Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here) - old

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AUDub

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

Too Late for Toomers Trees

Interesting how this one has been removed from Auburn sites, when they in fact published the article.
Oh for crying out loud, you guys with your conspiracy theories. I cited the pathologist report in post 3937.

Even then, past issues are not hosted on the Auburn alumni site. They haven't been for years. They are hosted on issuu, just like every other back issue of the magazine. In fact, go to the Auburn alumni page, find the past issues link and see what site it redirects you to. I'll wait.

EDIT:Here, the Auburn Alumni Association page on issuu:



Would you look at that. Not only is it there. It's there more than once! We sure did a good job hiding that one!
 
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AUDub

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

Bodhisattva;[URL="tel:2972557" said:
2972557[/URL]]Um, no. You can't say you revere trees when your collective actions have been killing them. Slow, fast, whatever. It's just a fact. The corrected analogy is accurate.

No. It's not. Trying to analogize it with people or tragedies of much greater scope strains credulity anyway. (Auburn fans are guilty of this to.)

Also, if you wouldn't mind responding to this portion you chopped.

Have you read the pathologist's report on the trees? The one that comes up seemingly any time this topic is discussed here? Yes, he gave a range. Anywhere from half a decade to a century. Things were still kicking, even after they were poisoned, I think it's fairly obvious that his low end prediction was emphatically wrong. The trees live in pretty poor condition with the power washing, but you can tell that year in and year out leaves kept coming right back until this happened. Truth is, no one really knew if the trees were going to die in a hurry. Anybody that says they do is lying. There was certainly a lot of speculation that they may die, so everything known within a world class agricultural school was being done to keep the trees around and it very well could have been successful.
I, and every other Bama fan I know, have said that Harvey killed the trees. You, and many Auburn fans, want to ignore how damaging to the trees Auburn tradition is.

If you wouldn't mind pointing out where I have done that.

I've never been sentimental about toilet paper, although I do have a preference for two-ply. As for trees, I don't spend my time throwing things at them, cutting their roots, setting them on fire, or power washing them. We must have different definitions of "sentimental." I'm more of a live-and-let-live kind of guy.

Still don't get it. Auburn fans mourned the loss of these trees because of what they represent. We don't do it because we're fixated on TP or anything like that. The great thing about college traditions is that most of them do look silly to outsiders. Cowbells. People dressing up like an native-Americans and riding to midfield to throw a flaming spear in the ground. Touching a rock. Having an eagle fly around the stadium. Midnight yell. That's almost the whole point of having them. It's something you do that other schools don't.

By national perspective you mean uneducated opinions from afar? Considering other fan bases are naturally hostile to any but their own, and that Bama is far more successful, and that many people don't even know where Auburn is, I have no doubt that more people are jealous of Bama than of Auburn. Jealousy breeds hatred and bigotry. I don't value the opinions of haters and bigots.

More to it than that. Brian Downing, Harvey Updyke, Michelle Pritchett, Adrian Briskey. I'm not saying it's fair, but incidents like those do tend to color perspective among the ignorant.
ditto
 
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seebell

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Gurley, Al
Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

After reading some of your disagreeable posts on here, it's a darn good thing you put up security cameras!!:eek2:
 

NoNC4Tubs

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

Why are we talking about the well being of the oaks?

I find the "trees were dying anyway" excuse laughable. Excuse making to limit Updyke's culpability. First of all, the removal of the rolls from the trees was altered so that the trees suffered no harm. But even if that weren’t so, how Auburn fans handle our own trees is vastly different from some blithering idiot poisoning them.

Even then, the jackass poured a huge amount of a federally regulated herbicide - not exactly one you can walk into Home Depot and buy - into the middle of a city with no concern for what it could do to the soil in the area and the water table for years to come.

Y'all need to stop. These attempts to minimize Updyke's idiocy are themselves an excercise in idiocy.
Updyke merely accelerated the inevitable. But, the fact is...that the trees were already dying largely in part because of the actions of your own fans. This is clearly stated by one of your own.:cool2:

It just sounds better to blame it on your biggest rival, doesn't it?
 
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NoNC4Tubs

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

UpDyke killed the trees. They may have had a terminal illness, but he killed them.

What's the problem with AUDub expressing his opinion? He usually makes good sense IMHO.
He expressed his opinion. Now others are expressing theirs... :cool2:
 

PitMaster

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

He expressed his opinion. Now others are expressing theirs... :cool2:
Is it possible ole Harv performed an act of compassion, putting those trees out of their misery and sparing them years of suffering?

Was Updyke a Druidic Kevorkian?
 

NoNC4Tubs

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

We can hardly be blamed for the fact that a city sprung up around them, making things difficult for their root systems, they did very well to adapt to the ag zone in which they were located, and were just starting to realize what kind of punishment they were taking from the rolling. Your analogy is pretty bad.
So you are saying that the trees were already growing in an area that they were not indigenous to...? Obviously they were planted by somebody. :cool2:

Have you read the pathologist's report on the trees? The one that comes up seemingly any time this topic is discussed here? Yes, he gave a range. Anywhere from half a decade to a century. Things are still kicking, even after they were poisoned, I think it's fairly obvious that his low end prediction was emphatically wrong. The trees live in pretty poor condition with the power washing, but you can tell that year in and year out leaves kept coming right back until this happened. Truth is, no one really knew if the trees were going to die in a hurry. Anybody that says they do is lying. There was certainly a lot of speculation that they may die, so everything known within a world class agricultural school was being done to keep the trees around and it very well could have been successful.
The damage must have been noticeable enough for your Horticulture guy to go and asses them in the first place...:cool2:


You do yourself a disservice by trying to minimize just how heinous this moron's actions were.
What was the purpose of you bringing this issue up in the first place...? :cool2:


Statements like this are a good indicator that you do not. In fact, it makes one wonder if you even have a sentimental bone in your body.

