Link: Ranking CNS BAMA teams ...

selmaborntidefan

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If championships weren't a deciding factor then I would say 2010 and 2016. But as is 2015 is the best.

Yeah, that's just how the evaluation goes.

Most folks aren't aware that the 1986 Bears defense was actually better than the 1985 version STATISTICALLY. They gave up 187 points, which was 11 fewer than the 1985 version surrendered. I'd still rank the 85 as a better team, though because:

a) the 85 Bears faced four playoff teams and went 3-1 and won it all
b) the 86 Bears faced TWO playoff teams and went 1-1 and lost their only playoff game
c) the 85 Bears scored 28.2 ppg vs 22 in 86.
 

selmaborntidefan

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If championships weren't a deciding factor then I would say 2010 and 2016. But as is 2015 is the best.
I think the 2010 team was actually BETTER than the 2009 team.

But one went undefeated and one blew a 24-0 lead in the Iron Bowl......though to be fair, that insane scheduling made a huge difference, too.
 

81usaf92

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I think the 2010 team was actually BETTER than the 2009 team.

But one went undefeated and one blew a 24-0 lead in the Iron Bowl......though to be fair, that insane scheduling made a huge difference, too.
We probably still would've lost to USCe but we should have beaten LSU and Auburn, and then get our revenge in Atlanta vs the gamecocks. I think scheduling killed us. @ Ark, UF, and @ USCe was going to result in one loss. We were fortunate to beat Arkansas up there. I still think 2010 is probably the most talented team we've had.
 

RollTide_HTTR

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Not to sound like I'm playing the "if Colt hadn't got hurt game" but....


I think the 2016 team with a healthy Eddie, Hamilton, and Bo is the best overall team.

2012 is the best O-line easily.

2009 probably had the most heart to compensate for where talent was not yet there across the board.

If not for a bad quarter against Ole Miss and one play at the end by Clemson, the last 2 teams might be considered the best in the history of the game.
Lacy averaged over 6 yards a carry that year. I still think 2012 is the best and that it would be between 2012 and 2016 if 2016 had won the NC. I'm pretty sure 2012 leads in point differential per game under Saban with maybe 2016 or 2011 being better? I would have to do more research though.

I think you are right about 2016 if healthy though. I actually think you could probably leave off needing Hamilton to be healthy. It's hard to play the what if game but its possible they win the title with only one of Eddie or Bo healthy not even needing both.
The 2015 or 2016 teams have likely been the best under CNS - they had the capably to play 'big' or 'quick' depending on the circumstances. Head to head, the 2016 Bama offense would give many of the pre 2015 teams fits, especially the 2016. We'd all hate JH if the 2011 team had to keep track of him in a game...
I think people are underrating that 2011 D. I actually think(based on the LSU game) the 2011 D would have had a good shot at really slowing down the 2016 O. Its not like there were no running QBs we faced that year. Now, none of them were on Hurts level but still.

Let's also not forget that we allowed fewer than 9 points a game in 2011 and beat an LSU team 21-0 that was well on its way to many people declaring it the best team ever. LSU that year crushed literally everyone they played except us. They put up 30 or more points in every game but 3. 2 of those games were vs us. Heck, they put up 40 or more in 9 of there games. They weren't playing an easy schedule either.
 
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TideEngineer08

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No college team has yet gone 15-0, and I don't think any college team has won 15 games in a season at all. So 14 wins is the high point so far in college football history, and only a few teams have done that. If I'm not mistaken, BYU went 14-1 back in 1996. They played in the Pigskin Classic against Texas A&M, which back then was an extra game (Kickoff Classic was the other such game. You may remember we beat Ohio State in this game to start the 1986 season. Pigskin Classic was played on campus, Kickoff Classic was played at Giants Stadium at the Meadowlands). They played what was an exempt game at Hawaii, the new WAC championship game, and the Cotton Bowl game vs. Kansas State.

I believe we were then the first team to go 14-0 in 2009***. Schedules had expanded to 12 regular season games, the SEC title game, and then the NC game vs. Texas. I know Ohio State has gone 14-1, and Clemson has gone 14-1. So, I think BYU, Alabama, Ohio State, and Clemson have been the only teams in college football history to win 14 games in one season.
The point of all this rambling is that Nick Saban has done this three times at Alabama.

