Robber At Dallas Benihana Is Killed By Man He Tried To Rob - Because He Had A Gun

selmaborntidefan · Jun 22, 2015

http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/crim...hootout-outside-benihana-restaurant/29097359/

Now once again - you can mock the NRA , you can ridicule all you want.

What you can't do is argue with the result. The robber is dead, the customer is expected to survive.

.

jthomas666 · Jun 22, 2015

selmaborntidefan said:
http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/crim...hootout-outside-benihana-restaurant/29097359/

Now once again - you can mock the NRA , you can ridicule all you want.

What you can't do is argue with the result. The robber is dead, the customer is expected to survive.

Of course guns can be used appropriately for self-defense. I haven't seen anyone on this site argue otherwise.

selmaborntidefan · Jun 22, 2015

jthomas666 said:
Of course guns can be used appropriately for self-defense. I haven't seen anyone on this site argue otherwise.

But any of you pretending that there is a disjunction between that and presence of an armed guard at the church in Charleston (or say one at Sandy Hook) is disingenuous at best and utterly laughable at worst. Almost as ridiculous as pretending a gun law would have stopped Dylan Roof.

jthomas666 · Jun 22, 2015

selmaborntidefan said:
But any of you pretending that there is a disjunction between that and presence of an armed guard at the church in Charleston (or say one at Sandy Hook) is disingenuous at best and utterly laughable at worst. Almost as ridiculous as pretending a gun law would have stopped Dylan Roof.

No I do not find a disjunction between thinking that having a large number of armed people in a small area is begging for trouble. I read somewhere (cannot find a link, so this may not be true) that when James Holmes opened up, there was an armed off-duty cop in the audience, but that he did not open fire because he was afraid of hitting bystanders.

What you seem to be willfully ignoring is that no one here has been calling for gun bans, or even saying that there is any legislation that will solve all problems. But that is not a valid reason not try and find solutions that might prevent future tragedies without infringing on the 2nd amendment. Saying that "He's just crazy, he would have figured out a way to kill people one way or another" is a cop out.

Capt. Jack · Jun 22, 2015

"We can have common-sense gun reforms that keep them out of the hands of criminals..." -Hillary Clinton

It is already illegal for people who've been convicted of a crime (aka, criminals) to own a firearm. So let's pass more laws targeted at those who do not follow laws.

Tide1986 · Jun 22, 2015

I'm not one to "cop out" when there is a problem to be solved. If enough people want a solution in this case, the obvious course of action is to memorialize it by amending the constitution. Absent the level of support required to amend the constitution, there is insufficient consensus to warrant a reduction in individual rights regardless of the righteous end to be achieved. Upon careful thought, I don't think anyone would want to manage the country by the whims of opinion polls, which to some degree is what current gun control advocates are doing.

bama_wayne1 · Jun 22, 2015

We need programs to help people that are mentally disabled.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

Bamaro · Jun 22, 2015

selmaborntidefan said:
But any of you pretending that there is a disjunction between that and presence of an armed guard at the church in Charleston (or say one at Sandy Hook) is disingenuous at best and utterly laughable at worst. Almost as ridiculous as pretending a gun law would have stopped Dylan Roof.

Just because a gun law probable wouldn't have stopped Roof doesn't mean that gun laws cant mitigate somewhat the rampant gun violence in this country.

crimsonaudio · Jun 22, 2015

Bamaro said:
Just because a gun law probable wouldn't have stopped Roof doesn't mean that gun laws cant mitigate somewhat the rampant gun violence in this country.

Considering concealed carriers commit crimes lower than anyone, including police.

The reality is there's a small but nonzero chance someone legally allowed to carry a firearm would not have stopped this murder spree - there's an excellent chance someone with a carry permit could have shot at Roof, disengaging or neutralizing him, or at the very least would have left their firearm holstered out of fear / lack of training.

IOW, find me a situation where someone with a carry permit increased the number of deaths and I'll show you at east 10 that stopped the number of deaths.

TIDE-HSV · Jun 22, 2015

I'm never without my gun in my pocket or on my hip. I don't carry in church, because the general policy of the UMC is against it, but doesn't have a strict rule. I've begun to reconsider my position on church...

CajunCrimson · Jun 23, 2015

Orphanages and asylums would help the crime rate go down very quickly. But we would rather have a very ineffective foster care program and ineffective anti psychotic drugs do the work instead

Bamaro · Jun 23, 2015

The answer to the rampant gun violence in the US is not to have everyone walking around packing. One thing that it will encourage is "shot first (aka stand your ground), ask questions later". Show me one other advanced country with gun violence as bad as ours.
Just being armed will not protect you from someone with bad intentions towards you.

