2016 Election - Trump: How Did Trump Really Win the Presidency?

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bamacon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Why would they, when Trump is a crypto-liberal... :D
Trump absolutely destroyed Cruz on his NY value comments.

Rubio comes off as just another politician, whom we are all sick of hearing the same ol same ol....

Kasick won't shut up about his personal history - I can't see him as our president...yeesh.

Rubio - see remarks on Rubio above

Christie actually showed a lot of fire and did a much better job of answering questions by the moderators than many of the others. I give him a high score.

The doctor seemed a little nervous & still a bit slow on giving his responses but if you listen to his answers he does actually speak with some practicality, which I like.

Trump did very well last night - the only exception being the comments about Cruz's Canadian citizenship "issue". I think he spent too much time on it. Otherwise he did very well last night and was strong on many of the topics.

I didn't watch the JV debate so can't comment except to say they were not missed.
Agree, but Cruz could have countered. His line was a play on Trump's earlier quip that "not many evengelicals come out of Cuba."

He could have brought this up, then proceeded to explain that his comment was an observation on an electorate that sent Hillary Clinton to the Senate, has a mayor in NYC who's anti-police, and a governor who recently stated that if you are a conservative, you aren't welcome in New York.

Cruz missed an opportunity to explain himself and should not have painted all New Yorkers with a broad brush. My guess is he's written off New York to the Democrats any way, so what the hell?
Trump is such a caricature, I'm still not certain this isn't some publicity stunt or that he's not working as a shill for Hillary.
 

bamacon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Trump's hateful rhetoric toward Muslims (i.e. more than 3 million Americans) is one of the most damaging messages I've heard from a presidential candidate in my lifetime. He's invoked multiple 1940's era policies as modern solutions to the "Muslim problem," despite being illegal, divisive, and profoundly dehumanizing. His words are so internationally shunned that our closest ally is actually debating today whether he should be barred from entering their country.


Believe what you will about the others in this race, but Trump is not suitable to be leader of the free world.
Hateful towards Muslims? All he did was state that he would implement a temporary halt due to the danger faced with how the current system is being overrun. It is nothing many many presidents haven't already done for decades. It used to be standard policy because it is SANE. Research what Carter did and get back to us. Like others pointed out, how the gay and women groups are silent on some of the atrocities towards those two groups in Islamic countries is STUNNING! I've seen animal rights activist show far more passion.
 

ValuJet

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Surveys tell us that 25% of Muslims worldwide believe suicide bombings are justified. That comes to 330 million followers of jihad. Please tell me how there is not a Muslim problem.
 

Tide1986

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

they are literally platforming on who can de-fund it faster and Obamacare does a little in birth control and nothing on sex ed. Next
A little?

The 18 Contraception Categories

Under the Affordable Care Act non-grandfathered plans must cover specified recommended preventive care services without cost sharing, consistent with PHS Act section 2713.
The 18 types of contraception are:
• Sterilization surgery
• Surgical sterilization implant
• Implantable rod
• Copper intrauterine device
• IUDs with progestin (a hormone)
• Shot/injection
• Oral contraceptives (the pill), with estrogen and progestin
• Oral contraceptives with progestin only
• Oral contraceptives, known as extended or continuous use that delay menstruation
• The patch
• Vaginal contraceptive ring
• Diaphragm
• Sponge
• Cervical cap
• Female condom
• Spermicide
• Emergency contraception (Plan B/morning-after pill)
• Emergency contraception (a different pill called Ella)
 

bamacon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

they are literally platforming on who can de-fund it faster and Obamacare does a little in birth control and nothing on sex ed. Next
They say that then they DO the opposite. I'm with you on the disgust level. I lean very libertarian on most things. The govt shouldn't pay for any of that crap.


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Jon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

A little?
but only for those who qualify, right? And only for those who don't already get medicare and many of the Republican Governors won't take the medicare money. The same Governors who are choosing to de-fund Planned Parenthood too where many poor women can actually access this stuff
 

Jon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

They say that then they DO the opposite. I'm with you on the disgust level. I lean very libertarian on most things. The govt shouldn't pay for any of that crap.


