News Article: CECIL HURT: Lesson from Baylor - Don't Let It Happen Here

RTR91

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Nov 23, 2007
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Not posting this in the Baylor thread because Cecil hits on a broader scale, and knowing TF, it would derail the Baylor thread into a thread on the national scale/topic.

Link


Baylor University didn't sleepwalk into the blasted landscape in which it finds itself today. The school, which fired its football coach, Art Briles, and semi-deposed its president, Ken Starr, on Thursday didn't wake up after a long nap and rub its eyes only to find everything falling down around its figurative ears.

There were willing decisions right down the line in a case involving years of sexual-assault cover-up (with which the Waco Police appear to have been complicit) and repeated enabling. There was, over and over, a systemic reluctance to challenge an increasingly successful athletics program. The results of a review conducted by the Pepper Hamilton law firm into a growing number of complaints showed that Baylor officials repeatedly gave the benefit of the doubt, and more, to male athletes over their female accusers.
 

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
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I'll say this, I've tried to distinguish between victimless crimes like drug possession and crimes like theft or assault. I think breaking rules should be met with punishment, but it should also fit the crime. I've also tried to distinguish between for instance being present or a participant in a crime and actually committing assault. I don't think you can treat each individual the same, if one guy beats someone up and the other doesn't, I think one is more deserving of a second chance than another. I am not of the lock them up and throw away the key mentality when it comes to many transgressions.

However, when it comes to abuse of women I think we have to exercise an abundance of caution. The only time I really had serious misgivings about Saban's approach in terms of discipline was when he let someone onto the team that had been accused of domestic violence. It should be noted there was no coverup, there was no indication of a corrupt underbelly in that case. Besides, an accusation in and of itself is not guilt, and domestic violence is not rape, but it's dangerous territory. Abused women are extremely vulnerable, there are many examples of repeated abuse, and escalation of abuse to the victim and by the perpetrators. We can not and should not give the abuser the benefit of a doubt in these cases. We have to side with the victims, we have to err on the side of caution, and if the individual is exonerated society is eager enough to put that behind them (how much have we heard about the Kobe rape allegations lately?).

It is clear who needs protection here, and it's not the football players! If you combine what we've seen at FSU, Penn State, Baylor, and Tennessee, we have a disgusting map of what goes on behind closed doors. There are lawyer lists provided to athletes, this is how someone like Jameis Winston can end up with FSU's attorney representing him. There is victim intimidation, this is how a Baylor coach or Joe Paterno might end up talking to the victim, as though it is somehow their place to intervene. There are courtesy calls, that's how Winston could lawyer up before he's ever questioned. There are coverups, actions which prevent the public from being made aware of dangerous individuals. All these things are born out of a system that put the football program and the players above everything else.

I do not see a big deal with some of this behavior as it related to someone getting caught with pot, or those sort of minor offenses. However, that support structure must not remain intact in support of violent predators! They must be dealt with, they must be brought to justice, and no one is above being held accountable. I do not care who it is that does this sort of thing, what player, what coach, they have to be held accountable immediately.
 

TIDE-HSV

Senior Administrator
Staff member
Oct 13, 1999
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It is clear who needs protection here, and it's not the football players! If you combine what we've seen at FSU, Penn State, Baylor, and Tennessee, we have a disgusting map of what goes on behind closed doors. There are lawyer lists provided to athletes, this is how someone like Jameis Winston can end up with FSU's attorney representing him. There is victim intimidation, this is how a Baylor coach or Joe Paterno might end up talking to the victim, as though it is somehow their place to intervene. There are courtesy calls, that's how Winston could lawyer up before he's ever questioned. There are coverups, actions which prevent the public from being made aware of dangerous individuals. All these things are born out of a system that put the football program and the players above everything else.
Don't forget super sleuth Fulmer...
 

owenfieldreams

Big-12 All American
Sep 8, 2002
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One aspect of this whole sordid affair that isn't getting much pub is the Baylor code of ethics. As a Baptist school, Baylor has a strict code of ethics dealing specifically with improper relationships and alcohol consumption. More than one of the victims has mentioned how this code was turned against them when they blew the whistle. Because of the risk of expulsion these women had to tread lightly around the specific circumstances surrounding the assaults. In certain instances questioning by the powers that be tried to lead them in the direction of ethics violations. This is a classic example of taking a moral foundation with good intentions and using it with malice. There's a lot of hypocrisy involved here and knowing Baylor as I do its not surprising.
 

