UAB attendance back to normal

Rama Jama

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Jan 4, 2011
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Tuscaloosa
Here are the facts. The average FBS football scholarship costs as of 2016 is 36,070 a year. FCS costs 20,706 and have 63 scholarship athlete as opposed to 85 for FBS. Just on scholarships alone, the additional cost is almost 1.7 million never mind the cost of assistant coaches, room and board, extra cost to travel, equipment, weight room,etc. I suspect if costs a minimum of 5 to 6 million to field a FBS team. This info came off of this site.

http://www.scholarshipstats.com/average-per-athlete.html

According to USA today, the revenue for UAB last year in athletics as as a whole was about 30 million, 20 million of which came from the school itself.

My point is the money could better be used to give student scholarships to undergrads and med school students. This would have far more impact on UAB than a football team ever will. Doctors donate money, not football players who have almost zero shot at a pro career.
 

Shrack

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Sep 20, 2017
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LOL

Of course the uab militia will deny the validity of The Carr Report - psu denied the results of the investigation into the Sandusky debacle.

In the most simplistic terms, because I think Jack Simmons, err I mean shrack is really trying to cloud the issue with extraneous numbers and creative interpretations...

uab football attendance stinks
there is no real interest in the program - I NEVER hear anyone outside of Birmingham even acknowledge uab football
uab long ago alienated The University, and alienated many Alabama fans, like myself, who would have supported Basketball
The City of Birmingham in a hand washing deal buys 5000 seats a year from uab - which is counted as "attendance"
expenses for football are immense
It would be best for UAB proper and its other athletic endeavors to drop the football farse

And other Programs in this situation should also consider course adjustment - I do not think South Alabama needs D-1 football, am a bit torn on Troy. Troy has paid their dues, but I still tend to think they have over-expanded as well
Coming from the guy who posts nothing but his personal anecdotes and zero actual numbers.

College Football Playoff pays UAB athletics $800,000 a year and this was unaccounted for in the Carr report. That's a fact. ($800k difference)
CUSA pays UAB (at the time of the Carr report) $3,000,000 a year, Carr only counted a $1,600,000 million loss in revenue. That's a fact. (1.4 million difference)
Scholarships at UAB are not $52,000 a year. That's a fact.
Football donations account for more than was shown in the Carr report. That's a fact.
Carr report overestimates the cost of a having football team at UAB in 2018. This will be shown next year.

Those are just some examples of the inaccuracies.

Not a clue who Jack Simmons is or what you're referring to...unless you were trying to reference the alabama state rep Jack Williams..I guess?

But please tell me how dropping football will help UAB athletics. Tell me which conference they're going to thrive in once football is gone and how the revenue is going to look. I'd love to hear your apparently highly detailed take on it.

And Troy has the largest school-funded subsidy of anyone in the state

I'm sure you'll come back with "but, uhh, mah feelings, UAB shouldn't have a program just cause!!!!" and not actually give me any real numbers. Attendance after last 2 home games = 35,001 average and our actual ticket sales revenue will easily dwarf Troy and USA. Get back to me later

sources:
http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/
https://sports.vice.com/en_us/artic...ford-football-so-why-is-it-choosing-otherwise
 
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bama2112

All-American
Nov 19, 2006
2,019
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107
Cobb County, Ga.
What I am ticked off about is the city of Birmingham, a billion dollar water system failiure, name a recent mayor that has not been in jail. Well at least 2 have.

The city could have built a dome stadium. SEC championship in Bham. Or for you young ones, they also lost the regional airport to Atlanta. Birmingham was the first choice but the city thought it would cost too much money.
 

Shrack

New Member
Sep 20, 2017
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Here are the facts. The average FBS football scholarship costs as of 2016 is 36,070 a year. FCS costs 20,706 and have 63 scholarship athlete as opposed to 85 for FBS. Just on scholarships alone, the additional cost is almost 1.7 million never mind the cost of assistant coaches, room and board, extra cost to travel, equipment, weight room,etc. I suspect if costs a minimum of 5 to 6 million to field a FBS team. This info came off of this site.

http://www.scholarshipstats.com/average-per-athlete.html

According to USA today, the revenue for UAB last year in athletics as as a whole was about 30 million, 20 million of which came from the school itself.

