Jalen Milroe is now the starter going forward.

[glorydays1990]

Hence my fear that this team is on the cusp of implosion.

This.

We are on the ropes and Lane Kiffin is coming to town. He's either going to deliver the knock out blow OR we'll come out fighting like Rocky

Worst case I'd like to see us fight well enough to survive the round (week). But you can count on lane throwing some haymakers.

 

[SkullDuckery]

So basically if what I’m hearing is correct, we had players pout because their guy didn’t get the start? That’s why they laid down last week and almost got their “teammates” they don’t like killed? And now Saban has caved into the demands and is starting the guy that threw a tantrum for getting benched? Crazy times for sure.

 

[jthomas666]

Before someone asks "if that's true, then why change QBs this last week?" Answer: I have no idea! I don't know enough about it to make educated guesses. i would just be slinging crap at the wall. Lol!

One thing no one has (I think) discussed--that perhaps it was Rees who pushed for Buchner to get the start. If Bucher's practice performance had been anything like his USF performance, a player revolt might make a little more sense.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

Question:

Do we know the following unequivocally?

1) Following the Texas game Milroe was benched, or informed that the other guys were going to get significant PT against USF.
2) Milroe subsequently pouted, or displayed a bad attitude, or something along those lines and was then suspended for the USF game.
3) During the week of preparation and during the game Saturday, Milroe displayed a better attitude, was a good teammate and encouraged the other QBs, etc..
4) Due to his attitude improvement, he was subsequently reinstated as the starter.

This is the narrative I keep hearing pushed, and I understand those of you who have sources cannot reveal certain things or confirm / deny, etc..

Some of this tracks for me - particularly the suspension piece because given the train wreck that the offense was for a good chunk of the day on Saturday I cannot fathom another reason that Milroe didn't see the field other than injury, which doesn't appear to be the case.

What I do question is was Milroe ever truly "benched"? It is hard to buy the notion of going from QB1 to QB3 and then back to QB1 within an 8-day timetable. Did something else happen that we maybe aren't privy to? I can see CNS wanting to give the other guys a shot, but I cannot believe that there would be a scenario that he would intentionally not play a guy and put the team in jeopardy of losing a game on the road just to prove a point or give other guys a chance. Unless that guy made a grevious mistake and was truly suspended.

I'm not trying to character-slam Milroe; never met the guy and don't know anything about him personally. I just have a hard time seeing CNS bury a guy on the depth chart for one week and then suddenly move him back to starter status. I do believe he wanted to see what Buchner and Simpson could do for extended time in live action - but given the struggles I think he would have played Milroe if he was available. I also have a hard time seeing CNS suspend a player for simply having a bad attitude. Not saying he wouldn't, but that would not be his historical MO. By all accounts we had all kinds of bad attitudes on the 2007 and 2010 teams and I don't recall any of those guys being suspended or even benched for that matter.

I don't think anyone truly knows the full story. And a lot of the sources people are referring to are posts from other boards (not everyone).

We'll probably never know what really went down or at least won't for a few years. But my best guess is that Milroe did have an issue of some kind that led him to not playing vs USF. I think the coaches probably expected Buchner to play significantly better than he did and hoped Ty would maybe have a light come on in live action.

I don't know though what fully happened. I do seriously doubt that Saban named Milroe QB1 because the players said so though. That doesn't mean the players supporting him doesn't factor in at all I just doubt that is THE reason it happened.

 

[CrimsonEyeshade]

One thing no one has (I think) discussed--that perhaps it was Rees who pushed for Buchner to get the start. If Bucher's practice performance had been anything like his USF performance, a player revolt might make a little more sense.

What we've heard on this board is the opposite, that Buckner has been practicing better and better. Sure did not look that way Saturday.

 

[bamaga]

amazing how much folks run with speculation as fact.

Well you know, the players had a meeting about Nick’s lack of leadership on this matter, and on the control of the defense. I heard that on Finebaum , his integrity is beyond reproach. SO IT MUST BE TRUE.

 

[rolltide_21]

Have we been talking about Mike Shula all this time?

It kinda does feel like those days doesn’t it, hahaha. Even though we’re not even close to that

 

[glorydays1990]

Question:

Do we know the following unequivocally?

1) Following the Texas game Milroe was benched, or informed that the other guys were going to get significant PT against USF.
2) Milroe subsequently pouted, or displayed a bad attitude, or something along those lines and was then suspended for the USF game.
3) During the week of preparation and during the game Saturday, Milroe displayed a better attitude, was a good teammate and encouraged the other QBs, etc..
4) Due to his attitude improvement, he was subsequently reinstated as the starter.

