Study concludes shuttered football program at UAB made money

Mamacalled

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What the...? Where does this crap keep coming from?

By the way, when you guys are done with that broad brush, King Kong needs it back.
It comes from the fact that UAB supporters raised enough to run the operations program for five years, with the help of the city putting in 2.5 million. That still doesn't cover expenses to build or maintain a football stadium. So 2.5 million is paid by taxpayers who will not attend a game, other money generated by forcing students to pay an extra fee even though many have said that they do not want to pay and after five years who will pick up the tab then? That is where it comes from.
 
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bamahippie

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It comes from the fact that UAB supporters raised enough to run the operations program for five years, with the help of the city putting in 2.5 million. That still doesn't cover expenses to build or maintain a football stadium. So 2.5 million is paid by taxpayers who will not attend a game, other money generated by forcing students to pay an extra fee even though many have said that they do not want to pay and after five years who will pick up the tab then? That is where it comes from.
Then comments need to directed at the main source of the problem. Yep, UAB supporters, they're the problem. No one, administratively has done a thing in years, until just recently, to better the program. And therefore the product on the field. And they still had a ways to go in facilities. <in my best drunken slur> And, it's those entitled, tin-foil-hat-wearing, BOT-hatin', Watts-insulting UAB supporters. All of 'em! Everyone! </slur>

I guess I'll just stick to all things Bama here on TideFans, because all of these lovely opinions of UAB are driving me nuts LOL. Everyone has a opinion.

Please stop opening UAB-related threads. For the love of Pete (whoever Pete is).

Roll Tide anyway...
 

4Q Basket Case

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It comes from the fact that UAB supporters raised enough to run the operations program for five years, with the help of the city putting in 2.5 million. That still doesn't cover expenses to build or maintain a football stadium. So 2.5 million is paid by taxpayers who will not attend a game, other money generated by forcing students to pay an extra fee even though many have said that they do not want to pay and after five years who will pick up the tab then? That is where it comes from.
You're being charitable, MC. They raised enough to run the marginal out of pocket costs of maintaining the program for a limited period of time, What they raised doesn't cover:
-- Tuition, room, board, fees, and cost of attendance for 85 scholarship athletes.
-- Depreciation on the current infrastructure.
-- Capex necessary to bring facilities up to FBS standards.
-- Maintenance capex necessary to keep those facilities at current standard.
-- Ongoing capex necessary to keep the new facilities improving on a par with FBS standard as that will evolve overtime.

Note that the University of Alabama's program funds all of that, either by cutting a check to the University (tuition, room, board, etc.), paying cash, or issuing debt for which the University as a whole has no obligation.

A small but loud minority, having gained the attention of a news media that has no comprehension of the numbers involved, and no culpability for advocating an unsustainable position, can hope only to shout down the facts with emotion.
 
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Tide1986

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Nov 22, 2008
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What the...? Where does this crap keep coming from?

By the way, when you guys are done with that broad brush, King Kong needs it back.
Curious question, has the UAB athletic department been running a deficit? If so, where does the money come from to cover the deficit?

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...lone-in-losing-money-for-athletic-departments

UAB reported to the NCAA that 64 percent of its 2012-13 athletic revenue came from subsidies, which are defined as student fees, direct and indirect institutional support, and state money.
Institutional support and state money sound like other [non-UAB] people's money.

And on another topic (SIAP), there's an interesting FAQ on UAB's website:

http://www.uab.edu/athleticsplan/faq

CERTAIN UAB ALUMNI AND OTHERS ARE STATING THAT THEY OFFERED TO FUND FOOTBALL AND THAT THE ADMINISTRATION REJECTED THESE OFFERS. IS THAT TRUE?

Unfortunately, suggestions that there existed sufficient philanthropic and community support to maintain football are simply not true. To be clear, we did not turn down a single donation, nor did we receive tangible gifts or written commitments.

UAB invested roughly $1 million to upgrade the football locker room and practice facilities after Coach Clark was hired. We also attempted to raise $1 million needed from private donors for an artificial turf practice field requested by Coach Clark. We could not secure that level of support from leadership of the not‐yet‐formed UAB Football Foundation, let alone the $50 million that would be required to sustain football over the next five years. This was an extremely difficult decision that no one wanted to have to make. If there was a realistic economic solution, we would not have discontinued these programs.

WHAT ABOUT SATURDAY’S ESPN GAMEDAY STORY WHICH CONTENDED THAT UAB OFFICIALS NEVER MET WITH TOP DONORS AND REJECTED A $5 MILLION CERTIFIED CHECK? IS THAT ACCURATE?

