VW in trouble...

tidegrandpa · Sep 23, 2015

Yes and in the 2000-2005 timeframe it was a fact. May have changed since then.

day-day · Sep 23, 2015

Tide1986 said:
Then I'm not sure it's cheaper for the company to build as Bamaro stated. Academically speaking, it would be more expensive since VW would need to create more expansive software to turn off and on the emission controls.

Maybe this is a cheaper method to build a car that provides the same performance and gas mileage while still "meeting" the emissions standards.

Go Bama · Sep 23, 2015

TIDE-HSV said:
Are you absolutely sure about that? I always make sure, when we buy a new vehicle, that I have a code reader for it, all the way back to to OBDI. We just donated a VW Passat a couple of years ago we'd had since 2003, and I could swear I had a OBDII reader for it almost immediately. I believe in knowing as much as the stealer. I've had two dealership shops, one Mercedes and one Dodge lie to me in instances which could have cost me and mine lives. Believe it or not, when I had a fairly new Dodge Caravan (fit the family situation and popular at the time), the cable from the lever to the transmission broke. Whereupon, I put it up against a wall, selected "Drive" and pulled on the broken off cable until I felt it work through the gears and engage in "Dr." I clamped it there right at the transmission with vise grips. I then drove all the way out to the dealer and they claimed the cable wasn't part of the "drive-train" warranty. Faced with suit, they caved. (I think they would have even caved before present day arbitration.) Same bunch made the same claim when a hub drive lug bolt broke off. Caved on that one too.

The worst though was the Mercedes. I kept having alternator problems - wearing out belts etc. Finally, I climbed under and saw that the fixing bolt on the mount was undersized; alternator body literally rattling around. When I confronted the mechanic, he confessed that the shop manager wouldn't let him order the proper sized bolt, $17.50 at the time, more now with inflation. When I confronted him, he tried exploding at me. When he got through, I told him I was preferring criminal charges and his attitude changed. That tactic might not be quite legal, but it worked. He had already caused me extreme difficulties, with the car going dead on I-59 at the Hammondville exit, stopped by local cops because my headlights were almost gone. A diesel, once started will run until out of fuel. However, the alternator couldn't recharge the battery. Around that time, I decided I needed to know as much as the dealer. I'd always worked on cars, but EC modules were new to me...

I had the same alternator issue back in the 80's with a Rabbit Diesel. The alternator was cantilevered from the front of the engine by one long bolt which was undersized and would break the bolt housing thus loosening the belt. I couldn't figure out why I kept losing alternators AND batteries. My father, a mechanical engineer, was able to diagnose the problem. I had bought the car used and I feel the cheaper bolt was placed at some point before I bought the car. Other than that issue, it was a great car. I was coming home from Memphis one Sunday night riding somebody's bumper because my lights had gotten so dim I could barely see. As you stated, a diesel will run without the alternator working.

dayhiker · Sep 23, 2015

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dayhiker · Sep 23, 2015

The above showed up in my newsfeed this morning on FB.

mittman · Sep 23, 2015

dayhiker said:
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Gag me with a spoon.

TIDE-HSV · Sep 23, 2015

Go Bama said:
I had the same alternator issue back in the 80's with a Rabbit Diesel. The alternator was cantilevered from the front of the engine by one long bolt which was undersized and would break the bolt housing thus loosening the belt. I couldn't figure out why I kept losing alternators AND batteries. My father, a mechanical engineer, was able to diagnose the problem. I had bought the car used and I feel the cheaper bolt was placed at some point before I bought the car. Other than that issue, it was a great car. I was coming home from Memphis one Sunday night riding somebody's bumper because my lights had gotten so dim I could barely see. As you stated, a diesel will run without the alternator working.

In my case, the dealership just lost my bolt and replaced it with the smaller one. Mine was mounted exactly as yours was. In the case of the Caravan, I had my wife trail me right on my bumper, since I couldn't back up...

