Link: Child’s Death in Hot Car Leads to Unusual Murder Charge

I hope this was an accident, but if not, the punishment should be harsh.

BradtheImpaler said:

I originally thought that this was a ruse to cover up some other abuse. Now, I wish it had have been.

It's looking more and more like this sick bastard planned it out and left his own flesh and blood to die in excruciating fashion. This makes me ill.

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Same here, I was watching something on one of the news channels..and I had to turn it off. Just makes me sick and sad to hear the details in this.


So, I turned it off and hugged my kids a little tighter.

TIDE-HSV said:

I just don't buy it. How could he go out, open the hot car up and not notice his toddler was inside the oven. The only thing I can figure, other than murder, was that he was in an "altered state of consciousness..."

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Obviously this is looking more and more like something other than a tragic accident, but two thoughts:

1. The accused is a friend of a friend to me and my wife - drugs would be a very real shock (as would murder, of course). Straight-laced Christian guy by all accounts.
2. Can't speak for the Hyundai Tuscon he drove, but I've got a Buick Rendezvous with somewhat tinted windows. Let's say my wife and kids got into the car for church before me, and I locked up the house and headed to the driveway. If I went straight to the driver side door and got in, I would never see my youngest son in the seat behind me, especially - and this is critical - with him being in a rear-facing carseat. I would see his car seat, but I wouldn't see him. He's now at the age where we usually leave the seat in the car, so it wouldn't look any different whether he was in the seat or not.

Now with that said, I'm less and less inclined to believe that this was an accident, though with my (very loose) connections to the Tuscaloosa world this guy and wife had inhabited, I had hoped this was simply a tragic accident. It looks that was not the case and if so, I hope justice is carried out.

My wife did read that as rear-facing carseats became standardized, these sort of awful accidents have become more common.

crimsonaudio said:

No, they're irrelevant - i'm simply sharing an opinion.

If you want an argument, you'll have to look elsewhere. Sorry to disappoint.

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Fair enough, and I'm not looking for argument, but I'm confused by the fact that one might be so belligerent in defending an opinion so baseless in reality.

TIDE-HSV said:

Well, I was not a helicopter parent, by any means. However, my awareness of where my kids were (and, later, where they were supposed to be), makes it hard for me even to imagine. When my kids were that age, they were my world! Everything, and I mean that, was secondary. I guess that's what makes it so hard to believe that kids could have become so secondary that a distraction at a job could make one forget one's kid. That's what makes this so hard to swallow, that the world could have changed that much in a few decades...

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Just go sit in a restaurant and watch a family of four sit at a table with their phones out not talking to each other.

TIDE-HSV said:

Well, I was not a helicopter parent, by any means. However, my awareness of where my kids were (and, later, where they were supposed to be), makes it hard for me even to imagine. When my kids were that age, they were my world! Everything, and I mean that, was secondary. I guess that's what makes it so hard to believe that kids could have become so secondary that a distraction at a job could make one forget one's kid. That's what makes this so hard to swallow, that the world could have changed that much in a few decades...

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I'm with you. I'm still hyper-aware of where my kids are and what they are doing and the youngest is barely into the double digits in age. There was one incident when he was quite small when he actually wondered off when he awoke from a nap as my wife was relieving herself. Close call, but the day (and my son) was saved by an alert neighbor who kept him out of the pool. He went missing another time and was found finally asleep in his toybox by a very kind policeman. I had actually looked there and saw the cover, but the sight was not terribly unusual so I went to check the pool and then the creek. Came pretty close to punching out a neighbor over his fat mouth (asking my wife how could she let it happen and what kind of mother was she), but he shut it when I told him what I'd do if he didn't and the cop he implored for help just told him he'd be wise to do as I said. Same guy was arrested, ironically enough, for a domestic charge some time afterward. His S.O.'s kid later on thought he could fly and jumped off a 2-story roof. I found him when I awoke at 3:30AM to relieve myself. Almost dismissed him as a drunk college kid but decided I had to go check on him either way. Some of his broken bones were obvious, but he was actually awake. He'd have likely died - from his collapsed lung or skull fracture with subdural hematoma - or come close if I hadn't had that late Dr. Pepper that night. Strange how things happen sometimes.

Then you have folks whose kids drown in their own pool at home. We had a kid die here recently riding a 4-wheeler. No charges. Are these parents any less irresponsible and/or negligent, considering the known risks of pools and 4-wheelers?

I couldn't imagine this happening to my kid, but that incident above was the absolute worst and most sickening feeling I've experienced in my life. I still get a little nauseated and my heart aches deep down just thinking about it.

Here's a long article that delves some into the reasons why this can happen. It uses some science to do so. It also mulls potential solutions to reduce the incidence of these events and the roadblocks to seeing them come to fruition. It is very sympathetic toward these parents. It is also at several points a very difficult read emotionally.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifes...e0fe3a-f580-11e3-a3a5-42be35962a52_story.html

I can't imagine how different things would be if not for a few chance happenings that prevented tragedy, one above when a neighbor literally saved my kid from dying when my wife answered the call of nature and another when I answered the same call and perhaps saved another family from a similar fate. Life is definitely strange that way.

I don't know any more than anyone else whether this guy intended to do his kid harm. If it can be proven beyond reasonable doubt that he did intend to do it, then fry his sorry butt. I do think the emotional knee jerk calls for his suffering, death, and suffering in hell for eternity even when this was thought to be an "accident" were a bit over the top. Hopefully, all the facts come out and we can decide for ourselves if he is guilty of anything more than being tragically absent minded.