We understand that some of our alumni are frustrated with this decision, but making false statements designed to further inflame the situation is extremely unfair to everyone, including the players. We met with our biggest donors before we made this decision, and also studied past and current giving. The financial support was simply not there. A $5 million certified check was not presented to us, let alone a commitment for the $50 million that would be required to sustain football over the next five years.

IS THE COST OF KEEPING FOOTBALL AS MUCH AS IT HAS BEEN MADE OUT TO BE?

Yes. Our financial team reviewed and carefully vetted the planning assumptions and
extensive background data and calculations used to populate the CarrSports report. In their analysis, Carr used data from UAB Athletics, Conference USA and the NCAA, as well as relevant assumptions regarding the changing NCAA landscape and the current athletic climate at UAB.

UAB Football has consistently operated at a deficit, and there is no question that costs of fielding a competitive football team are increasing with cost-of-attendance, nutrition and other operating expenses coming as a result of the changing NCAA landscape. In addition, UAB football would require significant investments in facilities to compete with peer institutions.

While interpretations of the Carr analysis can be debated, we are confident after our review that the big picture remains the same: to maximize our competitive potential moving forward and improve the national prominence of our Athletic Department, UAB should reallocate UAB’s significant subsidy from football to other athletic programs.
 
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russtang

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You're being charitable, MC. They raised enough to run the marginal out of pocket costs of maintaining the program for a limited period of time, What they raised doesn't cover:
-- Tuition, room, board, fees, and cost of attendance for 85 scholarship athletes.
-- Depreciation on the current infrastructure.
-- Capex necessary to bring facilities up to FBS standards.
-- Maintenance capex necessary to keep those facilities at current standard.
-- Ongoing capex necessary to keep the new facilities improving on a par with FBS standard as that will evolve overtime.

Note that the University of Alabama's program funds all of that, either by cutting a check to the University (tuition, room, board, etc.), paying cash, or issuing debt for which the University as a whole has no obligation.

A small but loud minority, having gained the attention of a news media that has no comprehension of the numbers involved, and no culpability for advocating an unsustainable position, can hope only to shout down the facts with emotion.
Curious question, has the UAB athletic department been running a deficit? If so, where does the money come from to cover the deficit?

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefoo...lone-in-losing-money-for-athletic-departments



Institutional support and state money sound like other [non-UAB] people's money.

And on another topic (SIAP), there's an interesting FAQ on UAB's website:

http://www.uab.edu/athleticsplan/faq

Great info I was going to try to remind people of.

Even if the few wealthy supporters followed through with their "promises" and "pledges" which they are not in any way required to do, it was just enough to bring it back to where it was.
What most people fail to embrace is one of the main reasons it was shuttered was that the program needed an additional 5 million+ per year to remain competitive and keep to NCAA standards.

Most people are still arguing about whether it did or didn't lose money. It most certainly did lose money. Period.

The simple fact is there is not enough support to field a D1 UAB football program.
Maybe they could support an FSC or division 2 level team. I don't know but I highly doubt it.

What gets me is how the UAB supporters take it as a personal insult that most people agree with the fact that it was shuttered and should have been many years ago.

The "backlash" is generated by the media and a few politicians along with the few UAB faithful.
 

Crimson1967

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Nov 22, 2011
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If UAB is dead, they will be kicked out of C-USA. So they will need a replacement and a likely candidate is Krazy's future alma mater. That would cause them to spend his tuition and tax money on Sun Belt exit fees and entry fees into C-USA. It will probably cost more to be in a bigger league, not to mention needing to upgrade facilities.

And where will the Sun Belt turn to replace USA? They may look right up I-20 at Jax State and keep our state's FBS count at five.

Be careful what you wish for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

81usaf92

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Apr 26, 2008
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If UAB is dead, they will be kicked out of C-USA. So they will need a replacement and a likely candidate is Krazy's future alma mater. That would cause them to spend his tuition and tax money on Sun Belt exit fees and entry fees into C-USA. It will probably cost more to be in a bigger league, not to mention needing to upgrade facilities.

And where will the Sun Belt turn to replace USA? They may look right up I-20 at Jax State and keep our state's FBS count at five.

Be careful what you wish for.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Conference USA probably would be a better fit for USA. I think they are ok at Ladd just need some upgrades. Mobile is probably more willing and capable to support USA than Birmingham was with uab.
 

KrAzY3

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I totally agree with the bolded. And I only take offense to the next part, if "they" includes me.
I'll try to layout my take on this while staying within bounds of the football forum.

