it to sell newspapers or clicks. Once public the NCAA would like have it's hand forced but nothing short of that will result in a suspension.

This may sound like college football is out of control, it's not entirely, but their are always a select few players that are deemed "too big to fail". Just so you know there is a clause in there, There never has been nor ever will be any Alabama player that is to big to fail.
actually, if a bama star were caught up in this the media would eat it up because they could run endless stories throughout the year about how 1) bama is a dirty cheating dung heap 2) saban is a phony and 3) how the ncaa enslaves college athletes.

sure, the stories would almost be completely at odds with each other, but that wouldn't make any difference.
 

TheRealPokeChop

Hall of Fame
Jul 7, 2010
5,970
3,149
187
Hueytown, Al
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

The NCAA is unpredictable we got hammered with no link to money but the NCAA hasn't exactly stuck to that over the last few high profile investigations like the newton case. So im not sure the "NCAA doesn't need proof" thing is as valid as it was just a decade ago.
 

Snuffy Smith

All-American
Sep 12, 2012
3,539
641
162
Huntsville, AL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

Does anyone remember in the OSU deal a couple of years ago, before the faxes etc. came out, did all of the players actually come out and admit their guilt in the whole tattoo-gate incident or did the NCAA just take the word of the tattoo artist and the fact that the players did did have tattoos as all the evidence it needed to suspend them for 5 games?
 

Florida Tom

All-American
Aug 15, 2011
4,449
0
0
Tampa, FL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

It's simply everyone now can use the Cam Clause, they should have thought about that monster before creating it, things like this & the Obannon case may just be the NCAA's downfall
 

GP for Bama

All-American
Feb 3, 2011
4,328
1,090
187
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

Circumstantial evidence carries weight with the NCAA. 4500 autographs with 6 brokers implies payment. Responsibility should be on Johnny and A&M to prove otherwise. NCAA can't subpoena but they can REQUIRE that schools and athletes cooperate. They could tell Johnny to get these brokers to talk to them to support his story. Also if they threaten a lawsuit, then the NCAA could easily call that bluff. Going to court would suddenly give the NCAA power to question all involved parties under oath.
 

im4uainva

All-SEC
Jul 3, 2011
1,080
39
67
Charlottesville, Va
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

I wouldn't be surprised if nothing is done until after the Bama game. Bama wins and then the NCAA comes down on Manziel (because A&M's shot at the NC is most likely shot). A&M wins, then nothing will be done unless A&M loses down the road. Money talks, and if A&M and JFF is still in the running...he's Big Money Gripp.
 
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

I wouldn't be surprised if nothing is done until after the Bama game. Bama wins and then the NCAA comes down on Manziel (because A&M's shot at the NC is most likely shot). A&M wins, then nothing will be done unless A&M loses down the road. Money talks, and if A&M and JFF is still in the running...he's Big Money Gripp.
That sounds eerily familiar...
 

WMack4Bama

Administrator
Staff member
Nov 7, 2008
11,483
1,219
232
Tuscaloosa, AL
Re: "find the money=suspension, but not until then" Why is media not challanging NCA

That sounds eerily familiar...
Some differences though.

Among them, this is breaking before the season starts as opposed to in the middle of an undefeated season. TAMU is bigger than Manziel and ultimately have to do what's in the best interest of them. So, it wouldn't shock me if they sit him until the investigation wraps up (and I wouldn't be the least bit shocked if it wrapped up around 9/11/13 or so). While they're a much better team with him, they can win a lot of games without him. Can't say the same for that other team you alluded to.
 

New Posts

Latest threads

TideFans.shop : 2024 Madness!

TideFans.shop - Get YOUR Bama Gear HERE!”></a>
<br />

<!--/ END TideFans.shop & item link \-->
<p style= Purchases made through our TideFans.shop and Amazon.com links may result in a commission being paid to TideFans.