My point is the money could better be used to give student scholarships to undergrads and med school students. This would have far more impact on UAB than a football team ever will. Doctors donate money, not football players who have almost zero shot at a pro career.
$6,333,200 are student fees for sports specifically...student fees that don't happen without athletics. 14.6 million came directly from the school in 2016. Without athletics, how many less students come to UAB? Does enrollment increase like how they're trying to dramatically raise over the next few years, or does it decrease? It would obviously decrease, thus losing tuition money. Can you even name a large southern college off the top of your head without a football team? A single one?

Many people are using expenses for UAB athletics and basically attributing it to the football program as the reason why and that is blatantly false (not necessarily saying you are, but I see it a lot in the form of "UAB football is costing 20 million dollars a year!!!" which is not the case obviously). We can make an argument that all athletics are a waste of time and money if they're not drawing a profit and all of that money could be best used to give doctors scholarships. Shouldn't even offer athletics at most high schools if that's the case. We'll have about two options for college sports in our state and maybe a few of the top tier high schools.

It's a bit ironic though as you're saying sports players themselves don't donate to a university, sure, but your university took in 30 million dollars last year in 2016 solely because of it's sports teams. There's no telling how many alumni donate in other areas to Alabama simply because they feel more attached due to the football team.
 

PitMaster

Suspended
Aug 24, 2015
2,281
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0
Having grown up in Birmingham in the 1970s, and having family in that area going back over 100 years, I will give you my perspective. Bear in mind that UAB is an urban campus, a largely commuter school, and most local students already were Alabama or Auburn fans, and identified much more closely with those campuses. UAB was where they went to school, but athletically, their heart lay in Tuscaloosa or Auburn. You just cannot get the "warm fuzzies" about a campus in a concrete jungle like you can a campus located in Tuscaloosa, Auburn, Baton Rouge, etc.

UAB decided in the mid 1970s to start a Division 1 Basketball program, commencing in 1978. They scored a huge coup in luring Gene Bartow as Head Coach, who was the successor to John Wooden at UCLA. I believe Bartow envisioned being able to create a program like Memphis, one of his former coaching stops. They actually had a contest in local media to create the team nickname, which obviously became the Blazers (in large part, I think, due to the fact the Portland Trail BLAZERS had just won the NBA Championship). There was actually excitement and interest within the local community, and excitement about Basketball as a sport was at that time more prevalent than today.

And the program started with a bang. Good product, good crowds, even filling the 17, 654 seats of the Birmingham-Jefferson Civic Center. People like me were devout Alabama or Auburn folks, but still bought tickets and went to cheer the Blazers. All was well within the kingdom, and the subjects content.

But then, quickly, in the mid 1980s things began to sour a bit. There was a lot of TOP talent in Alabama, especially in the Birmingham area - and some intense recruiting battles for that talent occurred between Bama and the Blazers. Head Coaches Wimp Sanderson and of Alabama and Bartow began developing an enmity that would only increase over time. When UAB lost some of those recruiting battles, Bartow began contacting the ncaa, quietly, pointing fingers at UA for recruiting improprieties.

UAB began seeing the erosion of the fanbase - Alabama guy especially began to look less and less favorably at UAB as time passed. I can testify - I was one that used to enjoy attending UAB games, but by the mid 80s had far less inclination to spend my time and money at the BJCC.

The dominoes began to topple towards a further and crippling rift between Tuscaloosa and Birmingham in 1989, albeit in an innocuous fashion, when UAB announced the creation of a club football team. Here is a link to a good history of UAB origins, beginning on page 12.

https://www.uab.edu/cas/history/images/Documents/VHS/Vulcan_Historical_Review_V17_2013.pdf


Note that Pat Dye was in favor, and Bill Curry, Head Coach at Alabama, was not. In fact, I believe there was a belief at auburn, especially within power circles, that the rise of UAB football would only hamper Alabama. As such, no wonder Auburn was supportive - it was largely self-serving.

