Has the Kicking Game become less important?

Redwood Forrest

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Gene Stallings and Pat Dye will hate this.

The top four teams last year and their special teams national average rank:

Oklahoma ...... 42
Alabama ........ 45
Clemson ........ 49
Mich St .......... 80

http://myteamsbetter.com/#COMPARE_T...iew=Special Teams&compareOption=ALL_OPPONENTS

I hate trying to win a game punting, much rather play to win than not lose. I wonder what the kicking game stats for 1980 looked like? I am trying to find them.
 

B1GTide

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No - Just looking at Alabama, you won a national championship because of your kicker in 2009 and lost a shot at a championship because of your kicker in 2013. You almost lost out on another championship in 2011 because of your kicker.
 

Redwood Forrest

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No - Just looking at Alabama, you won a national championship because of your kicker in 2009 and lost a shot at a championship because of your kicker in 2013. You almost lost out on another championship in 2011 because of your kicker.
There are 41 teams higher than these four :conf2:
 

Redwood Forrest

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We win games with field goals sometimes, but FG don't win games. How many games have we won with an Onside Kick? Not many. Yes, I did not mean to infer the Kicking Game is not important, it is just not the most important part -- until it goes wrong, as you said, just ask Clemson. Coach Stallings and Coach Dye used to infer it was the most important part. Of course, they had rather win a game 2-0 than 35 -0. 2-0, now that was football to them.
 

crimsonaudio

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In the NC game Alabama hit 1 of 2 FGs, Clemson hit 2 of 3. If Bama had missed both and Clemson hit all three, the outcome might have been very different. Drake's TD and Alabama's onside kickoff also make me think the kicking game is as important as ever...
 

Relayer

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I guess I don't understand the OP at all. I don't see having the punter be a weapon (as Bama has) as playing to 'not lose'.

I see it as a key part of the team aspect, especially against evenly matched opponents. For punters it can mean flipping the field, pinning the opponent deep in their own territory, etc., making things easier for your defense and your offense.
 

Redwood Forrest

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I guess I don't understand the OP at all. I don't see having the punter be a weapon (as Bama has) as playing to 'not lose'.

I see it as a key part of the team aspect, especially against evenly matched opponents. For punters it can mean flipping the field, pinning the opponent deep in their own territory, etc., making things easier for your defense and your offense.
In the Gene Stallings/Pat Dye era they played not to lose. Spurrier, on the other hand, played to win. That was what I was talking about. Spurrier hated kicking FG's and he hated punting. And he said so. That was what I meant.
 

luvthat_TIDE

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The on-side kick this year was perfectly executed, and probably the single biggest play of the game. Some may say that is special teams, still part of the kicking game non the less.
 

Crimson1967

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In the Gene Stallings/Pat Dye era they played not to lose. Spurrier, on the other hand, played to win. That was what I was talking about. Spurrier hated kicking FG's and he hated punting. And he said so. That was what I meant.
Stallings and Spurrier won the same number of national championships.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Relayer

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In the Gene Stallings/Pat Dye era they played not to lose. Spurrier, on the other hand, played to win. That was what I was talking about. Spurrier hated kicking FG's and he hated punting. And he said so. That was what I meant.
I see what you mean. I still look at it as trying to win with your defense. I love defense.
 

Ldlane

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Nov 26, 2002
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Field Goals and Extra Points are never important until you actually need one to win a game.
 

Redwood Forrest

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I see what you mean. I still look at it as trying to win with your defense. I love defense.
Oh, I love the D too. I loathe the 65-58 games. I like a good O and a great D. The one concession I would give the kicking game is the punter. A great punter is a huge asset. I have noticed over the years that when we are getting 35 yd punts off and the other guys are getting 55 yds that it is hard to make up those 20 yds.

I never meant to infer the kicking game was not important, just not as important as it used to be (if Stallings and Dye were right). I have looked all over the net and can't find any national kicking game avgs. to compare with.
 

selmaborntidefan

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In the Gene Stallings/Pat Dye era they played not to lose. Spurrier, on the other hand, played to win. That was what I was talking about. Spurrier hated kicking FG's and he hated punting. And he said so. That was what I meant.

