2016 Season QB Thread

Sabanizer · Sep 8, 2016

Alasippi said:
Blake isn't better than AJ or Coker at any level of comparison. Come on.

To be fair, potential and what I saw in one game as a freshman. Neither is Hurts. But Barnett was rated higher in recruiting than all of them. I saw two NFL throws in his first game, folks can say he was nervous at the start, who isn't, and that the plays were after the game was in hand, but who knows how he would have played if not taken out. He was 2/3 and ended up 5/6. Bottom line, and I believe coaches will agree, USC trenches did not define this team nor its qb of the future.

Barnett is Bateman with an NFL arm. We will see how good both are when the run is shut down, and that will be in the next 3 games. Neother will be out of the race til that point if you read between the lines of CNS. We have NFL RB's. a NFL TE. 4 NFL WR's, and a solid OL. Who can get the energy from this array of talent via Lane Kiffin? That is the question. It will not be one one guy with the team on his back every week.

I need to see if Jlalen has an NFL arm, I do not know that yet. I do believe Barnett has the best arm and our RB's have the best potential to gain yardage. That is how we have won 4 NC's. Til next week!. I mean it, I am off this thread til we see more

But will read.

RTR91 · Sep 8, 2016

CullmanTide said:
Well in A-Day games they can't run and against SC he only got 4 drives. Neither guy has proved much so far but potential is there.

Check this RBR link. During the third quarter, he didn't keep the ball on a zone-read. So let's not act like he didn't get a chance.

www.rollbamaroll.com/2016/9/7/12820328/alabama-football-film-review-blake-barnett-vs-usc

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RTR91 · Sep 8, 2016

Sabanizer said:
To be fair, potential and what I saw in one game as a freshman. Neither is Hurts. But Barnett was rated higher in recruiting than all of them. I saw two NFL throws in his first game, folks can say he was nervous at the start, who isn't, and that the plays were after the game was in hand, but who knows how he would have played if not taken out. He was 2/3 and ended up 5/6. Bottom line, and I believe coaches will agree, USC trenches did not define this team nor its qb of the future.

Barnett is Bateman with an NFL arm. We will see how good both are when the run is shut down, and that will be in the next 3 games. Neother will be out of the race til that point if you read between the lines of CNS. We have NFL RB's. a NFL TE. 4 NFL WR's, and a solid OL. Who can get the energy from this array of talent via Lane Kiffin? That is the question. It will not be one one guy with the team on his back every week.

I need to see if Jlalen has an NFL arm, I do not know that yet. I do believe Barnett has the best arm and our RB's have the best potential to gain yardage. That is how we have won 4 NC's. Til next week!. I mean it, I am off this thread til we see more But will read.

You've mentioned it before, so I have to ask - what makes you think a dual threat QB will have to carry the team on his back?

Did Blake Sims really do that?

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Sabanizer · Sep 8, 2016

RTR91 said:
You've mentioned it before, so I have to ask - what makes you think a dual threat QB will have to carry the team on his back?

Did Blake Sims really do that?

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There was a perception that he played better on the road than at home. I want to stress this has nothing to do with anything other than a dual threat, who has added responsibility, vs a pocket passer that can run. Blake, a recruited athlete, I think always had in the back of his mind that he could take off and run, which created more hot and cold.

If not for talent across the board would I not be for the dual threat way. But we are stacked on offense. Preseason awe aside, the guy that can get the ball most effectively to our receivers when the run game is bogged down will win over the team. With Barnett I saw reads that got the ball to to open receiver. The open 10 yard busted coverage pass to Stewart was telegraphed from Kiffin in some way, imo. Seems logical to have a whistle (really), or an ear phone. But Barnett went through reads for his TD and dart that I know came from him.

One passed for 118 and the other 100. One had an additional 2 td's rushing but with an int and disputable fumble.

We are loaded, I want the game manger QB, but with NFL skills downfield. I may be the fool 2 weeks from now. But BB to me? Is AJ but always a year ahead. Then again..... I am out til next week. Both of these guys are exceptional.