And do you really want to go down the rabbit hole of national perspective of our respective fanbases?
BINGO! THAT is the purpose of your bringing this up in the first place.

I think it is you that should stay away from that rabbit hole... :rolleyes:
 

NoNC4Tubs

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

Your average tree farmed for the purpose yields around 100 lbs of TP. The average American uses 50 lbs per year. The the majority of toilet paper tossed after the games is recycled non-acidic tp sold in downtown Auburn. You know, that cheap 1 ply industrial stuff which is usually produced from recycled paper and sawdust scraps from lumber mills, using very little virgin lumber. The lack of acidity also means the trees aren't distressed by the rolling. It's the removal that was unhealthy for them.

You've interacted with me enough in non sports to know I'm all about conservation, but for a given winning season I'd be surprised if AU used any more wood than what you would use to fuel one good sized bonfire. Not exactly clear cutting large swaths of forest to feed the beast.
So what you are saying is that your tradition kills scores of trees...

I wonder how many trees have been killed over the course of the years because of that tradition? :conf2:
 

NoNC4Tubs

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

He dumped a high powered herbicide directly on them in a dose capable of killing them many times over. As harmful as the removal process was, there's really no comparison there.
I believe that everyone here knows the story...:rolleyes:
 

timmer0911

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

Who said what Harvey did was not a crime? I have repeatedly said that Harvey killed the trees. I'm not aware of anyone claiming otherwise.

I would just like other facts to be acknowledged as well. I have a AU BIL who refuses to admit that Auburn tradition was slowly killing their precious trees. He still regularly wails about how "Alabama murdered our sacred trees." Venture on an Auburn message board and you'll read the same. My BIL doesn't get a pass from me to selectively recall history. I hold everyone else to the same standard.
I guess my main point was that Updyke (or most of us Bama fans) had no idea that the trees were already dying, so he shouldn't get any kind of pass for killing something that was "going to die anyway". I understand that the trees wouldn't have made it much longer and Barn fans are killing the trees anyway, but when Updyke poisoned the trees, he didn't know that. He was TRYING to kill them.
So, how many Awbarn fans truly knew that the trees were dying?? Probably not that many. In their minds and in the minds of a bunch of other fans, Alabama DID murder their sacred trees. Is that good logic?? NO, of course not, but perception is reality. Updyke intentionally tried to kill the trees and there's no way to sugar coat it. People are always going to blame him (and US) for killing the trees. Rolling and power-washing the trees definitely would have killed them eventually, but that didn't get to happen and trying to convince the fans of that is gonna be impossible.

RTR
SNASS
 

AUDub

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

So you are saying that the trees were already growing in an area that they were not indigenous to...? Obviously they were planted by somebody. :cool2:

Yep. Your point?

The damage must have been noticeable enough for your Horticulture guy to go and asses them in the first place...:cool2:

Heaven forbid a plant pathologist at Auburn notices something and, you know, does his job.

What was the purpose of you bringing this issue up in the first place...? :cool2:

Actually, go read the thread and then the "Clemson fan here" thread. Then ask yourself who brought it up first

BINGO! THAT is the purpose of your bringing this up in the first place.

I think it is you that should stay away from that rabbit hole... :rolleyes:

If you're operating under the assumption I brought this up, you're sorely mistaken.
If you would be so kind as to actually read the thread and follow the argument, I would greatly appreciate it. Keeps me from having to argue in circles, you see.
 

Bodhisattva

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Re: Plain Trouble on "Da Plains" (all AU posts here)

I guess my main point was that Updyke (or most of us Bama fans) had no idea that the trees were already dying, so he shouldn't get any kind of pass for killing something that was "going to die anyway". I understand that the trees wouldn't have made it much longer and Barn fans are killing the trees anyway, but when Updyke poisoned the trees, he didn't know that. He was TRYING to kill them.
So, how many Awbarn fans truly knew that the trees were dying?? Probably not that many. In their minds and in the minds of a bunch of other fans, Alabama DID murder their sacred trees. Is that good logic?? NO, of course not, but perception is reality. Updyke intentionally tried to kill the trees and there's no way to sugar coat it. People are always going to blame him (and US) for killing the trees. Rolling and power-washing the trees definitely would have killed them eventually, but that didn't get to happen and trying to convince the fans of that is gonna be impossible.

RTR
SNASS
I'm not giving Updyke a pass. I wrote earlier that the guy could not be punished enough for my tastes. He could have harmed a lot of people if the poison got into the water. The University of Alabama had nothing do with it; Harvey is responsible for his own actions. What I don't give a pass on is Auburn's wasteful and destructive tradition. Auburn was destroying their own sacred trees long before Harvey conjured up his magnum opus. That's all. I stated two simple facts. One doesn't preclude the other.
 
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