I actually feel better about this Alabama team after the game

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
10,617
4,542
187
44
kraizy.art
There's no denying the fact that the loss hurts, it removes the margin of error for Alabama. However, the same basic thing happened last year and Alabama ended up with a #1 seed in the playoff, Ohio State played a softer schedule, had a far worse loss and ended up being champions. So, if Alabama can build off of where they are now, they can get better, and the path will likely be cleared. I was a very concerned about Ole Miss because of how good their team was, I never imagined it would take so many fluke plays for them to win the game.

I think a lot of people want to nitpick certain aspects of Alabama's play last game aside from the fluke plays. I'm not really sure I see that many bad things once you remove the crazy stuff. If you want me to pinpoint what I see as the biggest correctable mistake, it was to play Cooper Bateman if he wasn't going to be running the ball. Otherwise, you have a comedy of errors against a very good football team that lead to a 6 point loss. It could have been far worse.

When Jacob Coker entered the game Alabama was down 17-3 in the second quarter. He scored a touchdown, then Ole Miss, in one of the craziest plays we'll ever see scored another touchdown. At this point the fates had conspired against Alabama, Ole Miss was up 14 in the third quarter and Alabama simply couldn't play the type of game they wanted to play, and Ole Miss on the other hand had the luxury of playing exactly how they wanted to.

Then, Alabama failed on a fourth down conversion leading to three more Ole Miss points. At this point Alabama turned almost exclusively to the pass, leading to the defense being pushed back onto the field, and another three points. The route was on... supposedly. Yet, despite everything conspiring against Alabama, and some fans walking out, Alabama fought back but twice.

It's very important to try and look at how Alabama played without just looking at fluke plays and the results of playing from behind. Despite being forced to pass, and a couple ridiculous TDs from Ole Miss, with Jacob Coker in, Alabama outscored Ole Miss 34-26. If Alabama wasn't playing from behind that margin would have almost certainly been larger.

In the first half, Alabama held Ole Miss to around 100 yards and accounted for 200 yards of offense. This also means for the record that the full half Coker played results in 300 yards of offense to go along with 27 points, against a very good defense! Is that enough to be pleased with how good the team is, the fact that Alabama's offense actually did fairly well with Coker in there? No, it goes beyond that.

Turnovers:
Alabama gave up 5 turnovers, and Ole Miss gave up 0. We can stop here and acknowledge that if this stat was flipped Alabama probably blows out Ole Miss by four touchdowns or more. This is the worst margin in the Saban era and unlikely to repeat itself. But, there were also the fourth down conversions, which were in part forced due to Alabama's desperation. Alabama was 1-4 on those plays and Ole Miss was 1-2. Now, it's oversimplifying, but failing a fourth down conversion is a lot like a turnover, so let's assign -.5 to a failed one and +.5 to a successful one. That means Ole Miss ends up with a 0 on turnovers, and Alabama ends up with 6. If you told me Alabama was going to be that far behind in the turnover margin, against a team as good as Ole Miss, I'd have expected the biggest blowout loss of the Saban era, not a 6 point one.

Jacob Coker:
I believe he showed the most important quality a quarterback can have, leadership. Ole Miss knew he was going to throw, they knew they could bring pressure, they knew they could play the pass, and he still hung in there and gave better than he got. He ended up being the team's second leading rusher, and just consider this fact. The Alabama's offense was not given anything! Ole Miss had 0 turnovers. Everything Coker and the Alabama offense did, they did against adversity, generally with bad field position, against a tough defense, and with the odds stacked against them.

Defense:
It's hard to puzzle it out, but someone said if you remove all the crazy stuff Ole Miss basically scored 12 points. I think you take a look at the first half to get an idea of how good this defense is, 100 yards and every single score was off a turnover, and then the next TD was off of a fluke play. When the defense had anything to work with they did a fantastic job. I have no real concerns about this defense anymore, Alabama just doesn't turn over the ball a lot and chances are these guys will get the job done. But, once Ole Miss had a nice lead, they could play even more aggressively, they could just take shots knowing that they were just playing to pad their lead. They had no real need to sustain drives, or desperation to score points. Alabama's defense was put in a horrible situation and if anyone wants to look at those 5 turnovers and three failed fourth downs, to go along with playing from behind and judge the defense, I simply think they are being irrational.