This is the narrative I keep hearing pushed, and I understand those of you who have sources cannot reveal certain things or confirm / deny, etc..

Some of this tracks for me - particularly the suspension piece because given the train wreck that the offense was for a good chunk of the day on Saturday I cannot fathom another reason that Milroe didn't see the field other than injury, which doesn't appear to be the case.

What I do question is was Milroe ever truly "benched"? It is hard to buy the notion of going from QB1 to QB3 and then back to QB1 within an 8-day timetable. Did something else happen that we maybe aren't privy to? I can see CNS wanting to give the other guys a shot, but I cannot believe that there would be a scenario that he would intentionally not play a guy and put the team in jeopardy of losing a game on the road just to prove a point or give other guys a chance. Unless that guy made a grevious mistake and was truly suspended.

I'm not trying to character-slam Milroe; never met the guy and don't know anything about him personally. I just have a hard time seeing CNS bury a guy on the depth chart for one week and then suddenly move him back to starter status. I do believe he wanted to see what Buchner and Simpson could do for extended time in live action - but given the struggles I think he would have played Milroe if he was available. I also have a hard time seeing CNS suspend a player for simply having a bad attitude. Not saying he wouldn't, but that would not be his historical MO. By all accounts we had all kinds of bad attitudes on the 2007 and 2010 teams and I don't recall any of those guys being suspended or even benched for that matter.

Bluntly: Simply a guess based on what I do know.

1) Simpson lost the team in the fall/spring. He'll never win the team or win certain players on THIS team.
2) Saban knows Simpson is the better QB for the system, the better talent, etc
3) Saban was hoping that Simpson would win the team over-- did not happen
4) Saban went with JM b/c of #3-- and b/c he believes that leadership, etc all is important
5) After texas loss-- Saban made the change we all knew needed to be made. Milore clearly isnt the guy that can take us to places we all want to go
6) Team meeting occurred-- players didnt like the change-- hence saban having to back up this by telling the media if you play bad you lose your job, etc
7) JM and others reacted very poorly do this-- JM being the worst
8) JM suspended
9) Saban went with TB b/c he again had won the team more than TS- again TS wont win this team
10) after TB wet the bed to the point we almost lose--Then and only then did he go with TS
11) Once it was clear that TS would be the QB or could be the QB---- see #12
12) Another team meeting happened
13) Team made point #1 clear
14) Saban reverts back to Milroe and we all move forward hoping the best

So Saban talks about getting people on the bus:

He made the decision that there are more players on the JM bus and he thinks its easier to fix the driver of this bus

Rather than trying to get people on the bus with TS-- even though he's the better driver going the right direction.

 

[mlh]

Bluntly: Simply a guess based on what I do know.

1) Simpson lost the team in the fall/spring. He'll never win the team or win certain players on THIS team.
2) Saban knows Simpson is the better QB for the system, the better talent, etc
3) Saban was hoping that Simpson would win the team over-- did not happen
4) Saban went with JM b/c of #3-- and b/c he believes that leadership, etc all is important
5) After texas loss-- Saban made the change we all knew needed to be made. Milore clearly isnt the guy that can take us to places we all want to go
6) Team meeting occurred-- players didnt like the change-- hence saban having to back up this by telling the media if you play bad you lose your job, etc
7) JM and others reacted very poorly do this-- JM being the worst
8) JM suspended
9) Saban went with TB b/c he again had won the team more than TS- again TS wont win this team
10) after TB wet the bed to the point we almost lose--Then and only then did he go with TS
11) Once it was clear that TS would be the QB or could be the QB---- see #12
12) Another team meeting happened
13) Team made point #1 clear
14) Saban reverts back to Milroe and we all move forward hoping the best

If this is true, then the TEAM had better come out breathing fire and ready to curb stomp their opponent (with Milroe at QB).

 

[JohnD]

Before someone asks "if that's true, then why change QBs this last week?" Answer: I have no idea! I don't know enough about it to make educated guesses. i would just be slinging crap at the wall. Lol!

That has slowed very few people down here.

 

[AWRTR]

If this is true, then the TEAM had better come out breathing fire and ready to curb stomp their opponent (with Milroe at QB).

Agreed, you have your guy now go win with him or shut your mouth and go away.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

Bluntly: Simply a guess based on what I do know.

