Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here) - old

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

Drewy26 said:

Is that the same Lashlee that you are predicting will be fired at the end of this season?

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He still recruits for us and we can find a place for a guy that runs a 4.38 40, even if it's not at QB.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

AUDub said:

He still recruits for us and we can find a place for a guy that runs a 4.38 40, even if it's not at QB.

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Do you find it a concern that Auburn is now looking for a JUCO QB?

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

AUDub said:

I'm not so quick to pin it on Gus. Even when Gus was simply OC we still had our issues. And we completely fell apart in '12 running Loeffler's more pro oriented offense.

I remember when Rhoads took over for Chizik at ISU, he commented to the media how his defense needed to completely relearn the fundamentals due to poor coaching. Whatever he's doing now seems to be working in UNC though.

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Doesn't what you are saying somewhat prove the point you are trying to dispute? Gus and his system aren't seperable. He IS the spread option HUNH so whether he's "just" the OC or if he's the head coach, it's the impact of that system on the defensive players (lack of coaching time available during practice to correct mistakes between plays) that contributes to the lack of development of defensive players.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

AUDub said:

What we need now is stability and faith Gus can right the ship. Making a coaching change every few years will only extend the mess. We can not look over at y'all and get impatient.

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I agree, keep Gus forever!

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

crimsonaudio said:

Some of y'all need to tone down the criticism of GusChamp - they just need more time. And raises. And large buyouts. And extensions.

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{ Giggle......giggle.....giggle.....giggle......}:smile:

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

Originally Posted by AUDub
I was focusing on the part where you were factually wrong. We get plenty of highly coveted recruits on D.

I don't believe the lack of development is because our "head coach doesn't give a rip about defense." Chizik was a defense minded coach and his defenses were serviceable at best. It's because of a lack of stability on that side of the ball.



Then where are those "plenty of highly coveted recruits on D?" Alabama has 3 or 4 true freshman making an impact on defense this year and quite frankly that's the case just about every year. So you're either not getting highly coveted defensive recruits or you are and the coaches are inept. It has to be one of the 2 considering AU is LAST in the SEC in total defense. And BTW, Chizik was not a coach. He was just a figure head..

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

Drewy26 said:

Do you find it a concern that Auburn is now looking for a JUCO QB?

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Not really. We're going to need warm bodies. We basically have two healthy QBs on scholarship, and our emergency QB is a senior splitting time at WR. And don't forget that Woody Barrett, who y'all offered, is also committed.

And if he runs a 4.38 like his bio says, we can find a place for him. Probably at WR like Smith.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

CrimsonForce said:

Then where are those "plenty of highly coveted recruits on D?" Alabama has 3 or 4 true freshman making an impact on defense this year and quite frankly that's the case just about every year. So you're either not getting highly coveted defensive recruits or you are and the coaches are inept. It has to be one of the 2 considering AU is LAST in the SEC in total defense. And BTW, Chizik was not a coach. He was just a figure head..

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Odd echo in here

AUDub said:

Malzahn's first class would have been 2013. A thin one, but his nonetheless. Among the freshmen contributing this year are Carlton Davis (who's is a playmaker and will be our best cover corner next year), Cowart (been solid so far, not unlike Lawson's freshman campaign), and Dinson. None of them seem to have any major character flaws.

The difference is that they do not have a solid core of upperclassmen around them, and that reflects the poor recruiting at the tail end of the Chizik era. We could have gotten away with the departures and injuries we've had, but we have no depth to speak of from that era.

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AUDub said:

Look AU a bit more closely.

Chizik's recruits: Frost, Jones, Garrett, Cass

Malzahn's recruits: Lawson, Adams, Lambert, Holland, Davis

Go back and look at recruiting and it will tell you a lot of the problems Auburn now faces. Williams and Holland are the only decent LB recruits we've had since 2012. Several DBs are no longer on the roster. Injuries have also hurt the backfield.

The D-line recruits Malzahn has brought in have actually played pretty well. Many of the players that are starting to step in up in the defensive backfield are from this recent class Muschamp helped bring in.

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Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

AUDub said:

Odd echo in here

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Ok. CNS came to Bama in 2007 and it took him one year of recruits to get everything going in the right direction. Gus is on year 3 and he still can't figure it out. It's ok to admit that Gus doesn't care about the defense. At this point that is the only logical conclusion. That or Gus is inept at evaluating and developing talent considering he has never won anything with players he recruited and developed..

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

But the fact of import: Auburn ain't Alabama.


The worst thing that happened to Gus was that 2013 magical run...it created some unrealistic expectations for his program. Auburn hasn't kept the same coach for a whole 4-year recruiting cycle since Tuberville left, they've recruited well overall but they've usually suffered a dip on the exit of the old coach and entry of the new coach. 2012 probably crashed so hard because Saban cleaned house in the 2008 and 2009 in-state recruiting classes. 2015 is probably suffering a bit because of the 2011 and 2012 classes suffering a bit with Gus' departure and the following collapse.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

rgw said:

But the fact of import: Auburn ain't Alabama.

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Try to tell Boobie Louder, Pat and Jay that...:cool2:

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

I am not trying to knock Auburn with a trite slam either. I just think the 2010 and 2013 seasons have put unrealistic expectations on their program. They want to hang in the LSU/Alabama tier but they haven't given the several seasons needed to sustain that competitiveness. People underrate that the 2006 recruiting class by Shula was actually highly regarded and it paid dividends in the 2009 season with a nice core group of Seniors leading Saban's high talent Fr/So classes. Not all of that 06 class made it through the regime change but the guys who stuck around where high character and tired of being losers.