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Agreed

but I'd rather pay a few hundred, even a few thousand for contraceptives than whatever massive number it would cost to keep that kid on Welfare till 18 (and then the statistically significant percentage that we'd be paying for beyond that in prisons)
 

Jon

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Trump says he will get Apple to "start building their damn computers and things" back in the US while at Liberty University. Makes no mention of the Trump clothing line made in Mexico and China. FWIW, I don't think he is this dumb, but I do think he thinks you are.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/1/18/10787050/donald-trump-apple-fantasy

Speaking at Liberty University today, Trump escalated his rhetoric on Apple's overseas manufacturing, and claimed somehow the US would reclaim those jobs in the future. "We have such amazing people in this country: smart, sharp, energetic, they're amazing," Trump said. "I was saying make America great again, and I actually think we can say now, and I really believe this, we're gonna get things coming... we're gonna get Apple to start building their damn computers and things in this country, instead of in other countries."

IT'S ALL PART OF TRUMP'S SILLY FANTASY AS KING OF AMERICA

As Gizmodo points out, Donald Trump isn't just going to flip a switch and make something like that happen. It's part of the silly fantasy world Trump has erected in which he's King of America, and so saying things like he's going to bring Apple's damn computers home is mostly empty — the same way his pretension that he can just call up world leaders like Frank Underwood and win huge concessions is ridiculous.
 
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Displaced Bama Fan

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

If he loses, it won't be because conservatives didn't vote for him.
Right now, what choice do conservatives have? If he wins the nomination, there's not a 3rd party candidate that conservatives will turn to, as when Perot split the ticket in 92. They'll either vote for Trump or not at all at this point.
 

92tide

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Trump says he will get Apple to "start building their damn computers and things" back in the US while at Liberty University. Makes no mention of the Trump clothing line made in Mexico and China. FWIW, I don't think he is this dumb, but I do think he thinks you are.

http://www.theverge.com/2016/1/18/10787050/donald-trump-apple-fantasy
if trump is one thing, he is a hell of a pitchman who knows his target audience.
 

Displaced Bama Fan

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Yeah, but I don't think conservatives will be choosing the lesser of two evils. I don't think Trump is particularly conservative, but I think most conservatives have embraced him. The question is whether the center right will support him. It seems pretty clear that he will get an unusual amount of Democrats and African Americans to vote for him, but if the middle craters, he's in trouble. Basically, I think Trump will either win in a landslide with a coalition we've never seen before, or he'll win ten states.
No, he's not conservative in the social sense. I'm most interested in: 1) paying off our debt and 2) getting our federal government back within the prescribed functions as set forth in the Constitution. Unfortunately, I think both are pie in the sky. With the special interests and the puppet masters pulling the strings behind the scenes, I've really reconciled to myself that our country is lost.
 

Tide1986

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

but only for those who qualify, right? And only for those who don't already get medicare and many of the Republican Governors won't take the medicare money. The same Governors who are choosing to de-fund Planned Parenthood too where many poor women can actually access this stuff
Yes, some States have chosen not to incur the additional cost of expanding Medicaid, which has exposed a critical flaw in the ACA. Nevertheless, there is something like 10M more people covered by insurance today. Even I have this wonderful birth control coverage even though it doesn't apply to me.

The defunding of Planned Parenthood is a red herring. In Alabama, actual funding has been less than $5K annually, and there are numerous other clinics that deliver such services.
 
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CharminTide

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Hateful towards Muslims? All he did was state that he would implement a temporary halt due to the danger faced with how the current system is being overrun. It is nothing many many presidents haven't already done for decades. It used to be standard policy because it is SANE. Research what Carter did and get back to us.
No, that is not all he's done. And just to be clear, Trump has not suggested that we close the borders specifically to Syrian refugees (which would be analogous to what Carter did with Iran). Instead, he has actually proposed closing the borders to any person belonging to a specific and major world religion.

In addition, he's repeatedly pushed the (debunked) notion that thousands of Muslims cheered when the WTC buildings collapsed. He stated that he'd support registering all Muslim citizens in a federal database. He has proposed surveillance of mosques and even shutting down certain Muslim places of worship.

Now, if I replace "Muslim" with "Christian," would you consider those ideas to be hateful?
 