1) Simpson lost the team in the fall/spring. He'll never win the team or win certain players on THIS team.
2) Saban knows Simpson is the better QB for the system, the better talent, etc
3) Saban was hoping that Simpson would win the team over-- did not happen
4) Saban went with JM b/c of #3-- and b/c he believes that leadership, etc all is important
5) After texas loss-- Saban made the change we all knew needed to be made. Milore clearly isnt the guy that can take us to places we all want to go
6) Team meeting occurred-- players didnt like the change-- hence saban having to back up this by telling the media if you play bad you lose your job, etc
7) JM and others reacted very poorly do this-- JM being the worst
8) JM suspended
9) Saban went with TB b/c he again had won the team more than TS- again TS wont win this team
10) after TB wet the bed to the point we almost lose--Then and only then did he go with TS
11) Once it was clear that TS would be the QB or could be the QB---- see #12
12) Another team meeting happened
13) Team made point #1 clear
14) Saban reverts back to Milroe and we all move forward hoping the best

So Saban talks about getting people on the bus:

He made the decision that there are more players on the JM bus and he thinks its easier to fix the driver of this bus

Rather than trying to get people on the bus with TS-- even though he's the better driver going the right direction.

Simpson must be a pretty terrible person to have not 1 but 2 inferior QBs jump him because the players say so

 

[JDCrimson]

I have had some time to think about this...

This is nothing new in sports. Players have tanked on teammates for various things throughout the span of team sports. Most of the time it is to send a message to the teammate. If it reaches critical mass there is a whole lot the coaches can do about it if there is unity among the players. The coaches can deal with it better in the offseason but not much opportunity during the season.

CNS has essentially an offensive team on the verge of strike for whatever reason...

For better or worse the players will have to work this out on their own as they put themselves here...

 

[irvingtontide]

Agreed, you have your guy now go win with him or shut your mouth and go away.

I would agree with this but Texas already happened. Maybe the threat of losing their guy might make them play better going forward knowing that he could be pulled.

 

[jjv0004]

Here is what I know for sure so far:
1. Milroe is not good. Simpson is not good. Buchner is not good.
2. Our o-line continues now in year 3 of free fall. No QB is going to succeed with this group in front of them.
3. The undisciplined play continues again this year. Penalties, penalties, penalties
4. We have no studs on the d-line. Say what you want but the level of talent has diminished compared to past years.
5. The secondary is shaky. Texas had 6 plays over 30 yards.
6. Saban seems like he has no answers.
7. Our coaching staff might be the weakest as a group in the Saban era and continues the decline in the last few years. We have so much talent that is not getting properly developed.

 

[glorydays1990]

Simpson must have to be a pretty terrible person to have not 1 but 2 inferior QBs jump him because the players say so

not going that far with it. You can be a good person and not fit in with a particular group. You can be a good person and not be a good leader.

But i will say its hard once youve "lost" a group or the trust of a group, to get them back.

Is my educated guess here more so than a bad person.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

not going that far with it. You can be a good person and not fit in with a particular group. You can be a good person and not be a good leader.

But i will say its hard once youve "lost" a group or the trust of a group, to get them back.

Is my educated guess here more so than a bad person.

How bad would it have to be though for 2 QBs to jump him...

Everyone keeps referencing the Tua situation as proof Saban caves to players who want a different QB. But the reason they wanted a different QB is because they wanted someone who would get them the ball.

I just don't buy this line of thinking.

 

[bamadws56]

One of the other poster said something very public happened with Simpson and the team and it caused some huge rift. Does anyone know what that was? If it was public it would not be rumor mongering or anything. I would love to know what happened as it seems to have bearing on the current situation.

 

[RollTide_HTTR]

Here is what I know for sure so far:
1. Milroe is not good. Simpson is not good. Buchner is not good.
2. Our o-line continues now in year 3 of free fall. No QB is going to succeed with this group in front of them.
3. The undisciplined play continues again this year. Penalties, penalties, penalties
4. We have no studs on the d-line. Say what you want but the level of talent has diminished compared to past years.
5. The secondary is shaky. Texas had 6 plays over 30 yards.
6. Saban seems like he has no answers.
7. Our coaching staff might be the weakest as a group in the Saban era and continues the decline in the last few years. We have so much talent that is not getting properly developed.

I'm only laughing at this because of the blunt way you say it all. Not because I substantially disagree with most of it.

 

[bamadws56]

Everyone keeps referencing the Tua situation as proof Saban caves to players who want a different QB. But the reason they wanted a different QB is because they wanted someone who would get them the ball.

I don't like using the word "caves" in this context. To continue my military reference earlier, I am not "caving" to one of my subordinate platoons if they have lost confidence in their leader and I remove them. I am assessing the situation as a whole and making a decision based on what is best for that platoon, especially if I want them to improve. Heck, we even have an evaluation criteria if we remove a leader which covers this: "loss of confidence in their ability to lead." I would guess that is much closer to what Coach Saban did than the negative "caving" to demands.

P.S. Not directed at you RollTide_HTTR, just the general sentiment of Coach Saban caving.