Redshirt freshmen ratio vs juniors going Pro

Redwood Forrest

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Are there are about as many redshirt freshmen as juniors (who have played three years) who leave for the Pros each year in P5 football. How about freshmen who start? Are they about equal with juniors who leave early?

Are there stats for this data somewhere?
 
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B1GTide

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Do you mean RS Sophomores? You have to be 3 years removed from HS to play NFL football.
 

Redwood Forrest

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Do you mean RS Sophomores? You have to be 3 years removed from HS to play NFL football.
Hmmmm. I had no idea there was a difference. If a freshman starts then his third full year is a junior. That is what I meant. I have never heard of a redshirt soph or junior, except for an extra year for health reasons. I have edited my op to try to clarify.
 

B1GTide

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A RS Sophomore is a player with 2 more years of eligibility left because he did not play one of the 3 seasons that he has been in college. A RS Freshman has 3 years of eligibility left and would only be eligible for the draft if he could not join a college immediately after HS (think Bo Scarbrough). It is very rare for RS Freshmen to be draft eligible.

There were 6 players in the 2016 draft who came out as RS Sophomores - about 5% of the 107 early declarers in this year's draft.

ETA - sorry, just realized that Bo played in a few games in 2015, so he would be a true sophomore, not a RS freshman this season.
 
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Snuffy Smith

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My guess would be many more true Juniors than RS Sophomores go pro since they would have had 3 years experience on the field. I think I heard someone the other day say that if Marlon goes this year he would be Bama's first under Saban


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Redwood Forrest

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I am a little confused. What will Jalen Hurts be if he goes after his Junior year? He will just be a junior, right?

But if he sat our his freshman year with a redshirt, then played three years he would be a ....... redshirt soph, junior or what?
 

colbysullivan

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I am a little confused. What will Jalen Hurts be if he goes after his Junior year? He will just be a junior, right?

But if he sat our his freshman year with a redshirt, then played three years he would be a ....... redshirt soph, junior or what?
Once you redshirt, the "redshirt" moniker stays with you no matter what class you're in. For example, AJ redshirted in 2009 and was a redshirt freshman in 2010. He was a redshirt senior in 2013. In your example above, if Jalen never redshirts and leaves early, he will be a Junior (specifically a true junior).
 

B1GTide

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Once you redshirt, the "redshirt" moniker stays with you no matter what class you're in. For example, AJ redshirted in 2009 and was a redshirt freshman in 2010. He was a redshirt senior in 2013. In your example above, if Jalen never redshirts and leaves early, he will be a Junior (specifically a true junior).
Exactly - Jalen is a "true" freshman starter because he "truly" is a freshman, both in terms of academics and football eligibility used. Barnett would have been a redshirt freshman this year if he had stayed because he was redshirted in his first year at Alabama - he would have been a sophomore academically, but only a freshman with respect his football eligibility since it would be his first year playing.

In football, think in terms of playing eligibility. You are a freshman (true or redshirt) if you are using your first year of football eligibility that season. You are a sophomore (true or redshirt) if you are using your second year of eligibility. Etc. Most of these players are in school for more than 2 semesters anyway with summer classes, so tracking them based on academic calendars is almost impossible. Watson graduated in 2.5 years at Clemson, for instance (he just finished his course work for his degree). This year he was a junior in terms of his football eligibility, but a senior academically.
 
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Redwood Forrest

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Let's say he redshirted this year, just as a hypothetical. He would then be a RS freshman in 2017, a RS sophomore in 2018, and a RS junior in 2019.
Thank you. That makes perfect sense. You did well explaining it if I understand it. So my op question should be

"are the as many players redshirted each year as there are players who leave early for the Pros?"
 

colbysullivan

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Thank you. That makes perfect sense. You did well explaining it if I understand it. So my op question should be

"are the as many players redshirted each year as there are players who leave early for the Pros?"
I would imagine there are WAY more players redshirted each year than players who leave early. I have no numbers to back that up, but think about how low the percentage of players that even make it to the pros, let alone leave early.

Now, if you're talking just Alabama, that might be an interesting metric...
 

GrayTide

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I'm sure that I am in the minority here, but I believe these kids should stay in college longer. IMO, the rules should be that they cannot go to the NFL until one of the following. They use up all of their eligibility, graduate before their eligibility is used up or they reach the age of 21. So many of these kids may be physically prepared for the NFL, but many are not mature enough to understand that they have a small window in time to build a financial future from football and act accordingly.
 

B1GTide

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I'm sure that I am in the minority here, but I believe these kids should stay in college longer. IMO, the rules should be that they cannot go to the NFL until one of the following. They use up all of their eligibility, graduate before their eligibility is used up or they reach the age of 21. So many of these kids may be physically prepared for the NFL, but many are not mature enough to understand that they have a small window in time to build a financial future from football and act accordingly.
I don't disagree about their maturity, but that really doesn't improve until they reach age 25. Besides, we let our young men go off to war at age 17.
 

LA4Bama

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I don't disagree about their maturity, but that really doesn't improve until they reach age 25. Besides, we let our young men go off to war at age 17.
I sort of agree that 25 is a key age for maturity (you can usually count on a person identifying with adulthood by this point), but my experience is that age 19 to 21 is normally a huge leap in maturity. I see it as a qualitative difference and not just a continual improvement of adolescent skills, but a real qualitative leap in "owing" one's actions. Of course, this is just on the average; there are some precocious teens and some who never own their actions responsibly. "senior" leadership is a real thing.
 

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