We all tend to tell ourselves that it could not and would not ever happen to us. We think we are more vigilant, or smarter or a better person. Or maybe we pay better attention. Or maybe we never get distracted or think we did something we didn't actually do. We insulate ourselves that way.

Displaced Bama Fan said:

Just go sit in a restaurant and watch a family of four sit at a table with their phones out not talking to each other.

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posting on tide fans

Displaced Bama Fan said:

Just go sit in a restaurant and watch a family of four sit at a table with their phones out not talking to each other.

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That may or may not be germane in cases like this.

TIDE-HSV said:

Well, I was not a helicopter parent, by any means. However, my awareness of where my kids were (and, later, where they were supposed to be), makes it hard for me even to imagine. When my kids were that age, they were my world! Everything, and I mean that, was secondary. I guess that's what makes it so hard to believe that kids could have become so secondary that a distraction at a job could make one forget one's kid. That's what makes this so hard to swallow, that the world could have changed that much in a few decades...

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Oh, I agree entirely on that score. Just noting that the layout the car, combined with the style of carseat (which I believe is mandatory), has a logisitical effect. I've defended - if that's the word - parents on the grounds that sometimes, as BiB said above, our brains fail us, but yeah...I do think a lot has changed.

TIDE-HSV said:

Well, I was not a helicopter parent, by any means. However, my awareness of where my kids were (and, later, where they were supposed to be), makes it hard for me even to imagine. When my kids were that age, they were my world! Everything, and I mean that, was secondary. I guess that's what makes it so hard to believe that kids could have become so secondary that a distraction at a job could make one forget one's kid. That's what makes this so hard to swallow, that the world could have changed that much in a few decades...

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You'd be surprised at how many children become, at least in the eyes of the parents, more of a distraction and inconvenience from their own everyday lives than living, breathing humans for whom they are responsible. Except in case of divorce or separation of course. Then the children become weapons to be used against the other spouse.
I sometimes wonder why some people decide to become parents. If children are such an inconvenience, maybe they should just get a dog.

92tide said:

posting on tide fans

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during working hours or after the kids and wife have gone to bed.

CrimsonProf said:

That may or may not be germane in cases like this.

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My point was simply that people have become disconnected from every day interaction with "advances" in technology. I wish we didn't have cell phones, instagram, twitter, facebook, etc. We're raising a new generation of socially awkward people because they don't know how to interact with each other on a personal level.

I personally have made a conscious decision not to post on twitter, facebook or any other social media, save Tidefans because it was becoming too big of a distraction for me as a parent, spouse and employee/supervisor.

Bama Reb said:

You'd be surprised at how many children become, at least in the eyes of the parents, more of a distraction and inconvenience from their own everyday lives than living, breathing humans for whom they are responsible. Except in case of divorce or separation of course. Then the children become weapons to be used against the other spouse.
I sometimes wonder why some people decide to become parents. If children are such an inconvenience, maybe they should just get a dog.

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This


This is why I always support people who decide not to have children. Too many people feel like they should or they have to or their parents want grand kids. Forget that kids are too hard. Do what makes sense for you an no one else. I've heard people say not having kids is selfish, no having kids and ignoring them is selfish. Knowing that you don't want them and not doing it is a great thing. As a society we should all support people who opt chose not to breed.

Jon said:

This


This is why I always support people who decide not to have children. Too many people feel like they should or they have to or their parents want grand kids. Forget that kids are too hard. Do what makes sense for you an no one else. I've heard people say not having kids is selfish, no having kids and ignoring them is selfish. Knowing that you don't want them and not doing it is a great thing. As a society we should all support people who opt chose not to breed.

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We should encourage or enforce certain people not to breed.

Bama Reb said:

You'd be surprised at how many children become, at least in the eyes of the parents, more of a distraction and inconvenience from their own everyday lives than living, breathing humans for whom they are responsible. Except in case of divorce or separation of course. Then the children become weapons to be used against the other spouse.
I sometimes wonder why some people decide to become parents. If children are such an inconvenience, maybe they should just get a dog.

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Seeing how incompetent many dog owners are I'd recommend these people avoid being responsible for any other life form.

Jon said:

This


This is why I always support people who decide not to have children. Too many people feel like they should or they have to or their parents want grand kids. Forget that kids are too hard. Do what makes sense for you an no one else. I've heard people say not having kids is selfish, no having kids and ignoring them is selfish. Knowing that you don't want them and not doing it is a great thing. As a society we should all support people who opt chose not to breed.

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When my wife worked in labor and delivery she had hundreds of patients who had no business being parents. But they were - many times over. I remember her telling me about this 25-year-old who was delivering her 13th child ..... on the taxpayers' dime, of course. It takes a lot of responsible, productive people to "pay their fare share" to be able to subsidize the parasites.

Bodhisattva said:

When my wife worked in labor and delivery she had hundreds of patients who had no business being parents. But they were - many times over. I remember her telling me about this 25-year-old who was delivering her 13th child ..... on the taxpayers' dime, of course. It takes a lot of responsible, productive people to "pay their fare share" to be able to subsidize the parasites.

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If you are on welfare you should have temporary birth control until you can support yourself and family with a job and by temporary, I mean an implant.