CoolBreeze · Sep 9, 2016

120 pages, wow! I love this thread. Saban has brought so many good players to the capstone. But Quarterback? I suppose AJ would be the one that had the most potential realized talent that came to Alabama in his tenure. But Saturday night I saw an elite player, a game changer. For me, all the fears I had coming into the season about a repeat national championship faded in the course of about 30 minutes. I think we are on the cusp of witnessing something special. He is most certainly a three year player and probably our 3rd Heisman winner. But that is his potential and I certainly will not name him because we Tide Fans love our team and players so much we have a tendency to put way too much pressure on them. But this kid is the real deal and you all know who I am talking about. He oozes confidence and lifts the whole team, offense and defense. I am praying he stays healthy and free of injury. If he does...watch out!!!

KrAzY3 · Sep 9, 2016

In terms of comparing the running abilities of Barnett, Hurts and Bateman, prior to the spring I was openly questioning if Bateman was really was a runner at all. There was good reason to believe running was part of his game, he was tried out as receiver, we were told he was fast, even his start against Ole Miss seemed to indicate he had another skill set from Coker (mobility). Yet, he simply did not run. I can't recall seeing him run in scrimmages or in actual games. I believed then and I believe now that Bateman simply lacked the instincts of a runner. He might have great straight line speed, and if you just leave unattended he might run, but I felt running wasn't even the last resort for him, he'd throw the ball away before he chose to run.

I think Barnett is more of an opportunistic runner than Hurts though. I've seen him run a lot, he does run, he can run effectively. He doesn't have lightning fast speed, but he's mobile, he's agile, but it is worth remembering he also isn't built quite like Hurts either. I think Barnett fits the mold more of what Alabama used to want out of a quarterback. He can make all the throws, he is capable of sitting in the pocket and doing everything he needs to do, and his running ability augments his game but isn't a necessary component. I think he's more of the type of runner that just takes advantage of opportunities to run when they present themself,

Hurts is just a natural runner. Watching him at A-Day dodge touch tackles was almost comical. Yes, he's fast, but his instincts in the backfield are unlike any Nick Saban quarterback (including Blake Sims). He's so comfortable back there, and when he makes the choice to run he really knows what he needs to do. To me it isn't a matter of Barnett lacking as running threat, but that Hurts is such a great running threat. I should note though that Hurts might want to run a bit too much, which carries certain risks and might not always be what Alabama can or wants to do. This is one reason that the QB race might not be over yet.

B1GTide · Sep 9, 2016

AJ was a kick-six away from playing for, and likely winning, 3 BCS championships in a row as the starting QB for Alabama. His play was essential in winning a lot of huge games for Alabama during that span, and his play never cost you a game - not one. If either Barnett or Hurts is nearly as good, you guys will be very lucky, indeed. You guys don't give AJ enough credit.

CajunCrimson · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
But unlike Bateman and other mid tenure QB Saban recruits, Barnett went on to excel as a senior and win the coveted Elite 11 Championship, where Bateman faltered. Yes we recruit QB's their junior year, but the Kiffin recruits improved their stock. That is why Batman ended up a 4 star and Barnett a consensus 5.

if Batman was only a four star.....

CaliforniaTide · Sep 9, 2016

B1GTide said:
AJ was a kick-six away from playing for, and likely winning, 3 BCS championships in a row as the starting QB for Alabama. His play was essential in winning a lot of huge games for Alabama during that span, and his play never cost you a game - not one. If either Barnett or Hurts is nearly as good, you guys will be very lucky, indeed. You guys don't give AJ enough credit.

I actually agree with the sentiment. Even in his first year as a starter, he wasn't much of a liability in what he was asked to do.

RTR91 · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
There was a perception that he played better on the road than at home. I want to stress this has nothing to do with anything other than a dual threat, who has added responsibility, vs a pocket passer that can run. Blake, a recruited athlete, I think always had in the back of his mind that he could take off and run, which created more hot and cold.

Taking your comments together, I gather you believe the perception of Sims playing better on the road than at home (stats show otherwise BTW) is because he was a DT guy. Is that accurate?

If not for talent across the board would I not be for the dual threat way. But we are stacked on offense. Preseason awe aside, the guy that can get the ball most effectively to our receivers when the run game is bogged down will win over the team. With Barnett I saw reads that got the ball to to open receiver. The open 10 yard busted coverage pass to Stewart was telegraphed from Kiffin in some way, imo. Seems logical to have a whistle (really), or an ear phone. But Barnett went through reads for his TD and dart that I know came from him.