Tide1986 · Jun 23, 2015

Bamaro said:
The answer to the rampant gun violence in the US is not to have everyone walking around packing. One thing that it will encourage is "shot first (aka stand your ground), ask questions later". Show me one other advanced country with gun violence as bad as ours.
Just being armed will not protect you from someone with bad intentions towards you.

I haven't given it much thought...but these other countries that people keep referring to with respect to gun violence...which of these countries have individual liberties equal to or greater than the United States?

crimsonaudio · Jun 23, 2015

Bamaro said:
The answer to the rampant gun violence in the US is not to have everyone walking around packing. One thing that it will encourage is "shot first (aka stand your ground), ask questions later".

Nice rhetoric, but reality doesn't match what you describe. Over the last 25 years we've gotten to the point where every state allows some sort of handgun carry - a drastic change from the early 90's - yet gun violence continues to drop: http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/08/us/study-gun-homicide/

CajunCrimson · Jun 23, 2015

http://world.time.com/2012/12/20/the-swiss-difference-a-gun-culture-that-works/

From 2012 -- from Time Magazine -- so, definitely not a conservative site....

Switzerland trails behind only the U.S, Yemen and Serbia in the number of guns per capita; between 2.3 million and 4.5 million military and private firearms are estimated to be in circulation in a country of only 8 million people. Yet, despite the prevalence of guns, the violent-crime rate is low: government figures show about 0.5 gun homicides per 100,000 inhabitants in 2010. By comparison, the U.S rate in the same year was about 5 firearm killings per 100,000 people, according to a 2011 U.N. report.

Unlike some other heavily armed nations, Switzerland’s gun ownership is deeply rooted in a sense of patriotic duty and national identity. Weapons are kept at home because of the long-held belief that enemies could invade tiny Switzerland quickly, so every soldier had to be able to fight his way to his regiment’s assembly point. (Switzerland was at risk of being invaded by Germany during World War II but was spared, historians say, because every Swiss man was armed and trained to shoot.)

uafan4life · Jun 23, 2015

crimsonaudio said:
Nice rhetoric, but reality doesn't match what you describe. Over the last 25 years we've gotten to the point where every state allows some sort of handgun carry - a drastic change from the early 90's - yet gun violence continues to drop: http://www.cnn.com/2013/05/08/us/study-gun-homicide/

You forget, Bamaro doesn't live in reality; he lives in some sort of magical place where the entire world would be a utopia if only stupid people would stop thinking and let big government do the thinking for them.

Bamaro · Jun 23, 2015

uafan4life said:
You forget, Bamaro doesn't live in reality; he lives in some sort of magical place where the entire world would be a utopia if only stupid people would stop thinking and let big government do the thinking for them.

I DO live in reality. I see every day the negative effect of gun violence. Any criminal or would-be criminal has easy access to guns today.
I have guns myself but I dont cling to them thinking that I am the last defense between government tyranny and freedom.

CajunCrimson · Jun 23, 2015

Bamaro said:
I DO live in reality. I see every day the negative effect of gun violence. Any criminal or would-be criminal has easy access to guns today.
I have guns myself but I dont cling to them thinking that I am the last defense between government tyranny and freedom.

I'm guessing that as you are turning your guns in, you might be one of the first to tell the government who else you know that has them.....but I may be assuming something that isn't true.....

uafan4life · Jun 23, 2015

Bamaro said:
I DO live in reality. I see every day the negative effect of gun violence. Any criminal or would-be criminal has easy access to guns today.
I have guns myself but I dont cling to them thinking that I am the last defense between government tyranny and freedom.

You do realize that many of the framers of the Constitution - including and especially James Madison, who authored the Second Amendment - stated that it was important for that very reason, don't you?

crimsonaudio · Jun 23, 2015

Bamaro said:
I DO live in reality. I see every day the negative effect of gun violence. Any criminal or would-be criminal has easy access to guns today.

And yet nothing you have proposed here will have any impact whatsoever on the supply of illegal firearms, most of which are stolen from legal gun owners...

But again, your point alluding to more people carrying being like the Wild West is incorrect - the numbers show just the opposite. And across the country, people with carry permits have a lower crime rate than virtually any other group (including police): http://crimepreventionresearchcente...en-police-and-concealed-carry-permit-holders/
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...-statistics-to-promote-anti-gun-agenda-again/

Facts.

Robber At Dallas Benihana Is Killed By Man He Tried To Rob - Because He Had A Gun

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