***I went back and looked an Ohio State was actually the first 14-0 team in 2002. A quirk in the calendar allowed an extra weekend, so teams played 12 regular season games that year. They were still doing the preseason games and Ohio State played Texas Tech in one of them, which made 13 games, and then the Fiesta Bowl NC game vs. Miami.
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Lacy averaged over 6 yards a carry that year.
And so did freshman TJ Yeldon....

Which makes the play calling at the end of the ATM game ten times more egregious. Nuss should have been thrown out of the coaching box for those calls.



I still think 2012 is the best and that it would be between 2012 and 2016 if 2016 had won the NC. I'm pretty sure 2012 leads in point differential per game under Saban with maybe 2016 or 2011 being better? I would have to do more research though.
I aim to please:

2011
Offensive PPG: 34.8
Defensive PPG: 8.2 (this is insane)

2012
Offense: 38.7
Defense: 10.9

2013
Offense: 38.2
Defense: 13.9

2014
Offense: 36.8
Defense: 16.6

2015
Offense: 35.1
Defense: 14.4

2016
Offense: 38.8
Defense: 11.8


These numbers to my simple mind also blow the whole "Lane Kiffin is an offensive genius" myth right out of the water when you remember that our offensive PPG is inflated especially in 2016 because of all the NOTs.

The actual numbers would support Nuss as better than Kiffin....I'm just saying. Of course, the argument then becomes "but Kiffin had all those one-year quarterbacks." True - but that had nothing to do with Derrick Henry in 2015 now, either - did it?


I think people are underrating that 2011 D.
Attention: this will be the only time in world history where anyone actually says this even jokingly. The 2011 D was from another planet......but the game has evolved light years beyond that is the (correct) observation.



I actually think(based on the LSU game) the 2011 D would have had a good shot at really slowing down the 2016 O.
You're right......but the 2016 D would have an easier time stopping freshman McCarron, too.



Its not like there were no running QBs we faced that year. Now, none of them were on Hurts level but still.

In 2011 you mean?

We didn't face anyone in the universe of Tim Tebow, Cam Newton, Johnny Manziel, or DeShaun Watson, though.

Let's also not forget that we allowed fewer than 9 points a game in 2011 and beat an LSU team 21-0 that was well on its way to many people declaring it the best team ever. LSU that year crushed literally everyone they played except us. They put up 30 or more points in every game but 3. 2 of those games were vs us. Heck, they put up 40 or more in 9 of there games. They weren't playing an easy schedule either.
True.......but the argument on 2011 will always be they got an extra game of rest (no SEC title game) and there was no playoff.
 

RTR91

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The 2011 defense that we all love held it's opponents to 51% of their yard per game average. That's less than the 2015 (65%) and 2016 (58%) teams.

It also held opponents to 29% of their points per game average, which is also less than than 2015 (47%) and 2016 (38%).

We all love that defense, but the best offense it faced all year was either Arkansas (#29 in FBS total offense, 438.08 ypg) or Georgia Southern (#13 in FCS total offense, 435 ypg). Mississippi State was the second best FBS offense it faced, and MSU ranked 84th in total offense (357.15 ypg).

Meanwhile, the 2015 defense faced six teams that averaged 437 yards per game or more, and the 2016 defense faced nine teams that averaged more than 440 yards per game.

The 2016 defense's opponents averaged 451.51 yards per game, so the 2011 defense didn't even face a team the equivalent of the average offense faced by the 2016 team.


We all recognize the game has changed, so who knows how that team would do against today's offense. I'm not sure they would be able to shut them down like the 2015 or 2016 teams did, though.
 

G-VilleTider

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I am not saying 2010 was the best team, but you will never be able to convince me that any college team I have ever seen could have beaten that team in its bowl game.
 

MemphisBamaDude

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The 2011 defense that we all love held it's opponents to 51% of their yard per game average. That's less than the 2015 (65%) and 2016 (58%) teams.

It also held opponents to 29% of their points per game average, which is also less than than 2015 (47%) and 2016 (38%).

