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Is it possible to win long term at Miami on the up and up?

AlistarWills

AlistarWills

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This just hit me this morning. It seems to me that when Miami was at it's best, they had a lot of shenanigans going on with external forces, Luther Campbell, et al. They tried to clean the program up and just can't seem to get it together on the field. Is it possible to win at Miami without, for lack of a better word "cheating"?
 
CrimsonForce

CrimsonForce

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The biggest problem for Miami is they need to have better facilities and a stadium on campus. Those are two big detractors for recruits, players and potential coaches. Additionally, there is just an ominous "culture" that permeates at Miami, if you know what I mean..
 
TideEngineer08

TideEngineer08

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It may be possible without an on campus stadium. USC does it. UCLA has done it as well. Heck, Alabama did it for decades. And they are upgrading Dolphins Stadium (or whatever its called these days). But, it absolutely is not possible without facilities upgrades and fan support. Miami has always had lackluster fan support, and it's grown worse and worse. But even in their heyday, they never drew huge home crowds, unless it was a big time game like FSU or Notre Dame.

They need a great recruiting staff, a coach on the level of Nick Saban, upgraded facilities, and better fan support. Without better fan support, I'm not sure the other 2 are possible. With Miami, it seems like everyone but their fans want them to be great again. I don't see anything from that fan base that makes me think they take their football seriously.
 
Jon

Jon

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yes

there are enough great local players that the right coach could conceivably convince enough kids to stay home to play for the local school and win. So far that convincing has been done with $$'s and "other" benefits.

Could someone do it? yes. Is it likely? No
 
81usaf92

81usaf92

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It depends on your definition of long term.miami is a sleeping giant that has falter because of sanctions, facilities, and bad coaches but if given a good recruiter and a good leader they could dominate recruiting in central and south Florida. I like Mac but him and jimbo are in serious trouble if that happens because they have enjoyed the down Miami and the credible ucf days.

I think even if that happens, Miami will only enjoy a dominating period for 4 to 5 years and be average until being reloaded. That is of course under the thinking that they won't be able to keep that coach and won't get new facilities
 
bama2112

bama2112

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B1GTide said:
Send someone like Saban to Miami and watch.
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If you find someone like Saban, you think 1. Miami has the money to pay him. 2. There are much better jobs than the "u". God only knows what really went on back in the 90's the NCAA never looked into. Miami is like LA. There are too many distractions and some much of a melting pot of people from around the world. I dont see them being a factor in Division 1 football for a long time. I had rather see my kid go to Auburn for an education that Miami, its in awful part of Miami.
 
T

tidefan39817

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if they get a competent head coach that can draw a line across the state of Florida just north of Orlando and keep other schools from cherry picking that area, yes, without a doubt.
 
81usaf92

81usaf92

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I think some of y'all are thinking Miami is beyond repair, but it's not. I doubt they ever see the dominance they had from 81-03 but given a good coach they can succeed. Miami is a better city than Gainesville and Tallahassee and it's not even remotely close. Miami can be a power if given the right circumstances
 
theballguy

theballguy

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Somehow they won a NC in 83 -- I am hoping that was without cheating as I have some respect for Coach Schnellenberger. But over many years without cheating? The way things look today: no way. Doesn't seem possible. But, if you get the right people in (and let's be honest, that's a long shot at best), anything can happen.
 
TideEngineer08

TideEngineer08

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81usaf92 said:
I think some of y'all are thinking Miami is beyond repair, but it's not. I doubt they ever see the dominance they had from 81-03 but given a good coach they can succeed. Miami is a better city than Gainesville and Tallahassee and it's not even remotely close. Miami can be a power if given the right circumstances
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I don't think they've got the fan base for it. I don't think they ever did, for that matter. They were sitting on a gold mine of talent, and used that to propel their historic run. But look at the coaching turnover. They never could keep a coach, for a variety of reasons, I guess. The success finally puttered out when the recruiting dried up. You can blame many things for that: sanctions, lack of facilities, other programs making inroads. Well, the sanctions were never permanent. But you are not kicking all of the other programs out of the area. They're there to stay. And you can't compete with those programs for those recruits without either A: cheating, or B: facilities and legal enticements. Well, they can't get B without spending money. Money they don't have because their fan support is so lackluster.

They never needed the facilities back in the 80s and 90s because the facilities weren't that big of a deal back then. Now, they are paramount. Rebuilding Miami isn't the same thing as rebuilding Alabama.
 
B1GTide

B1GTide

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TideEngineer08 said:
They never needed the facilities back in the 80s and 90s because the facilities weren't that big of a deal back then. Now, they are paramount. Rebuilding Miami isn't the same thing as rebuilding Alabama.
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Agree with the first part. My only question is money - do they have the booster base necessary to get the job done? If so, they could easily do it. It comes down to money.

As much as it may pain you guys to hear this, Miami is a much more attractive place for most college aged men than Tuscaloosa. I have been to Tuscaloosa once, and it is a college town in the middle of no where. A great college town, but still in the middle of no where. Same applies to Columbus. Great college town, but doesn't compare to SoCal or Miami.

As for the comment about not being the same as rebuilding at Alabama - that is not relevant. No school could claim that. You are the NY Yankees of college football. But if they have the money to rebuild their facilities and hire a great head coach, they can have as much (or more) success as anyone.
 
81usaf92

81usaf92

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TideEngineer08 said:
I don't think they've got the fan base for it. I don't think they ever did, for that matter. They were sitting on a gold mine of talent, and used that to propel their historic run. But look at the coaching turnover. They never could keep a coach, for a variety of reasons, I guess. The success finally puttered out when the recruiting dried up. You can blame many things for that: sanctions, lack of facilities, other programs making inroads. Well, the sanctions were never permanent. But you are not kicking all of the other programs out of the area. They're there to stay. And you can't compete with those programs for those recruits without either A: cheating, or B: facilities and legal enticements. Well, they can't get B without spending money. Money they don't have because their fan support is so lackluster.

They never needed the facilities back in the 80s and 90s because the facilities weren't that big of a deal back then. Now, they are paramount. Rebuilding Miami isn't the same thing as rebuilding Alabama.
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Miami is a weird program. Their program doesn't have a big fan base but it can attract enormous talent if under the right circumstances. Miami has came back from the ashes after it seemed down with the help of butch. And it is very odd that Florida never won a championship when Miami was on top, and fsu won 1. It seems it's in the best interests to fsu and uf to keep Miami down. I think Miami is a great job for an up and coming coach that knows how to recruit, and can be a thorn in fsu and uf's side if they rebuild
 
GrayTide

GrayTide

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I do not believe Miami has the booster support and local community support of a major FBS program. Like most college programs located in large metropolitan cities; it has to compete with professional sports for the local fan sports entertainment dollars and they have not been able to do that. Also playing in the least competitive P5 conference doesn't help, can you imagine the crowd for the Canes vs Wake Forest? Miami's football tradition spans less than 20 years and it was characterized by thuggish behavior. Add to this the lack of an on campus stadium and below average athletic facilities, IMO makes the future of Miami football very dismal. The right coach might be able to bring them up to the level of say NC State, Georgia Tech or North Carolina but not to the FSU or Clemson level. I believe the university no longer has the commitment to change this.
 
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