Possession through the Catch

tide96

All-SEC
Oct 4, 2005
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So I finally got around to watch the Oklahoma game again, as I was there in person.

I've got a question about the second Oklahoma touchdown. (it occurs at the 2 minute mark in the 1st qr. There are many clips of it on youtube, but I won't link them here as some mods don't like that)

Was that play ruled a touchdown correctly? It is clear that he catch the ball and broke the plane, but in the NFL, they would say that this should be ruled an incomplete pass as the receiver lost the ball when when the player went to the ground. What this really comes down to is: does college have the same rule as the NFL when it comes to maintaining possession through the catch? Is this not the rule in college?

I'm not trying to say this cost us the game and we should have won, I'm just always interested in the very technical differences between the college and pro game.
 

day-day

Hall of Fame
Jan 2, 2005
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Just my uneducated opinion: The receiver took two steps while he had possession of the ball so I don't think it matters what happened after he hit the ground. When the ball crossed the goal line in his possession after coming down on his feet the play was over. Looked good (for OU) to me.
 

PaulD

All-SEC
Dec 29, 2006
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I don't recall the play now (I'm trying to forget that game), but the NCAA rule says that a receiver must maintain control of the ball while going to the ground while completing the catch.

The NFL rule is a little different. In the NFL, "A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
(c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.)."

I remember an announcer in one of this weekend's game referring to the "act common to the game" point.
 

PaulD

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Just my uneducated opinion: The receiver took two steps while he had possession of the ball so I don't think it matters what happened after he hit the ground. When the ball crossed the goal line in his possession after coming down on his feet the play was over. Looked good (for OU) to me.
In that case, the catch would have been completed before he hit the ground.
 

glasscutter256

All-American
Jan 31, 2009
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I don't recall the play now (I'm trying to forget that game), but the NCAA rule says that a receiver must maintain control of the ball while going to the ground while completing the catch.

The NFL rule is a little different. In the NFL, "A forward pass is complete (by the offense) or intercepted (by the defense) if a player, who is inbounds:
(a) secures control of the ball in his hands or arms prior to the ball touching the ground; and
(b) touches the ground inbounds with both feet or with any part of his body other than his hands; and
(c) maintains control of the ball long enough, after (a) and (b) have been fulfilled, to enable him to perform any act common to the game (i.e., maintaining control long enough to pitch it, pass it, advance with it, or avoid or ward off an opponent, etc.)."

I remember an announcer in one of this weekend's game referring to the "act common to the game" point.

Can we have the non-lawyer translation?
 

PaulD

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Can we have the non-lawyer translation?
How did you know what I do for a living? ;)

I'm not sure that there's much practical difference. The NFL seems to require a bit longer of possession than the NCAA, but I suspect that (except for the 2 foot vs. 1 foot rule), a catch which is good in college will normally be good in the NFL and vice-versa. In either case, although the ground can't cause a fumble, it can clearly cause an incomplete pass.
 

BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
Apr 1, 2004
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I could be wrong, but I think the rule applies in both college and the NFL that when the ball breaks the plane of the endzone that it is a touchdown on the play in question.

He already had possessed the ball and then reached out to break the plane.
 

PaulD

All-SEC
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I could be wrong, but I think the rule applies in both college and the NFL that when the ball breaks the plane of the endzone that it is a touchdown on the play in question.

He already had possessed the ball and then reached out to break the plane.
If he caught the ball in the field of play, had possession and broke the plane maintaining possession, it was a valid TD.
 

BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
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If he caught the ball in the field of play, had possession and broke the plane maintaining possession, it was a valid TD.
And, even if he lost control of the ball "after" he broke the plane it is still a td. Again, on the play in question where he caught the ball and took a couple of steps and then reached out to break the plane and did so and then lost the ball.. it would be a td in college and the NFL IMO.
 

tide96

All-SEC
Oct 4, 2005
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Not a catch:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqAuFs6Deko


Not a catch:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/detroit-lions/0ap2000000240535/Johnson-s-touchdown-overturned

Catch:
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000240906/Cruz-18-yard-TD-catch

Note that the NFL has these notes to the rule. The NCAA might not:

Rule 12-2-7 has the process:


Item 2: … A player must have complete control of the ball and have both feet or any other part of his body, other than his hands, completely on the ground inbounds, and maintain control of the ball long enough to perform any act common to the game. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any other part of his body to the ground, there is no possession. This rule applies in the field of play and in the end zone. …


Note 1: A player who goes to the ground in the process of attempting to secure possession of a loose ball (with or without contact by an opponent) must maintain control of the ball after he touches the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, there is no possession. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, it is a catch, interception, or recovery.
 
Last edited:

champions77

Scout Team
Sep 6, 2006
149
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If catching a pass in the end zone, you must complete the play all the way to the ground to have a valid catch. In a play outside of the end zone, having possession at the time the ball crosses the plane of the end zone, it is a touchdown at that moment.
 

bamafaninOhiO

All-American
May 11, 2010
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqAuFs6Deko

This is not the greatest video in the world, but this is what I'm talking about.

Note that the NFL has these notes to the rule. The NCAA might not:

Rule 12-2-7 has the process:


Item 2: … A player must have complete control of the ball and have both feet or any other part of his body, other than his hands, completely on the ground inbounds, and maintain control of the ball long enough to perform any act common to the game. If the player loses the ball while simultaneously touching both feet or any other part of his body to the ground, there is no possession. This rule applies in the field of play and in the end zone. …


Note 1: A player who goes to the ground in the process of attempting to secure possession of a loose ball (with or without contact by an opponent) must maintain control of the ball after he touches the ground, whether in the field of play or the end zone. If he loses control of the ball, and the ball touches the ground before he regains control, there is no possession. If he regains control prior to the ball touching the ground, it is a catch, interception, or recovery.

He had possesion of the ball for two steps (possesion of the ball established), broke the plane of the goal line (a touchdown with possesion and control of the ball), and then lost control of the ball as he hit the ground (ground cannot cause a fumble).

The correct call of TD was made, IMO.
 

colbysullivan

Hall of Fame
Dec 12, 2007
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He had possesion of the ball for two steps (possesion of the ball established), broke the plane of the goal line (a touchdown with possesion and control of the ball), and then lost control of the ball as he hit the ground (ground cannot cause a fumble).

The correct call of TD was made, IMO.
That part is irrelevant as the play was over the instant the ball crossed the plane.
 

BamaMoon

Hall of Fame
Apr 1, 2004
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Boone, NC
Then NFL has a more strict definition of a catch than college. The NFL to me goes a little too far. Even with a clean catch and control if the ball even slips in his fingers when impacting the ground they can void the catch.
Have always thought the same thing...too strict!
 

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