We all love that defense, but the best offense it faced all year was either Arkansas (#29 in FBS total offense, 438.08 ypg) or Georgia Southern (#13 in FCS total offense, 435 ypg). Mississippi State was the second best FBS offense it faced, and MSU ranked 84th in total offense (357.15 ypg).

Meanwhile, the 2015 defense faced six teams that averaged 437 yards per game or more, and the 2016 defense faced nine teams that averaged more than 440 yards per game.

The 2016 defense's opponents averaged 451.51 yards per game, so the 2011 defense didn't even face a team the equivalent of the average offense faced by the 2016 team.


We all recognize the game has changed, so who knows how that team would do against today's offense. I'm not sure they would be able to shut them down like the 2015 or 2016 teams did, though.
I agree with this. The fact that the 2016 defense allowed only 11 points a game in this era is hella impressive.

IMO in this discussion, winning the championship has to mean a big less than other parameters. The quality of the opponent in each game varies so much that using a simple win/loss in the title game as a qualifier/disqualified doesn't seem accurate. I think I would take that 2016 Clemson team vs any other team we've faced in a championship game, including 2011 LSU.
 

RollTide_HTTR

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And so did freshman TJ Yeldon....

Which makes the play calling at the end of the ATM game ten times more egregious. Nuss should have been thrown out of the coaching box for those calls.

I aim to please:

2011
Offensive PPG: 34.8
Defensive PPG: 8.2 (this is insane)

2012
Offense: 38.7
Defense: 10.9

2013
Offense: 38.2
Defense: 13.9

2014
Offense: 36.8
Defense: 16.6

2015
Offense: 35.1
Defense: 14.4

2016
Offense: 38.8
Defense: 11.8

These numbers to my simple mind also blow the whole "Lane Kiffin is an offensive genius" myth right out of the water when you remember that our offensive PPG is inflated especially in 2016 because of all the NOTs.

The actual numbers would support Nuss as better than Kiffin....I'm just saying. Of course, the argument then becomes "but Kiffin had all those one-year quarterbacks." True - but that had nothing to do with Derrick Henry in 2015 now, either - did it?

Attention: this will be the only time in world history where anyone actually says this even jokingly. The 2011 D was from another planet......but the game has evolved light years beyond that is the (correct) observation.

You're right......but the 2016 D would have an easier time stopping freshman McCarron, too.

In 2011 you mean?
We didn't face anyone in the universe of Tim Tebow, Cam Newton, Johnny Manziel, or DeShaun Watson, though.

True.......but the argument on 2011 will always be they got an extra game of rest (no SEC title game) and there was no playoff.
To clarify I don't think the 2011 team is the best. I just started to see some people give it very little credit vs 2016 O. And I agree that the game has evolved a ton.


Thanks for the info too. If I'm not mistaken that means 2016 point differential was 27, 2012 was 27.8 and 2011 at 26.6.
 

RollTide_HTTR

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The 2011 defense that we all love held it's opponents to 51% of their yard per game average. That's less than the 2015 (65%) and 2016 (58%) teams.

It also held opponents to 29% of their points per game average, which is also less than than 2015 (47%) and 2016 (38%).

We all love that defense, but the best offense it faced all year was either Arkansas (#29 in FBS total offense, 438.08 ypg) or Georgia Southern (#13 in FCS total offense, 435 ypg). Mississippi State was the second best FBS offense it faced, and MSU ranked 84th in total offense (357.15 ypg).

Meanwhile, the 2015 defense faced six teams that averaged 437 yards per game or more, and the 2016 defense faced nine teams that averaged more than 440 yards per game.

The 2016 defense's opponents averaged 451.51 yards per game, so the 2011 defense didn't even face a team the equivalent of the average offense faced by the 2016 team.


We all recognize the game has changed, so who knows how that team would do against today's offense. I'm not sure they would be able to shut them down like the 2015 or 2016 teams did, though.
I completely agree. I guess my contention is that the 2011 team was specifically built for 2011 football. So, its hard to compare it to 2016 and 2015 without that context. For example I bet CJ Mosley would have played almost 100% of snaps if that 2011 D was playing todays offenses.
 