Kicking Game:
Lost in the shuffle a bit was the suspension of the long snapper, which for a struggling punter and place kicker was really bad news. As it was, JK Scott had a solid if unspectacular outing, and Adam Griffith had by far his best game of the year. He was perfect on PATs, his kickoffs looked pretty good, he hit his first field goal (laces if I understand correctly, always a bad thing for a kicker to have to kick the laces), and he had a beautiful on-sided kick. There's plenty of reason to believe that the kicking game has turned the corner and while there might be issues going forward, we've probably seen the worse already.

This was a crazy game, and honestly if another crazy game happens Alabama could lose. But, there's usually not more than one of these a year, so logically we can just hope it's the last one. I do have areas of concern, but nothing like a loss to get a team to try and clean up their mistakes. But, in the big picture I have a lot of confidence. This defense is very good and if you give them half a chance I think they'll get the job done. This offense can move the ball against a very good defense, and I believe that if you give the offense a decent chance they'll get the job done. The special teams remains a concern, but if offensive skill players don't revert to butterfingers again we're unlikely to see a repeat of what happened.

Now, one might argue that the real fluke was not all the turnovers and crazy plays, but how Alabama's defense played in the first half, how Coker was able to lead Alabama back repeatedly (we know he has his shortcomings). Perhaps that's true, and if so we'll see, but something tells me somewhere in all the craziness we saw how great this team can be.

Edit:
I think a few valid points have been made, and I thought I might as well address them here.

Ole Miss:
So many crazy things happened, that I don't think you can just change one thing and have Alabama win. It was a series of events, and Ole Miss took advantage. To say Alabama shot themselves in the foot, or to call them fluke plays isn't intended to disparage Ole Miss. They won the game, they deserved to win the game. However, winning the game does not necessarily mean they have a better team.

Offensive Line:
The offensive line is basically the third most inexperienced OL in the SEC (overall Alabama is basically the third most inexperiened team). I expect them (like the Alabama secondary) to improve as the season progresses.

The Competition:
I believe Alabama has played three bowl teams so far. This skews the viewpoint of Alabama unfavorably. If you compare their statistics or performance, to teams playing far lesser competition it makes Alabama look worse than they actually are. For instance, Alabama's opponents won their other 6 games by a combined 378-55! Alabama has scored more points on all of their opponents than any other team did, and has held all three opponents to less points than any other team did. Had Alabama played a similar level of competition their numbers would be skewed far more favorably.

Special Teams:
Special teams is an issue which I believe can be broken down into two areas. Place kicking, which due to inherent limitations might be a lingering issue, and the rest of the special teams play which over the years has generally been very good. I expect to see Alabama have more solid play (I certainly don't expect to see two more fumbled kick returns in one game), but make no mistake, if the struggles continue it will cost Alabama. I just see no evidence that those three games are a stronger indication than general performance over the years.

Injuries:
This unfortunately will always be a factor. This team might be great, but a single injury can be the difference between a win and a loss (I still belive Vinny getting hurt before the 2013 Auburn game was the difference). So, just being a great team isn't enough, I think this team can be great but they need to stay healthy.

Hopefully those statements provide slightly better perspective on what else I had to say.
 
Last edited:

major tidefan

All-American
Jul 3, 2006
2,718
787
137
Boaz,AL
It wasn't a fluke that we lost the game.You pull this nonsense after every loss.Some of our fans just refuse to acknowledge the other team when they outplay us.Ole Miss deserved to win,end of story.
 

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
10,617
4,542
187
44
kraizy.art
It wasn't a fluke that we lost the game.You pull this nonsense after every loss.Some of our fans just refuse to acknowledge the other team when they outplay us.Ole Miss deserved to win,end of story.
I pull a lot of nonsense I guess, like saying after the last Ole Miss loss that Alabama still had a direct path to the playoff. I'll give Ole Miss credit for taking advantage of Alabama's mistakes, but even Nick Saban said the same thing. Not taking anything away from them, but the turnovers beat Alabama. This isn't about the other team though, I don't care about other teams, this is about the Alabama team.