If you are able, remember the sports climate in the state at that time. Alabama was transitioning, and not very well, to like after Coach Bryant. Auburn was experiencing success, feeling their oats, and had won the battle over being able to host Alabama in Auburn. Alabama had put in the west upper deck to Bryant-Denny Stadium in 1988, and there were plans to further expand with an eye on eventually playing all games in Tuscaloosa. This possibility/eventuality was not lost on even the dim-witted, myopic Birmingham leadership. Eric Ramsey and Gene Jelks were on the horizon, as well as the Antonio Langham mess, and both Alabama and Auburn would experience severe sanctions within a 5 year period. The Wimp Sanderson and Nancy Watts saga was imminent.

It was a very unsettled time for State sports, especially for the University of Alabama.
So, UAB club football arrives in 1989, - and the fast track begins. In 1991, UAB announces they are moving upwards into Division III football, with DR. Jim Hilyer as Head Coach. Due to an NCAA ruling that Universities could not have athletics programs competing at multi-divisional levels, in 1993 UAB was "forced" to move to a Division 1-AA status. In 1994, UAB played Kansas, their first ever game against a D-1 program, and Hilyer resigned after the season, with Watson Brown being named Head Coach.

UAB applies for, and received, clearance in 1995 to move into D-1 football, and began competing at that level in 1996. Then, near the end of that same year, C-USA Commissioner Mike Slive (hmm) announced UAB would be admitted as a football playing member in 1999.

Think about all that for a moment. In the space of six - SIX - years, UAB started a club football squad and transitioned into full Division 1 status. This at a commuter campus, without a solid "UAB First" fanbase to count on, and with no time to create one. This was a shotgun wedding of UAB and D-1 Football, and came about quicker than an Elizabeth Taylor whirlwind romance/marriage.

Now, back to the Bartow factor. Coach Bartow was not idle during all this - he would coach UAB Basketball till 1996, and serve as AD till 2000. He was of course highly involved in the creation and transition of UAB Football. But that was not all, as came out in 1993 in the LA Times, regarding a letter Bartow wrote to David Berst, NCAA enforcement director, back to 1991. The focus in LA was a perceived fear Bartow had of UCLA Super Booster Sam Gilbert, an hombre some thought had "mafia ties" - but this resonated with folks in Alabama...



http://articles.latimes.com/1993-08-04/sports/sp-20220_1_sam-gilbert

However, Bartow went further, had he not, damage would have been mitigated to a degree. But Bartow committed the cardinal sin where the University of Alabama was concerned - he slandered the name of Coach Bryant...

From The New York Times...


http://www.nytimes.com/1993/08/05/s...w-accused-alabama-in-1991-letter.html?mcubz=0

Interesting that we now have both the LA Times and New York Times, involved at least to some degree, in the escalating Tusclaoosa-Birmingham feud. Big City coming to the country, in a way.
:biggrin2:

So Bartow sends this letter in 1991, it gets, for some reason, leaked to an LA Times reporter in 93 who publishes a story about it on August 4th, 1993. The very NEXT DAY Bartow issued an apology...



http://articles.latimes.com/1993-08-05/sports/sp-20797_1_gene-bartow

A lot of Alabama fans saw the situation as this - Bartow attacked THE MAN, The Legend, Coach Bryant, in his letter to Berst and the NCAA. He also did this years AFTER Coach Bryant's death, and would never have dared confront Bryant himself. Bartow is now in the process of fast-tracking the UAB football venture, with the full support and endorsement of Auburn officials.

Alabama fans were DONE with supporting UAB athletics, in anything, at this point.

Time marches on, UAB wins some football games, loses more, and plays to paltry crowd in a declining venue on Graymont Avenue. The strange union of UAB officials, a few boosters, and City of Birmingham officials (
not much chance of dirty dealings and self-serving decisions here) keeps UAB Football afloat, partly because the City buys some 5000 tickets per year that will count as "attendance" when NCAA crowd requirements are analyzed. But the program bleeds money, cannot develop a dedicated fanbase, especially in a blossoming technological age where entertainment options are increasing by the boatloads.