One passed for 118 and the other 100. One had an additional 2 td's rushing but with an int and disputable fumble.

We are loaded, I want the game manger QB, but with NFL skills downfield. I may be the fool 2 weeks from now. But BB to me? Is AJ but always a year ahead. Then again..... I am out til next week. Both of these guys are exceptional.

Just a reminder or some info for those that don't follow recruiting. Barnett was considered a dual-threat QB by some recruiting sites. He didn't care for it, though.

What makes you think Kiffin telegraphed the Stewart touchdown? Have you seen a clip of him waving his arms at Ardarius? The only clips and analysis of it I've seen has shown Hurts seeing the blitz coming and realizing the busted coverage.

You admit if Alabama didn't have as much talent as it does you would want a dual threat QB. Why does having more talent make it easier for you to say no to one? If anything, the talent makes it harder for the defense to prepare.

KrAzY3 said:
In terms of comparing the running abilities of Barnett, Hurts and Bateman, prior to the spring I was openly questioning if Bateman was really was a runner at all. There was good reason to believe running was part of his game, he was tried out as receiver, we were told he was fast, even his start against Ole Miss seemed to indicate he had another skill set from Coker (mobility). Yet, he simply did not run. I can't recall seeing him run in scrimmages or in actual games. I believed then and I believe now that Bateman simply lacked the instincts of a runner. He might have great straight line speed, and if you just leave unattended he might run, but I felt running wasn't even the last resort for him, he'd throw the ball away before he chose to run.

I think Barnett is more of an opportunistic runner than Hurts though. I've seen him run a lot, he does run, he can run effectively. He doesn't have lightning fast speed, but he's mobile, he's agile, but it is worth remembering he also isn't built quite like Hurts either. I think Barnett fits the mold more of what Alabama used to want out of a quarterback. He can make all the throws, he is capable of sitting in the pocket and doing everything he needs to do, and his running ability augments his game but isn't a necessary component. I think he's more of the type of runner that just takes advantage of opportunities to run when they present themself,

Hurts is just a natural runner. Watching him at A-Day dodge touch tackles was almost comical. Yes, he's fast, but his instincts in the backfield are unlike any Nick Saban quarterback (including Blake Sims). He's so comfortable back there, and when he makes the choice to run he really knows what he needs to do. To me it isn't a matter of Barnett lacking as running threat, but that Hurts is such a great running threat. I should note though that Hurts might want to run a bit too much, which carries certain risks and might not always be what Alabama can or wants to do. This is one reason that the QB race might not be over yet.

Krazy, you're description of Barnett is pretty accurate. I believe he was asked to run in high school, which is why he got the Dual-Threat title during the recruiting process, but he fought to change that title with his performances in camps prior to his senior year.

BamaMoon · Sep 9, 2016

CoolBreeze said:
120 pages, wow! I love this thread. Saban has brought so many good players to the capstone. But Quarterback? I suppose AJ would be the one that had the most potential realized talent that came to Alabama in his tenure. But Saturday night I saw an elite player, a game changer. For me, all the fears I had coming into the season about a repeat national championship faded in the course of about 30 minutes. I think we are on the cusp of witnessing something special. He is most certainly a three year player and probably our 3rd Heisman winner. But that is his potential and I certainly will not name him because we Tide Fans love our team and players so much we have a tendency to put way too much pressure on them. But this kid is the real deal and you all know who I am talking about. He oozes confidence and lifts the whole team, offense and defense. I am praying he stays healthy and free of injury. If he does...watch out!!!

LOL...not naming him doesn't put pressure on him??? Fan expectations on Hurts is out of control based on a pretty small sample...which was granted electric...but there is so much more he needs to do in order to become the type of player who leads us to NCs and to win the Heisman. I mean, we are getting a little carried away here. I mean he had a fumble and threw a pretty bad INT, that in a tight game would have gotten us beat.

If he continues to improve, which I think he will, and he wins some tight games then they hype machine will be cranked up even more by the media.

And then there is Barnett, who had similar numbers (granted in mop up duty) but it seems people are dismissing The truth is we have similar stats and playing time to judge them both by and we haven't even seen them play an entire game in college but many are crowning Hurts as our next Heisman and Barnett as a our next transfer.

I think we need to slow down!