Anyway, the fact is that is does often require an element of luck to beat a Nick Saban coached Alabama team. Just look at recent losses. In the Ohio State game, I have stated I thought that the injuries/being beat up was a factor, but I never stated it was a fluke loss. The Ole Miss game that year? Yeah it was, fumbled kickoff return, struggles on special teams, it wasn't like this game but it took an element of luck to beat Alabama. Oklahoma before that? Not a fluke, Alabama just didn't play well. The Auburn loss? You had better believe that was a fluke, everyone knows that.

Then you have the Texas A&M loss, I wouldn't call that a fluke, I called it a gimmick offense and I still do but not really a fluke. The LSU loss before that? Absolutely a fluke, missed kicks and you saw what Alabama did to them the second time around. I've actually argued repeatedly that random variables are a major factor in football games. You can be the best, you can have the best everything really, and sometimes you'll just get really really unlucky. It's like having a dice that has 6 on 5 sides and 1 on the other. Guess what? Sometimes you still roll the 1.

Some people always want to point fingers and levy accusations after a loss, when the simplest explanation sometimes, Occam's razor if you will is that a very good team had bad luck. My main point though is to look at how the team actually played, vs. the fluke or shall we say low probability plays. Finally, allow me to say I was being somewhat generous with just calling them fluke plays. One Ole Miss touchdown was an illegal play, plain and simple.
 
Last edited:

bamanut_aj

Hall of Fame
Jul 31, 2000
20,058
82
167
51
Spring Hill, TN
Turnovers are not a fluke. Six turnovers are DEFINITELY not a fluke. That is called 'a problem'

I like the optimism. That's cool. But there are a couple real issues on this team that must get corrected. We have the alleged best coaching staff in CFB; let's see if they earn their money


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

B1GTide

TideFans Legend
Apr 13, 2012
45,593
47,177
187
I agree with Krazy - your defense is the strength of this team and they only surrendered 19 points to Ole Miss. Correct the mental errors and you will be fine. You started last season with turnover problems and got that corrected. I think that you will go on a tear from here.
 

CB4

Hall of Fame
Aug 8, 2011
9,512
13,676
187
Birmingham, AL
I agree Krazy. This team still is capable of challenging for the West and working it's way to Atlanta again. I don't think Ole Miss will make it unscathed. While Kelly played well against us, if he pulls a couple of bonehead plays (let's face it, the ball he threw up for grabs that turned into the TD should have never been thrown) it could cost them a game (or two).

If Coker takes the good from this game and cleans up the rest, becomes the leader he should be, and we learn to function as a team, we still have a chance. The talent is there.
 

JD95

All-American
Oct 18, 1999
2,002
15
162
55
Birmingham, AL
I'll feel better about the team if they correct the mistakes and beat Georgia on the road in two weeks. That would put us at 4-1, then a win at home against a feeling Arkansas team would make 5-1. The trip to Texas A&M looks tough, and then who knows how Tennessee might be playing a month from now. But if the Tide improves and gets to the bye week with just this one loss, we're in position for another SEC title and a playoff bid. It can happen if they eliminate - or at least cut back drastically on - the many mistakes they made Saturday night.
 

JD95

All-American
Oct 18, 1999
2,002
15
162
55
Birmingham, AL
Sorry I meant to add that if we lose to Georgia, I think subsequent losses to A&M and LSU are likely, with another loss possibly thrown in. Then we'd be looking at the worst season since Saban's first year here. The Georgia game is really a "crossroads" type of game if you ask me.
 

tidefanbeezer

All-American
Sep 25, 2006
3,292
204
87
46
Atlanta, GA
I wish I shared your optimism.

There are some bright spots on this team. But I think this may be the year where things just catch up with us: underclassmen leaving faster than we can replace them, deficiencies in talent at critical positions, complacency from being on top for so long....

And that's ok. With some of the teams remaining on out schedule, we may lose another game or two. I don't think its the end of the world if that happens. That could give us time to develop younger guys with out the intense pressure of playing for a national title. Given how young this team is, it could also help to light a fire for the younger guys coming back next year.