All the while, UAB folks are constantly whining about a perceived lack of fair treatment from The University of Alabama Board of Trustees. They cannot draw consistently fair crowds to the games - yet espouse the notion that "If we can just have someone build us a new, state of the art, 40,000 or so seat stadium, fans will suddenly stream in." IE, they are BEGGING for investments, with no history to convince anyone with sense that such an investment would be a good idea. As regards the stadium, UAB tried to organize a big time rally, to meet on Campus and bus to Tuscaloosa to demonstrate outside a UA BOT meeting. These "UAB Freedom Riders" were gonna save the Blazer day.

They wanted thousands to ride - they took 2 buses with empty seats.

In 2014, UAB President Ray Watts decided to take a good look at UAB Athletics, and plot the best course of future direction. UAB employed outside resources, including CarrSports Consulting, and came to teh conclusion that it would be in the best interest of UAB to drop football. It was determined that to be "competitive" UAB would have to increase the football budget by 49 million, and that money would be better spent elsewhere.

“In order to invest at least another $49 million, UAB would have to redirect funds away from other critical areas of importance, like education, research, patient care and student services, which are core to UAB’s mission, and our priority athletic programs would suffer competitively.” ― President Ray L. Watts
https://www.uab.edu/athleticsplan/message/announcement-dec-2014

A look at UAB budgets illuminates a program that cannot pay for itself. From an al.com 2014 article on the budget...



http://www.al.com/opinion/index.ssf/2014/12/how_broke_is_uabs_athletics_de.html



Now, there are many programs like UAB around the country, who need subsidy cash. The UAB leadership made a wise and prudent decision to drop Football, which others should also consider. But thanks to a bunch of bleeding hearts and a story that the national media turned into an "injustice" for a brief minute, UAB caved in and decided to bring the money pit of UAB football back to life. The whiners, "outraged" media types et al have LONG ago moved on to other issues to protest.

But we in Alabama are still here, forced to financially prop up a Potemkin Village of a program.

Meanwhile, what about the other athletic and academic programs that WERE axed to create the football farse? And the Programs that now will NOT benefit from funds that would have been diverted their way after euthanizing the farse? All for the sake of the pipe dream?

As an Alabama guy who once, long ago, also supported UAB - To Hell with UAB Athletics :BigA::BigA::BigA:
For the uab dude - facts and links, plus personal perspective

You still never address the fact that scholarly gents, after a long and frankly overdue consideration period, decided monies that would be thrown in the uab football sewer could best be used elsewhere within the university.

You are starting to come across as a paid lobbyist - or someone who has something to gain by the existence of the football farse. And really none of the monies you mention, even if accurate, or somewhat, none really are self-generated. The existence of uab football can, in urban terms, be equated to a "baby mama"
 

Cruiser

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Sep 24, 2015
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What I am ticked off about is the city of Birmingham, a billion dollar water system failiure, name a recent mayor that has not been in jail. Well at least 2 have.

The city could have built a dome stadium. SEC championship in Bham. Or for you young ones, they also lost the regional airport to Atlanta. Birmingham was the first choice but the city thought it would cost too much money.
Bond failure was Jefferson county; not City of B'ham. It has it's own problems
 

Shrack

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Sep 20, 2017
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Having grown up in Birmingham in the 1970s, and having family in that area going back over 100 years, I will give you my perspective. Bear in mind that UAB is an urban campus, a largely commuter school, and most local students already were Alabama or Auburn fans, and identified much more closely with those campuses. UAB was where they went to school, but athletically, their heart lay in Tuscaloosa or Auburn. You just cannot get the "warm fuzzies" about a campus in a concrete jungle like you can a campus located in Tuscaloosa, Auburn, Baton Rouge, etc.

UAB decided in the mid 1970s to start a Division 1 Basketball program, commencing in 1978. They scored a huge coup in luring Gene Bartow as Head Coach, who was the successor to John Wooden at UCLA. I believe Bartow envisioned being able to create a program like Memphis, one of his former coaching stops. They actually had a contest in local media to create the team nickname, which obviously became the Blazers (in large part, I think, due to the fact the Portland Trail BLAZERS had just won the NBA Championship). There was actually excitement and interest within the local community, and excitement about Basketball as a sport was at that time more prevalent than today.