Auburn has had far less consistency in their program and their recruiting nose dived before the Chizik hire and later the Malzahn hire. They were incredibly lucky to land Fairley then Newton in back-to-back seasons through JUCO and have them practically be the guys who made their whole side of the ball work in 2010. You don't usually get so blessed with JUCO pickups to have complete game-changers much less two of them on the team at the same time. The 2013 season was literally as close to being an 8-4 season as it was to being 12-2 with an SEC championship. Nearly all champions end up winning a game they shouldn't have but Auburn probably pushed that latitude beyond any reasonable expectation. Grabbing Marshall was another huge get as he could really run the zone option well and clearly got a bit underrated for his ability to pass off the play fakes you had to respect.


If Auburn is smart, they'd stay the course and not push for changes this off-season. They sorely need consistency to allow their program a chance to establish a regime. They've practically been a revolving door of coordinators and head coaches since 2007. It is hard to be productive when leadership vision for what they're gonna do changes every couple of years.


For us, it would be a Christmas gift for them to pull the trigger on Malzahn if they stumble to the finish line...I don't think they're gonna keep on hitting year 1 or 2 turnaround homers with their hires and eventually it is going to cripple their program for a longer term.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

rgw, I think you hit the nail on the head with your last two posts.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

PitMaster said:

Carl Lawson is back at practice and the growing feeling is that he will play vs Ole Miss

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None too soon. Hope he's effective in his return. He was unblockable in the only half of action he's seen this season.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

rgw said:

But the fact of import: Auburn ain't Alabama.


The worst thing that happened to Gus was that 2013 magical run...it created some unrealistic expectations for his program. Auburn hasn't kept the same coach for a whole 4-year recruiting cycle since Tuberville left, they've recruited well overall but they've usually suffered a dip on the exit of the old coach and entry of the new coach. 2012 probably crashed so hard because Saban cleaned house in the 2008 and 2009 in-state recruiting classes. 2015 is probably suffering a bit because of the 2011 and 2012 classes suffering a bit with Gus' departure and the following collapse.

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Let's not fool ourselves about CTT either...not a bad coach (believed in defense..how ironic) but if we hadn't gone through 3 Mikes in a row he would have never had the success he had.

rgw said:

I am not trying to knock Auburn with a trite slam either. I just think the 2010 and 2013 seasons have put unrealistic expectations on their program. They want to hang in the LSU/Alabama tier but they haven't given the several seasons needed to sustain that competitiveness. People underrate that the 2006 recruiting class by Shula was actually highly regarded and it paid dividends in the 2009 season with a nice core group of Seniors leading Saban's high talent Fr/So classes. Not all of that 06 class made it through the regime change but the guys who stuck around where high character and tired of being losers.

Auburn has had far less consistency in their program and their recruiting nose dived before the Chizik hire and later the Malzahn hire. They were incredibly lucky to land Fairley then Newton in back-to-back seasons through JUCO and have them practically be the guys who made their whole side of the ball work in 2010. You don't usually get so blessed with JUCO pickups to have complete game-changers much less two of them on the team at the same time. The 2013 season was literally as close to being an 8-4 season as it was to being 12-2 with an SEC championship. Nearly all champions end up winning a game they shouldn't have but Auburn probably pushed that latitude beyond any reasonable expectation. Grabbing Marshall was another huge get as he could really run the zone option well and clearly got a bit underrated for his ability to pass off the play fakes you had to respect.

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I said the same upthread about about Cam and Nick Marshall. Those two explain most of Gus' success at the Barn. On the other hand, look how CNS has been able to adjust to different offensive coordinators and different styles of qbs and still keep on winning. Important point about his coaching and management skills.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

Jermey Johnson just straight up flopped. I'm not sure what happened with that one because he gave every indication he was going to at least be a solid QB for them then he gets the reigns and laid a ..... Now they're playing 2nd year player (RS Fr) at QB with a mid-season change...probably just about the worst case scenario for consistent offensive success. Maybe the coaching is to blame for Johnson not performing but even a bad coach doesn't coach 'em up to throw the kind of throws Johnson did in his time at QB this year. The player just couldn't handle the pressure of being the guy or read the headlines and didn't put in the work to be prepared for the job this year.

I think it is unwise to prescribe inadequacy in the coaching staff without a trend. Malzahn probably got the most out of Chris Todd in 2009 and Trotter (?) in 2011. Those just weren't very good QBs, so I mean the fact they were effective offensively most games was a credit to his coaching. He did very well with Cam Newton in 2010 and Nick Marshall in 2013-2014. This is the first time we've seen the projected starter be an absolute determinant to his offense. It happens sometimes.

I know we want to think that everything about Auburn sucks but their coaches are pretty well proven in the SEC...their problem this year is on the players. Nobody wants to blame the players but I owe nothing to Auburn so I'll say it: they suck at too many positions to compete for anything beyond a rival upset this year. The fact people got swept up into the hype is just what happens sometimes...people see a promising QB, talent at WR, depth at tailback, a proven coach for offense, and a new DC who is proven to make elite units...and they don't look at the depth chart.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

NoNC4Tubs said:

About...?

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Went right by this earlier.

Golloway held some unsanctioned pitching practices. NCAA violation type stuff. The kind that will get players declared ineligible. Jay called him into his office and asked him about it. Golloway, of course, denied right off the bat.

Then Jay showed him the video...

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

AUDub said:

Lashlee saw something he liked seeing him play live last Thursday.

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Was he the one that threw the trashcan 20yds in the brawl? If so he has a cannon.

Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains"

2003TIDE said:

Was he the one that threw the trashcan 20yds in the brawl? If so he has a cannon.

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It was his nimble evasion of the folks trying to get things under control that caught his eye.