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Bazza

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Pew: 8% of U.S. Muslims Say Suicide Bombing, Violence Against Civilian Targets ‘Often’ or ‘Sometimes Justified’



By Michael W. Chapman | December 14, 2015 | 1:11 PM EST

(AP photo)
(CNSNews.com) – Survey data released by the Pew Research Center in 2013 show that 8% of U.S. Muslims believe that the use of “suicide bombing and other forms of violence against civilian targets” is either “often” or “sometimes” justified in defense of Islam.
In surveys conducted in 2011 and 2007, Pew found that 1% of U.S. Muslims said such violence against civilian targets was “often justified,” and another 7% said it was “sometimes justified,” for a total of 8% who said it was either "often justified" or "sometimes justified."
Pew re-reported these numbers in its 2013 report, The World’s Muslims: Religion, Politics and Society.
According to a December 2015 “key findings” update, Pew says there are an estimated 2.75 million Muslims in the United States of all ages, and that 1.8 million of them are adults.




Although 81% of U.S. Muslims said such violence was “never justified,” 1% said it was “often justified” and 7% said it was “sometimes justified.”
Another 5% said it was “rarely justified.” (Those were the numbers both times, in 2007 and in 2011.)
When Pew asked the same question of Muslims in other countries in 2011, it found, for instance, that 28% of Egyptian Muslims believe that suicide bombing or other forms of violence against civilian targets was “often” or “sometimes” justified to defend Islam.
In Indonesia, the number was 10% of the Muslims population; Jordan, 13%; Lebanon, 35%; Pakistan, 5%; and Turkey, 7%.

 

Tide1986

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Re: Can Trump Really Win the Presidency?

Interesting...

http://theweek.com/articles/599577/how-obscure-adviser-pat-buchanan-predicted-wild-trump-campaign-1996


What if you dropped all this leftover 19th-century piety about the free market and promised to fight the elites who were selling out American jobs? What if you just stopped talking about reforming Medicare and Social Security and instead said that the elites were failing to deliver better health care at a reasonable price? What if, instead of vainly talking about restoring the place of religion in society — something that appeals only to a narrow slice of Middle America — you simply promised to restore the Middle American core — the economic and cultural losers of globalization — to their rightful place in America? What if you said you would restore them as the chief clients of the American state under your watch, being mindful of their interests when regulating the economy or negotiating trade deals?

That's pretty much the advice that columnist Samuel Francis gave to Pat Buchanan in a 1996 essay, "
From Household to Nation," in Chronicles magazine.
The political left treats this as a made-up problem, a scapegoating by Applebee's-eating, megachurch rubes who think they are losing their "jerbs." Remember, Republicans and Democrats have still been getting elected all this time.

But the response of the predominantly-white class that Francis was writing about has mostly been one of personal despair. And thus we see them dying in middle age of drug overdose, alcoholism, or obesity at rates that now outpace those of even poorer blacks and Hispanics. Their rate of suicide is sky high too. Living in Washington D.C., however, with an endless two decade real-estate boom, and a free-lunch economy paid for by special interests, most of the people in the conservative movement hardly know that some Americans think America needs to be made great again.
But the Trump phenomenon also seems global and inevitable. America's elite class belongs to a truly global class of elites. And everywhere in Europe that global class is being challenged by anti-immigrant, occasionally-protectionist parties who do not parrot free-market economic policies, but instead promise to use the levers of the state to protect native interests. In Russia, Putin's populist nationalism has taken over a major state apparatus, precisely to avenge itself on the paladins of the free-market.

What is so crucial to Trump's success, even within the Republican Party, is his almost total ditching of conservatism as a governing philosophy. He is doing the very thing Pat Buchanan could not, and would not do. And in this, he is following the advice of Sam Francis to a degree almost unthinkable.


What so frightens the conservative movement about Trump's success is that he reveals just how thin the support for their ideas really is. His campaign is a rebuke to their institutions. It says the Republican Party doesn't need all these think tanks, all this supposed policy expertise. It says look at these people calling themselves libertarians and conservatives, the ones in tassel-loafers and bow ties. Have they made you more free? Have their endless policy papers and studies and books conserved anything for you? These people are worthless. They are defunct. You don't need them, and you're better off without them.

And the most frightening thing of all — as Francis' advice shows — is that the underlying trend has been around for at least 20 years, just waiting for the right man to come along and take advantage.
 
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