A MLB, NBA, or NFL franchise costs hundreds of millions of dollars now. That's just the cost of entry, that doesn't address it being financially viable. What I believe we have, at pretty much any FBS program in the state not named Alabama or Auburn is the case of a powerful few hijacking athletic departments to feed their own desires and ambitions.

Think about it, I'm sure there's meetings on occasion somewhere, with politicians, university administrators, and private businessmen. The politicians are allocating taxpayer funds or facilities (in Mobile and Birmingham for example), the university personnel are allocating university funds, and the private businessmen get to participate in the process without the need to actually carry the financial burden of a private entity. They're indulged with participating in something that's in essence, at it's core funded by people who have no interest in the product itself. It's corrupt, it's disturbing, and it's just a tiny symptom of what's wrong at universities all over the country. It's why taxes have to keep going up, it's why tuition has to keep going up, it's because all these pet projects are funded without any real justification.

That does not place the blame at your feet though, that places the blame at those powerful few who are corrupt enough, and willing to take from others to indulge their own desires. South Alabama grew into what it is without a football team. UAB grew into what it was without a football team. They allow well connected people to play at big time sports. I do blame them, it does bother me, and I'm more than a little annoyed that these people can reach into my pocket because they want to play Mark Cuban or Mal Moore.
 
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bamahippie

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I'll try to layout my take on this while staying within bounds of the football forum.

A MLB, NBA, or NFL franchise costs hundreds of millions of dollars now. That's just the cost of entry, that doesn't address it being financially viable. What I believe we have, at pretty much any FBS program in the state not named Alabama or Auburn is the case of a powerful few hijacking athletic departments to feed their own desires and ambitions.

Think about it, I'm sure there's meetings on occasion somewhere, with politicians, university administrators, and private businessmen. The politicians are allocating taxpayer funds or facilities (in Mobile and Birmingham for example), the university personnel are allocating university funds, and the private businessmen get to participate in the process without the need to actually carry the financial burden of a private entity. They're indulged with participating in something that's in essence, at it's core funded by people who have no interest in the product itself. It's corrupt, it's disturbing, and it's just a tiny symptom of what's wrong at universities all over the country. It's why taxes have to keep going up, it's why tuition has to keep going up, it's because all these pet projects are funded without any real justification.

That does not place the blame at your feet though, that places the blame at those powerful few who are corrupt enough, and willing to take from others to indulge their own desires. South Alabama grew into what it is without a football team. UAB grew into what it was without a football team. They allow well connected people to play at big time sports. I do blame them, it does bother me, and I'm more than a little annoyed that these people can reach into my pocket because they want to play Mark Cuban or Mal Moore.
Yep, and I agree. Thanks.

I, as a supporter of Bama, and to a smaller degree, UAB, could not make sense of people pointing to the supporters with most of the blame. I have never been to a meeting with top decision-makers, from program inception, all the way to the death. Tax dollars came out of my pocket as well. But where did it go? Did I truly get to decide? Have I ever taken part in one single decision, or as a regular Joe supporter, have I ever been influential in the way the program was built, ran, and evenutally pushed off a cliff? No.

And it is not fair to point at supporters as if they had anything to do with the decisions of that trainwreck of an administration and athletic department in the last couple of decades. The fact that they had a couple of quick snippets of winning in football is commendable in itself, considering the resources that they had to deal with.

Please do not associate UAB supporters with the incompetence you see there, most especially the wasting of money. It could have been done better. Heck, it could have been done well. But don't associate the average supporter with the way it was done. Most supporters are not as upset with the fact that it got shutdown, as much as they are upset at the long history leading up to this. I have cringed at the way it has been run for a long, long time, and knew that this was only inevitable. I'm only upset at knowing the fact that competent folks could have got it going, and kept it afloat.

Those guys that were left scrambling for a home a few months ago? They deserved better. I wouldn't dare tell one of those guys, hurting as they were, that they felt "entitled" to have a program. They are the true victims, if there are any.

My two cents. Thanks for the civility, guys. Roll Tide all the way, so just excuse the little Blazer blood I have left from my B'ham days. Lots of good memories from my younger days.
 

Mamacalled

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Yep, and I agree. Thanks.

I, as a supporter of Bama, and to a smaller degree, UAB, could not make sense of people pointing to the supporters with most of the blame. I have never been to a meeting with top decision-makers, from program inception, all the way to the death. Tax dollars came out of my pocket as well. But where did it go? Did I truly get to decide? Have I ever taken part in one single decision, or as a regular Joe supporter, have I ever been influential in the way the program was built, ran, and evenutally pushed off a cliff? No.

And it is not fair to point at supporters as if they had anything to do with the decisions of that trainwreck of an administration and athletic department in the last couple of decades. The fact that they had a couple of quick snippets of winning in football is commendable in itself, considering the resources that they had to deal with.