And the program started with a bang. Good product, good crowds, even filling the 17, 654 seats of the Birmingham-Jefferson Civic Center. People like me were devout Alabama or Auburn folks, but still bought tickets and went to cheer the Blazers. All was well within the kingdom, and the subjects content.

But then, quickly, in the mid 1980s things began to sour a bit. There was a lot of TOP talent in Alabama, especially in the Birmingham area - and some intense recruiting battles for that talent occurred between Bama and the Blazers. Head Coaches Wimp Sanderson and of Alabama and Bartow began developing an enmity that would only increase over time. When UAB lost some of those recruiting battles, Bartow began contacting the ncaa, quietly, pointing fingers at UA for recruiting improprieties.

UAB began seeing the erosion of the fanbase - Alabama guy especially began to look less and less favorably at UAB as time passed. I can testify - I was one that used to enjoy attending UAB games, but by the mid 80s had far less inclination to spend my time and money at the BJCC.

The dominoes began to topple towards a further and crippling rift between Tuscaloosa and Birmingham in 1989, albeit in an innocuous fashion, when UAB announced the creation of a club football team. Here is a link to a good history of UAB origins, beginning on page 12.

https://www.uab.edu/cas/history/images/Documents/VHS/Vulcan_Historical_Review_V17_2013.pdf


Note that Pat Dye was in favor, and Bill Curry, Head Coach at Alabama, was not. In fact, I believe there was a belief at auburn, especially within power circles, that the rise of UAB football would only hamper Alabama. As such, no wonder Auburn was supportive - it was largely self-serving.

If you are able, remember the sports climate in the state at that time. Alabama was transitioning, and not very well, to like after Coach Bryant. Auburn was experiencing success, feeling their oats, and had won the battle over being able to host Alabama in Auburn. Alabama had put in the west upper deck to Bryant-Denny Stadium in 1988, and there were plans to further expand with an eye on eventually playing all games in Tuscaloosa. This possibility/eventuality was not lost on even the dim-witted, myopic Birmingham leadership. Eric Ramsey and Gene Jelks were on the horizon, as well as the Antonio Langham mess, and both Alabama and Auburn would experience severe sanctions within a 5 year period. The Wimp Sanderson and Nancy Watts saga was imminent.

It was a very unsettled time for State sports, especially for the University of Alabama.
So, UAB club football arrives in 1989, - and the fast track begins. In 1991, UAB announces they are moving upwards into Division III football, with DR. Jim Hilyer as Head Coach. Due to an NCAA ruling that Universities could not have athletics programs competing at multi-divisional levels, in 1993 UAB was "forced" to move to a Division 1-AA status. In 1994, UAB played Kansas, their first ever game against a D-1 program, and Hilyer resigned after the season, with Watson Brown being named Head Coach.

UAB applies for, and received, clearance in 1995 to move into D-1 football, and began competing at that level in 1996. Then, near the end of that same year, C-USA Commissioner Mike Slive (hmm) announced UAB would be admitted as a football playing member in 1999.

Think about all that for a moment. In the space of six - SIX - years, UAB started a club football squad and transitioned into full Division 1 status. This at a commuter campus, without a solid "UAB First" fanbase to count on, and with no time to create one. This was a shotgun wedding of UAB and D-1 Football, and came about quicker than an Elizabeth Taylor whirlwind romance/marriage.

Now, back to the Bartow factor. Coach Bartow was not idle during all this - he would coach UAB Basketball till 1996, and serve as AD till 2000. He was of course highly involved in the creation and transition of UAB Football. But that was not all, as came out in 1993 in the LA Times, regarding a letter Bartow wrote to David Berst, NCAA enforcement director, back to 1991. The focus in LA was a perceived fear Bartow had of UCLA Super Booster Sam Gilbert, an hombre some thought had "mafia ties" - but this resonated with folks in Alabama...



http://articles.latimes.com/1993-08-04/sports/sp-20220_1_sam-gilbert

However, Bartow went further, had he not, damage would have been mitigated to a degree. But Bartow committed the cardinal sin where the University of Alabama was concerned - he slandered the name of Coach Bryant...