NationalTitles18 · Sep 23, 2015

And so it begins: http://blog.caranddriver.com/oh-law...ther-filing-class-action-lawsuits-against-vw/

Bamaro · Sep 23, 2015

VW CEO has resigned.

crimsonaudio · Oct 9, 2015

http://blog.caranddriver.com/report-bosch-warned-vw-about-diesel-emissions-cheating-in-2007/

2003TIDE · Oct 9, 2015

LOL at them blaming it on a few rouge software engineers. No way that decision didn't come from higher up.

TIDE-HSV · Oct 9, 2015

To answer my question from the first page, it appears that the test-detection software was much more sophisticated than dynamometer or open door detection. It used inertial algorithms and other highly sophisticated detection methods. In fact, if the WVU students hadn't taken them on the road, the fraud could have gone on for more years...

mittman · Oct 9, 2015

TIDE-HSV said:
To answer my question from the first page, it appears that the test-detection software was much more sophisticated than dynamometer or open door detection. It used inertial algorithms and other highly sophisticated detection methods. In fact, if the WVU students hadn't taken them on the road, the fraud could have gone on for more years...

That being the case it makes the statements Bosch made seem disingenuous. What else was the software going to be used for?

Catfish · Oct 9, 2015

VW makes some pretty decent cars. I'd imagine that you'd be able to pick up a new (gasoline) model at some attractive prices soon.

TIDE-HSV · Oct 9, 2015

mittman said:
That being the case it makes the statements Bosch made seem disingenuous. What else was the software going to be used for?

Seems like they feel that they washed their hands of it, once they warned VW about the illegality of tweaking the ECU. But I'm with you, what else were they going to use software like that for? The outcome of the class action suit will be interesting. The value of all VWs, including gas, has dropped, although nothing like the 40% or so of diesel models. VW is going to have to address this, probably with the judicial knife at their throats. After all, they risked these billions to save $335 per vehicle. This debacle is going to cost them much more than any profit they made off the cheat, even ignoring the money they spent in engineering costs to effect the fraud...

crimsonaudio · Oct 9, 2015

TIDE-HSV said:
This debacle is going to cost them much more than any profit they made off the cheat, even ignoring the money they spent in engineering costs to effect the fraud...

Yup - I have several friends who are currently selling the TDi VWs due to this - they're ricked off, willing to take the loss, and will never buy a VW again. And some of these have been die-hard VW owner / supporters for a long time...

TIDE-HSV · Oct 9, 2015

crimsonaudio said:
Yup - I have several friends who are currently selling the TDi VWs due to this - they're ricked off, willing to take the loss, and will never buy a VW again. And some of these have been die-hard VW owner / supporters for a long time...

Last one we had was a Passat, 2004, gas model. We drove it for about ten years and I donated it to a charity. The last couple of years systems broke down one after another. The head gasket was the crowning blow, so to speak. The V-6 engine was basically installed backwards, with the timing cover, water pump, etc., squeezed up against the firewall. I didn't have the time, although I've installed head gaskets before. I even tried to get a friend who loves to work on cars, of all sorts, and offered to pay him. He just said that he'd do that job on any car but that one. I'd started considering DIY. Glad I talked to him...

92tide · Oct 9, 2015

crimsonaudio said:
Yup - I have several friends who are currently selling the TDi VWs due to this - they're ricked off, willing to take the loss, and will never buy a VW again. And some of these have been die-hard VW owner / supporters for a long time...

i'm just waiting to see what is going to happen. it'll be interesting for sure. i've always liked vws and i'm about half german and this ticks me off pretty good. i really like my tdi wagon

Tide1986 · Oct 9, 2015

I've never bought a car based on its emissions rating. I'm amused by this story, and if I were in the market for another car, I'd definitely look at a VW brand.

crimsonaudio · Oct 9, 2015

Tide1986 said:
I've never bought a car based on its emissions rating.

Nor have I, but I do buy based on the seeming trustworthiness of the company.

I'm amused by this story, and if I were in the market for another car, I'd definitely look at a VW brand.

Intersting. I've owned VWs in the past, which is why I don't own one now. Almost everyone I know that owns (and even loves) VWs have had some pretty major issues over the years with them, while my Hondas and Toyotas (especially my Land Cruisers) are built like bricks.

VW in trouble...

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