RTR91

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I completely agree. I guess my contention is that the 2011 team was specifically built for 2011 football. So, its hard to compare it to 2016 and 2015 without that context. For example I bet CJ Mosley would have played almost 100% of snaps if that 2011 D was playing todays offenses.
Let's change that to "for 2011 SEC football." Look at the total offense averages for each conference:

SEC - 353.44 ypg
ACC - 384.15 ypg
Big 12 - 375.17 ypg
Big 12 - 452.45 ypg
Pac-12 - 418.42 ypg
 

RollTide_HTTR

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Let's change that to "for 2011 SEC football." Look at the total offense averages for each conference:

SEC - 353.44 ypg
ACC - 384.15 ypg
Big 12 - 375.17 ypg
Big 12 - 452.45 ypg
Pac-12 - 418.42 ypg
That's pretty fair. Your point about not playing a ton of high octane offenses is also a good one and again I don't think the 2011 team is our best team. The only reason I would put it over 2016 is because I think titles matter more than I think others do (which again is fair its just subjective).

I do maintain that I think 2012 was our best team under Saban with the caveat that a healthy 2016 team might have been better.
 

ALA2262

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On 01/01/2011 none of them would have beaten 2010. Not without additional preparation time, or rest, or healing time. Like EVERY other team 2010 had faced the last TWO months of the season.

Talk about killing your golden goose that is laying your golden eggs. The SEC killed their golden goose in 2010.
 
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ALA2262

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I am not saying 2010 was the best team, but you will never be able to convince me that any college team I have ever seen could have beaten that team in its bowl game.
The ref said it was the best CFB team he had ever seen. He was a 17 year veteran official of the Big 8/Big 12 who had officiated in some 1995 Nebraska games.
 

teamplayer

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On 01/01/2011 none of them would have beaten 2010. Not without additional preparation time, or rest, or healing time. Like EVERY other team 2010 had faced the last TWO months of the season.

Talk about killing your golden goose that is laying your golden eggs. The SEC killed their golden goose in 2010.
While everyone would agree that the performance that day was fantastic. I think we had another team that made a supposedly very good MSU team look very average. MSU is well coached, but a few teams have exposed their lack of talent across the board, including our 2015 team.
 

CrimsonProf

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For those of you think the 2011 D would hope up against today's offenses, where would you put Upshaw, Chapman, Dial, Williams, etc in your alignments against Clemson, Ole Miss, UT, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

rgw

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Given some more thought and went back on what I said earlier :D...

1. 2015 is the best overall team to win a title. Elite defense, very explosive offense from around mid-season through the championship game.

2. 2012 had the best offensive unit but definitely the weakest defensive unit to win a national title.

3. 2016 is the best team to not win a title.

4. 2010 is the most talented team to not win a title.

5. 2014 is the biggest overachiever.

6. 2009 is the biggest surprise/year-ahead-of-schedule team.

7. 2008 was the most fun...sometimes I wish we could go back to those times when it was just so dang fun to be feared again and not have to feel like it is title or bust.

8. 2013 was the biggest disappointment.

9. 2011 was our luckiest title.
 
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day-day

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The 2011 defense that we all love held it's opponents to 51% of their yard per game average. That's less than the 2015 (65%) and 2016 (58%) teams.

It also held opponents to 29% of their points per game average, which is also less than than 2015 (47%) and 2016 (38%).

We all love that defense, but the best offense it faced all year was either Arkansas (#29 in FBS total offense, 438.08 ypg) or Georgia Southern (#13 in FCS total offense, 435 ypg). Mississippi State was the second best FBS offense it faced, and MSU ranked 84th in total offense (357.15 ypg).

Meanwhile, the 2015 defense faced six teams that averaged 437 yards per game or more, and the 2016 defense faced nine teams that averaged more than 440 yards per game.

The 2016 defense's opponents averaged 451.51 yards per game, so the 2011 defense didn't even face a team the equivalent of the average offense faced by the 2016 team.


We all recognize the game has changed, so who knows how that team would do against today's offense. I'm not sure they would be able to shut them down like the 2015 or 2016 teams did, though.
Interesting point about the quality of offenses faced by the teams. Still, the 51% ypg and 29% of points seems significantly better than the percentages for 2015 and 2016.

2011 was the one year when there was a clear distinction between the top 2 teams (Bama and LSU) and the rest of the nation.
 

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