From The New York Times...


http://www.nytimes.com/1993/08/05/s...w-accused-alabama-in-1991-letter.html?mcubz=0

Interesting that we now have both the LA Times and New York Times, involved at least to some degree, in the escalating Tusclaoosa-Birmingham feud. Big City coming to the country, in a way.
:biggrin2:

So Bartow sends this letter in 1991, it gets, for some reason, leaked to an LA Times reporter in 93 who publishes a story about it on August 4th, 1993. The very NEXT DAY Bartow issued an apology...



http://articles.latimes.com/1993-08-05/sports/sp-20797_1_gene-bartow

A lot of Alabama fans saw the situation as this - Bartow attacked THE MAN, The Legend, Coach Bryant, in his letter to Berst and the NCAA. He also did this years AFTER Coach Bryant's death, and would never have dared confront Bryant himself. Bartow is now in the process of fast-tracking the UAB football venture, with the full support and endorsement of Auburn officials.

Alabama fans were DONE with supporting UAB athletics, in anything, at this point.

Time marches on, UAB wins some football games, loses more, and plays to paltry crowd in a declining venue on Graymont Avenue. The strange union of UAB officials, a few boosters, and City of Birmingham officials (
not much chance of dirty dealings and self-serving decisions here) keeps UAB Football afloat, partly because the City buys some 5000 tickets per year that will count as "attendance" when NCAA crowd requirements are analyzed. But the program bleeds money, cannot develop a dedicated fanbase, especially in a blossoming technological age where entertainment options are increasing by the boatloads.

All the while, UAB folks are constantly whining about a perceived lack of fair treatment from The University of Alabama Board of Trustees. They cannot draw consistently fair crowds to the games - yet espouse the notion that "If we can just have someone build us a new, state of the art, 40,000 or so seat stadium, fans will suddenly stream in." IE, they are BEGGING for investments, with no history to convince anyone with sense that such an investment would be a good idea. As regards the stadium, UAB tried to organize a big time rally, to meet on Campus and bus to Tuscaloosa to demonstrate outside a UA BOT meeting. These "UAB Freedom Riders" were gonna save the Blazer day.

They wanted thousands to ride - they took 2 buses with empty seats.

In 2014, UAB President Ray Watts decided to take a good look at UAB Athletics, and plot the best course of future direction. UAB employed outside resources, including CarrSports Consulting, and came to teh conclusion that it would be in the best interest of UAB to drop football. It was determined that to be "competitive" UAB would have to increase the football budget by 49 million, and that money would be better spent elsewhere.

“In order to invest at least another $49 million, UAB would have to redirect funds away from other critical areas of importance, like education, research, patient care and student services, which are core to UAB’s mission, and our priority athletic programs would suffer competitively.” ― President Ray L. Watts

For the uab dude - facts and links, plus personal perspective

You still never address the fact that scholarly gents, after a long and frankly overdue consideration period, decided monies that would be thrown in the uab football sewer could best be used elsewhere within the university.

You are starting to come across as a paid lobbyist - or someone who has something to gain by the existence of the football farse. And really none of the monies you mention, even if accurate, or somewhat, none really are self-generated. The existence of uab football can, in urban terms, be equated to a "baby mama"
It's impossible that I could have actually gone to school at UAB and be a fan of the football and men's basketball team. Crazy right?

You're still not disputing any of my actual numbers. You're just repeatedly posting links to the Carr report (that UAB link references it solely) and saying the department is losing money. Yes, UAB athletics spends more money than it self generates for it's own books. It's an advertising arm of a public institution. It does the same thing that just about every athletic program in the country does other than roughly 30 or so. Even the Auburn athletic department has had years of being in the red. It's not a business

Still trying to figure out your argument. You want to shutdown football at UAB because...why? Dropping to FCS wouldn't really help the bottom line and killing football means losing conference affiliation. Or do you want to close down all athletic programs that aren't making money? Whats your endgame? or do you just dislike UAB?