1) Gene Stallings and Pat Dye coached when games could end in ties. Stallings' last year was the first year of overtime. So even making this comparison is borderline absurd.

2) How many times at Florida did Spurrier even play a game close enough that it really mattered?

I had to look over the details for Spurrier because I didn't watch a lot of his Florida games unless they involved us. I know that in 1994, his team blew a 31-3 fourth quarter lead and wound up with a tie to FSU. The 1999 Swamp win that we got was US playing not to 'lose even worse' and we got bailed out by a fumbled punt.

Spurrier rarely played a close game. Even when he lost, it was usually a rout (like the 1999 SECCG and the 1996 Fiesta Bowl). Stallings, on the other hand, coached THIRTY games in seven years where the final result was eight points or less. That's 4-plus games PER SEASON where it came down

3) Kicking Game Results That Have Affected Alabama Since 2006 Via The Field Goal (Hit or Miss)

a) Alabama-Arkansas 2006
b) Alabama-LSU 2008 (LSU blocked FG and we had to go to OT)
c) Alabama-Vols 2009
d) Texas-Nebraska 2009 (if Lawerence misses the FG, we don't play Texas)
e) LSU-Alabama 2011
f) Okie State-Iowa State 2011 (if OSU kicks it.....)
g) Oregon-USC 2011
h) Boise St- TCU 2011 (missed FG costs Boise the game)


WITHOUT THE LAST THREE, Alabama does not play LSU in a rematch.

i) 2012 Alabama-UGA (if Saban doesn't go for two early, UGA has a shot to tie it on that last drive)
j) 2012 Oregon-Stanford (Oregon went for two early and later missed a FG that cost them the game)
k) 2013 Alabama- Auburn (I don't blame Griffith for the miss, but if we TCB, he's not even in the game)
l) 2014 LSU-Alabama (remember that entire bizarre sequence?)
m) 2015 Mich St-Ohio St (if the Spartans don't kick that FG and the Buckeyes win in OT.....we may not make the playoff.......but even so, Ohio St would have been more of a challenge than Sparty)
n) the botched snap at Michigan on the final play that gave Mich St the win.......we don't play them if that doesn't happen.

And what about the insane return where Miami beat Duke last year?

I'm sorry, but basing this on statistical rating is ridiculous. It's about like saying a team can't win because their Time of Possession is sorry. But what if it's sorry because they score in less than two minutes MANY times?
 

selmaborntidefan

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Oh, I love the D too. I loathe the 65-58 games. I like a good O and a great D. The one concession I would give the kicking game is the punter. A great punter is a huge asset. I have noticed over the years that when we are getting 35 yd punts off and the other guys are getting 55 yds that it is hard to make up those 20 yds.

I never meant to infer the kicking game was not important, just not as important as it used to be (if Stallings and Dye were right). I have looked all over the net and can't find any national kicking game avgs. to compare with.

Yeah, I see what you mean


 

selmaborntidefan

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Btw - Pat Dye lost the 1984 Iron Bowl because:

a) he for some reason went for a TD on fourth and goal rather than a chip shot FG in a 17-15 game where he had gone for two to set up the FG (that one STILL boggles my mind)
b) his kicker got a shot from about 42 yards of so and shanked it 25 feet wide
 

selmaborntidefan

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Alabama lost the 1973 Sugar Bowl to Notre Dame PRIMARILY because of special teams.

1) Al Hunter returned a kickoff for a TD to give the Irish a 14-7 lead
2) Bill Davis missed the PAT that enabled the Irish to take the 24-23 lead with 4:12 left

Everybody remembers Clements to Weber, but I seriously doubt Notre Dame calls that play if the game is tied. And it only won the game because they only led......because of a missed PAT.
 

selmaborntidefan

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Football is cyclical, but the same things that always won will continue to win: stop the run, win the turnover battle, win special teams
Run the ball (you forgot that one, heh heh)
Stop the run
Win the turnover battle
Don't make stupid penalties (penalties are not necessarily bad; stupid ones cost you games)
 

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