This could end up being like 2010. Lost some games that we probably shouldn't have, but it helped ignite the 2011-2012 run. Those guys didn't take well to not being on top and dominated the league for the next couple of years.

That's the feeling I get from this team, which I can live with.
 

Bamaro

TideFans Legend
Oct 19, 2001
26,625
10,722
287
Jacksonville, Md USA
I wish that I felt better about it but I dont. We dont have a consistent passing game and to make matters worse we lost Foster for the season.:frown:
 

MN-Tide

1st Team
Jan 2, 2007
465
0
35
Minneapolis, MN
I agree with Krazy. The team needs to focus on the positives, even while they work through the problem areas. I thought Coker showed leadership late in the game. He made mistakes, but the team did not give up. They came back twice from a 19 point deficit. That's what you want from the QB position. I'm looking forward to the Georgia game. We'll know a lot about this team (and about Coker) after that game.
 

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
10,617
4,542
187
44
kraizy.art
Sorry, but I can't "feel better" about this team after that game. Someone needs to step up and lead.
I get that, but I felt really scared before the game. What I saw was completely unexpected, but if I have to choose between Alabama losing because they screwed up, or losing because the other team is better I'll take the former. You can fix screw ups, you can't just magically make the team better though.

So, when someone says well I can't feel good about it, sure it's relative, I get that. But, here were some areas of concern and how they played out.

I was worried the kicking game would implode. It didn't implode, or regress, it improved. Now, it might regress, it might still implode, but it was a positive step.

I was worried that Alabama might not have true leadership at the quarterback position. No, Coker isn't perfect but he looked like a leader to me.

The inevitable concern about the defense against the HUNH. Well, Alabama held Ole Miss to 100 yards in the first half. When the defense didn't have their back against the wall they did great. Not only that, but I'm not sure anyone realizes that MTSU hung another 70 point score on an opponent. That means Alabama played two teams that averaged over 70 points against other opponents, and Alabama's defense showed they can handle both.

So, could this go the other way and be like 2010? Sure, it could. But it could also end up like 2011 and 2012 and that's all I can really ask for, is that the team has a shot at doing that.
 
Last edited:

dvil doc

1st Team
Dec 3, 2014
365
59
47
Northern Virginia
I think Bama can run the table on the remaining schedule, even though it is the toughest in all of FBS. aTm looks better than predicted, LSU looked scary against aweBarn (who are in chaos), Arkansas as it turns out are stumbling already, and MSU will probably get stronger as the days go by. SEC East is no joke this year with of course UGA coming up soon. The Tide have issues but I see, as previously mentioned, a climb back up the polls and contention for a playoff spot.
 

Alabama22

1st Team
Aug 3, 2010
834
0
35
Alabama
What I liked was Coker's leadership when he came into the game. I think he is our starter for the remainder of the season... good or bad. My only advice to the coaches is to go back to what has worked in previous years by having the offense huddle up between plays and get the call right. The hurry-up scheme seems to be creating more confusion for our team than it is the other team. On Saturday night when the offense huddled up, there seemed to be much less confusion about what played was being called from the sideline. Just my two cents worth.
 

AlistarWills

All-American
Jul 26, 2006
4,852
2,223
187
i was thinking coker showed a lot of leadership after he came in.
As I posted in the game thread, I think the QB competition is over. Bateman had his shot, unless he was given 'zone read-give' plays where his run option is removed as a setup, then he didn't believe in himself enough to run the ball and take command of the game. I think Coker showed some toughness and grit and I'll tell you, linemen don't mind playing for a QB that ain't afraid to get dirty with em. He's got a crazy strong arm, and he can fit balls into spots downfield that others haven't shown the ability to. He's gonna get you a pick here and there, he looks to be making the same errors a young AJ made, but I think it is now Coker's team going forward.
 

New Posts

Latest threads

TideFans.shop - NEW Stuff!

TideFans.shop - Get YOUR Bama Gear HERE!”></a>
<br />

<!--/ END TideFans.shop & item link \-->
<p style= Purchases made through our TideFans.shop and Amazon.com links may result in a commission being paid to TideFans.