Please do not associate UAB supporters with the incompetence you see there, most especially the wasting of money. It could have been done better. Heck, it could have been done well. But don't associate the average supporter with the way it was done. Most supporters are not as upset with the fact that it got shutdown, as much as they are upset at the long history leading up to this. I have cringed at the way it has been run for a long, long time, and knew that this was only inevitable. I'm only upset at knowing the fact that competent folks could have got it going, and kept it afloat.

Those guys that were left scrambling for a home a few months ago? They deserved better. I wouldn't dare tell one of those guys, hurting as they were, that they felt "entitled" to have a program. They are the true victims, if there are any.

My two cents. Thanks for the civility, guys. Roll Tide all the way, so just excuse the little Blazer blood I have left from my B'ham days. Lots of good memories from my younger days.
True supporters don't bother me it is the ones that only became a supporter after the decision was made. I followed UAB and would watch them the few times that they were on tv, as long as they weren't in the same time slot as Alabama. But I never donated money or went to any of their games. The fans that bother me are people who now make a big deal over it and when you ask them how many games they went to or how much money they donated and their answer is zero. They're much more of those than fans that actually paid to go to a game.
 

bamahippie

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True supporters don't bother me it is the ones that only became a supporter after the decision was made. I followed UAB and would watch them the few times that they were on tv, as long as they weren't in the same time slot as Alabama. But I never donated money or went to any of their games. The fans that bother me are people who now make a big deal over it and when you ask them how many games they went to or how much money they donated and their answer is zero. They're much more of those than fans that actually paid to go to a game.
I agree with that too. There is feigned outrage and mock disdain in both camps. There should have been enough outrage for change from "true" supporters a long, long time ago.
 

81usaf92

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Apr 26, 2008
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True supporters don't bother me it is the ones that only became a supporter after the decision was made. I followed UAB and would watch them the few times that they were on tv, as long as they weren't in the same time slot as Alabama. But I never donated money or went to any of their games. The fans that bother me are people who now make a big deal over it and when you ask them how many games they went to or how much money they donated and their answer is zero. They're much more of those than fans that actually paid to go to a game.
Well of course, but look at where all of this is coming. All the SEC fanbases that arent named aTm, Mizzou, Vandy,Kentucky, and USCe have been talking this issue up as it was UA that was threathened by UAB's success in 14. I really dont care if they disbanded it or didnt, and neither did anyone else until UA BOT name was attached. That's where the issue always goes back to in the rival fanbases minds. Here is the latest article from UGA:
http://www.al.com/opinion/index.ssf/2015/05/uab_football_first_step_in_hid.html#incart_river

Personally I think they should just make a FCS team and put it in the BJCC, and if after 10 years it makes money then think about making a campus stadium.
 

KrAzY3

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Just what I thought...............API behind all of this!
There's more to it than that, but a vast majority of the fuss has not come from UAB fans at all, and I'd surmise even with any pledged funds that might be the case. I mean, we've seen the "rallies", with a handful of people.

But, some groups have come together on this and kind of converged for the sake of their own interest. For example, ESPN has run this story on their front page several times, I think at least four times. Now, how many times did UAB football make the ESPN front page before that? How many times was their program relevant enough to mention? Furthermore, name the last time any football program closing down that was this sort of a story?

So, what we have is a lot of people with ulterior motives deciding they care, and a program that ultimately has more interest from non-fans than fans...
 

RTR91

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There's more to it than that, but a vast majority of the fuss has not come from UAB fans at all, and I'd surmise even with any pledged funds that might be the case. I mean, we've seen the "rallies", with a handful of people.

But, some groups have come together on this and kind of converged for the sake of their own interest. For example, ESPN has run this story on their front page several times, I think at least four times. Now, how many times did UAB football make the ESPN front page before that? How many times was their program relevant enough to mention? Furthermore, name the last time any football program closing down that was this sort of a story?

So, what we have is a lot of people with ulterior motives deciding they care, and a program that ultimately has more interest from non-fans than fans...
Case in point of non-UAB fans supporting UAB fans. Just so happens these fans reside in Knoxville.



Personally, I have a problem with the state media being so defensive of UAB and attacking the BOT over this. The only media outlet saying anything about it that is not in defense of UAB is the Tuscaloosa News, and the guys in Birmingham blast them over any editorial that points out some flaws in the UAB defense.

A successful UAB does mean positive things for the city of Birmingham. That's obvious. However, that doesn't mean someone who believes UAB doesn't need a FBS football program is anti-Birmingham like some in the media want to depict.
 

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