B1GTide said:
AJ was a kick-six away from playing for, and likely winning, 3 BCS championships in a row as the starting QB for Alabama. His play was essential in winning a lot of huge games for Alabama during that span, and his play never cost you a game - not one. If either Barnett or Hurts is nearly as good, you guys will be very lucky, indeed. You guys don't give AJ enough credit.

You won't ever hear me cut on AJ. Best QB we've had at Bama since the 1960s and I don't see how that is even debatable. His 3 rings (2 as a starter) speak for themselves.

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

CajunCrimson said:
if Batman was only a four star.....

We are talking about Superman.
Your right, Batman is a 5 star in my book......

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

B1GTide said:
AJ was a kick-six away from playing for, and likely winning, 3 BCS championships in a row as the starting QB for Alabama. His play was essential in winning a lot of huge games for Alabama during that span, and his play never cost you a game - not one. If either Barnett or Hurts is nearly as good, you guys will be very lucky, indeed. You guys don't give AJ enough credit.

You must have been talking about me for leaving out the word potential? I later corrected. As a fan that has missed very few games in 40 years, yes I know his worth. On the flip side of the kicksix, he also was able the play in a NC game to a team that had beaten us regular season and without winning the conference, so AJ had good fortune on both sides, the uproar ushered in the Playoff's (Oky State). GMac 1-2 NC's, I SEC. AJ 2-3 NC's, 1 SEC. Blake 0-1 NC's with 1 SEC. Coker 1-1 NC's with 1 SEC. All pocket passer's. A good record.

Blake is the highest rated quarterback maybe since Namath, so talking potential should not be meant as a jab at anyone else. We are all curious to see how he pans out. But he made throws as a Freshman that are very encouraging, and it was not mop up duty if you watched the FSU game. He came in early in the 3rd.

To hype one players does not mean you do not appreciate others. I was one of the few that predicted AJ would play his 3 year, most, including him had the word out that he would leave as a 2nd rounder after his Junior year. I did not. Considering our QB record in the modern era, being a solid backup and I hope more is where I expected him. He should have been a 2nd rounder not 4th, or whatever it was.

We all know that AJ was the best of the bunch and could have won 3. Maybe those are the people that like QB's in his mold? Like when the game comes down to putting the ball in Keven Norwoods hands with pin point accuracy to win. The recievers now are similar in strength to AJ's 2nd year starting.

TiderJack · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
You must have been talking about me for leaving out the word potential? I later corrected. As a fan that has missed very few games in 40 years, yes I know his worth. On the flip side of the kicksix, he also was able the play in a NC game to a team that had beaten us regular season and without winning the conference, so AJ had good fortune on both sides, the uproar ushered in the Playoff's (Oky State). GMac 1-2 NC's, I SEC. AJ 2-3 NC's, 1 SEC. Blake 0-1 NC's with 1 SEC. Coker 1-1 NC's with 1 SEC. All pocket passer's. A good record.

Blake is the highest rated quarterback maybe since Namath, so talking potential should not be meant as a jab at anyone else. We are all curious to see how he pans out. But he made throws as a Freshman that are very encouraging, and it was not mop up duty if you watched the FSU game. He came in early in the 3rd.

To hype one players does not mean you do not appreciate others. I was one of the few that predicted AJ would play his 3 year, most, including him had the word out that he would leave as a 2nd rounder after his Junior year. I did not. Considering our QB record in the modern era, being a solid backup and I hope more is where I expected him. He should have been a 2nd rounder not 4th, or whatever it was.

We all know that AJ was the best of the bunch and could have won 3. Maybe those are the people that like QB's in his mold? Like when the game comes down to putting the ball in Keven Norwoods hands with pin point accuracy to win. The recievers now are similar in strength to AJ's 2nd year starting.

Based on several of your comments you seem to think Jalen can't throw the ball since he is an elusive, running QB also. The kid can throw it and I believe we will see him in some drop back situations that will impress as much as his roll out and running abilities. I think we have 2 very capable guys and we have a very good problem at QB that I don't believe we have ever had at Bama.