gtowntide

All-American
Mar 1, 2011
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One aspect of this whole sordid affair that isn't getting much pub is the Baylor code of ethics. As a Baptist school, Baylor has a strict code of ethics dealing specifically with improper relationships and alcohol consumption. More than one of the victims has mentioned how this code was turned against them when they blew the whistle. Because of the risk of expulsion these women had to tread lightly around the specific circumstances surrounding the assaults. In certain instances questioning by the powers that be tried to lead them in the direction of ethics violations. This is a classic example of taking a moral foundation with good intentions and using it with malice. There's a lot of hypocrisy involved here and knowing Baylor as I do its not surprising.
Wow, whoever did this needs to be punished beyond the normal. This is just plain evil!
 

TommyMac

Hall of Fame
Apr 24, 2001
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One aspect of this whole sordid affair that isn't getting much pub is the Baylor code of ethics. As a Baptist school, Baylor has a strict code of ethics dealing specifically with improper relationships and alcohol consumption. More than one of the victims has mentioned how this code was turned against them when they blew the whistle. Because of the risk of expulsion these women had to tread lightly around the specific circumstances surrounding the assaults. In certain instances questioning by the powers that be tried to lead them in the direction of ethics violations. This is a classic example of taking a moral foundation with good intentions and using it with malice. There's a lot of hypocrisy involved here and knowing Baylor as I do its not surprising.


And yet Ken Starr still has a job there?
 

TrampLineman

Hall of Fame
Jul 21, 2010
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That's why I'm glad we got coach here. Him having a daughter, I could see no way in any shape or form him overlooking these kinds of things or even try to get one of his own "out of the trouble" per say. I mean he fired Bo Davis for just lying to him, much less him keeping a player charged with rape or sex assault and him failing to get rid of the player no matter who he is. Crap even the Baldwin ordeal he sent him packing right away and it wasn't like Baldwin was a walk on either. You just can't allow something like that to go on and Briles found out the hard way in this day and time football players are NOT going to be able to act like they want to.

I REALLY feel sorry for those poor girls involved in all of this.
 

Bama Reb

Suspended
Nov 2, 2005
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When it comes to either winning at fb or protecting our women from harm, it's a no-brainer. Football is only a game, and it means nothing if our women can't walk around freely without fear of being attacked and violated.
 

CrimsonEyeshade

Hall of Fame
Nov 6, 2007
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..... so explain me why Ken Starr still has a job? He, of all people, know the law and how the case of an alleged victim of rape should be handled.
Face-saving. He raised a fortune and a half for the school and will be given the opportunity to quietly exit, stage left.
 

RTR91

Super Moderator
Nov 23, 2007
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..... so explain me why Ken Starr still has a job? He, of all people, know the law and how the case of an alleged victim of rape should be handled.
I've heard some explain Baylor may have been advised by its lawyers to keep Starr and the AD until a certain point due to their contracts. I would think their lack of action would void the contracts, but I also don't know the language in the contracts.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Bamadonk

Scout Team
Sep 18, 2005
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[ You just can't allow something like that to go on and Briles found out the hard way in this day and time football players are NOT going to be able to act like they want to.]

Unless you are at Florida State.
 

Redwood Forrest

Hall of Fame
Sep 19, 2003
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Face-saving. He raised a fortune and a half for the school and will be given the opportunity to quietly exit, stage left.
Well, since these same people DID NOTHING BUT LOOK THE OTHER WAY on these crimes I would venture that NONE OF THEM ARE SORRY for those women but are only sorry they got caught. They seem to be hunkering down until it blows over. I wish everyone of those who had a part in the cover ups the worse possible luck they could have.
 

RTR91

Super Moderator
Nov 23, 2007
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Well, since these same people DID NOTHING BUT LOOK THE OTHER WAY on these crimes I would venture that NONE OF THEM ARE SORRY for those women but are only sorry they got caught. They seem to be hunkering down until it blows over. I wish everyone of those who had a part in the cover ups the worse possible luck they could have.
A couple of weeks ago, a Dallas reporter on Finebaum mentioned them possibly trying to let it all blow over during the summer months. Them firing Briles and moving others around is proof they are not going to let it blow over. The rest of coaching staff is very unlikely to stay. There's going to be a new AD and new president, and that's not including any other possible changes.

"Hunkering down until it blows over" would be firing a couple of position coaches and putting all blame on those guys, not firing the football coach that made the program relevant.
 

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