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

delete

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
No, Jalen has as much or more support than Blake on this thread. You saying that Jalen cannot scramble or take off? IF Jalen had a better arm and legs than Barnett, why did Barnett start? If Jalen has 80% of Blake's arm, with his legs? He will be the best Q

Are you saying that Blake cannot scramble and run? Only Jalen? That they are both equal in arm and legs? If praise means you are condemning the other guy, then you need to look at the entire thread, and your posts.

If Jalen has 80% of Blake's arm then he should be the starter. If he had Blake's arm, considering his running advantage, why did Blake even start? It would have been no contest since he step food on campus.

After one game this is subjective. I believe I know how the coaches are going to handle this. We have a lot to learn, and til next week. (mean it this time)

TiderJack · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
No, Jalen has as much or more support than Blake on this thread. You saying that Jalen cannot scramble or take off? IF Jalen had a better arm and legs than Barnett, why did Barnett start? If Jalen has 80% of Blake's arm, with his legs? He will be the best Q

1. I was not talking about others on the board.

2. Don't know how to respond to your 2nd sentence.

3. Blake started because he had an extra years experience and knew the playbook better. I'm assuming you watched the game and saw Jalen take 75% of the snaps.

4. Agreed and think he will.

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

TiderJ said:
1. I was not talking about others on the board.

2. Don't know how to respond to your 2nd sentence.

3. Blake started because he had an extra years experience and knew the playbook better. I'm assuming you watched the game and saw Jalen take 75% of the snaps.

4. Agreed and think he will.

.Let me answer since you asked. With your logic Bateman should have started the game. One is a Freshman, the other a redshirt freshman that got off to a sickly start last year with a blood disease. Jalen was here for spring ball, it is not that much of a gap. I will stand by that Barnett has the better arm and Jalen the better legs, not saying neither is lacking in the other department. I believe many are on the hype train, that one is 100% better than the other, I believe, and have said over and over

, that BOTH are exceptional. One saw more action this week, but we will get a better judge in the weeks to come, and they will come.

BB came out because of what the defense was showing and us blowing them off the line more than nerves, what Freshman quarterback didn't on his first 2 or 3 drives. Coach Saban suggested that the approach to how they play will evolve. Cam Newton = Jalen Hurts Legs and BB's arm imo.

Thank everyone for reading too many words. See you next week. If I offended anyone or they have questions, I have made enough posts to answer all. I get obsessive, but it is all subjective until later. I could very well have egg on face......but I doubt it.

RTR91 · Sep 9, 2016

Sabanizer said:
But he made throws as a Freshman that are very encouraging, and it was not mop up duty if you watched the FSU game. He came in early in the 3rd.

Jalen's fourth touchdown came with 5:53 left in the third quarter. So I don't think BB reentered the game "early in the 3rd." And if you don't think a 32 point lead is mop up duty, what is it?

Sabanizer said:
.Let me answer since you asked. With your logic Bateman should have started the game. One is a Freshman, the other a redshirt freshman that got off to a sickly start last year with a blood disease. Jalen was here for spring ball, it is not that much of a gap. I will stand by that Barnett has the better arm and Jalen the better legs, not saying neither is lacking in the other department. I believe many are on the hype train, that one is 100% better than the other, I believe, and have said over and over , that BOTH are exceptional. One saw more action this week, but we will get a better judge in the weeks to come, and they will come.

So because Jalen has gotten a bunch of hype and praise from practice observes, those that attend scrimmages and those that watched the game Saturday, you feel the need to defend Blake Barnett to remind everyone he also played? That's pretty much what you're saying.

What does it matter if one player is talked about more than an other? No one seems to think that way with any other position.

Sabanizer · Sep 9, 2016

RTR91 said:
Jalen's fourth touchdown came with 5:53 left in the third quarter. So I don't think BB reentered the game "early in the 3rd." And if you don't think a 32 point lead is mop up duty, what is it?

So because Jalen has gotten a bunch of hype and praise from practice observes, those that attend scrimmages and those that watched the game Saturday, you feel the need to defend Blake Barnett to remind everyone he also played? That's pretty much what you're saying.

What does it matter if one player is talked about more than an other? No one seems to think that way with any other position.

Yes, people are more sensitive with a quarterback situation, especially a scrambling pro style vs a dual threat. I think the entire game was mop up duty, we blew them off the line. And BB made the most of his time. Remeber Simms mop up? We didn't even know hos good he was until the next season, he just handed the ball off. Next week!

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