Sounds like you just dislike UAB because of Bartow's letter. It's been over 25 years man. Time to move on.

edit: and I'm going to stop responding. It's clear your set in whatever dislike you have of UAB. Good luck
 
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cuda.1973

Hall of Fame
Dec 6, 2009
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Allen, Texas
The city could have built a dome stadium. SEC championship in Bham. Or for you young ones, they also lost the regional airport to Atlanta. Birmingham was the first choice but the city thought it would cost too much money.
Yeah, they always wanted to be Atlanta, until they actually had to do something to make it like Atlanta.

Wonder why Atlanta never tried to build a "state of the art" sewage treatment plant. Maybe they knew better. Or maybe, just maybe, they didn't have to conjure up such a fiasco, riddled with graft, to show off to the world (just how stupid they really are).
 

PitMaster

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Aug 24, 2015
2,281
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edit: and I'm going to stop responding. It's clear your set in whatever dislike you have of UAB. Good luck
I'm against frivolous expenditures and waste of taxpayer dollars. You're playing a big city style shell game with the numbers, with millions of dollars but we all know the truth
 

cbi1972

Hall of Fame
Nov 8, 2005
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Yeah, they always wanted to be Atlanta, until they actually had to do something to make it like Atlanta.

Wonder why Atlanta never tried to build a "state of the art" sewage treatment plant. Maybe they knew better. Or maybe, just maybe, they didn't have to conjure up such a fiasco, riddled with graft, to show off to the world (just how stupid they really are).
I am glad Birmingham isn't Atlanta.
 

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
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Still trying to figure out your argument. You want to shutdown football at UAB because...why?
Because it's wasting money, because it's wasting money, because it's wasting money.

Because it's wasting the city of Birmingham's money. Because it's wasting UAB students money. Because it's wasting state money. Because it's wasting federal money!
And finally, because they want to waste tens of millions more!

What difference did it make when UAB no longer had a football program? Seriously, what black hole did college football, the city of Birmingham or UAB fall into? Oh, the sky didn't fall? Ok fine, stop wasting our money! There's no need for UAB football.
 
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russtang

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Apr 11, 2007
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www.uniquetitanium.com
Yeah, they always wanted to be Atlanta, until they actually had to do something to make it like Atlanta.

Wonder why Atlanta never tried to build a "state of the art" sewage treatment plant. Maybe they knew better. Or maybe, just maybe, they didn't have to conjure up such a fiasco, riddled with graft, to show off to the world (just how stupid they really are).
Yeah Bham was going to be be the next hotlanta, until reality struck. Then they wanted to be the next Memphis. That didn't work out either. Next, they wanted to be like Chattanooga.
After all the years of crime, fraud, corruption, and incompetence, they just try not to be overtaken by Hoover lol.
 

PitMaster

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Aug 24, 2015
2,281
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0
Yeah Bham was going to be be the next hotlanta, until reality struck. Then they wanted to be the next Memphis. That didn't work out either. Next, they wanted to be like Chattanooga.
After all the years of crime, fraud, corruption, and incompetence, they just try not to be overtaken by Hoover lol.
In my lifetime, Birmingham has been overtaken by...

Atlanta
Nashville
Charlotte
Memphis
Jacksonville

yet these uab foolks try to posture as though uab football will change the local world

Truth is - if you scrape down to the essence - the most vocal and informed uab supporters are doing so to line their own coffer
 

deliveryman35

Hall of Fame
Jul 26, 2003
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Coming from the guy who posts nothing but his personal anecdotes and zero actual numbers.

College Football Playoff pays UAB athletics $800,000 a year and this was unaccounted for in the Carr report. That's a fact. ($800k difference)
CUSA pays UAB (at the time of the Carr report) $3,000,000 a year, Carr only counted a $1,600,000 million loss in revenue. That's a fact. (1.4 million difference)
Scholarships at UAB are not $52,000 a year. That's a fact.
Football donations account for more than was shown in the Carr report. That's a fact.
Carr report overestimates the cost of a having football team at UAB in 2018. This will be shown next year.

Those are just some examples of the inaccuracies.

Not a clue who Jack Simmons is or what you're referring to...unless you were trying to reference the alabama state rep Jack Williams..I guess?

But please tell me how dropping football will help UAB athletics. Tell me which conference they're going to thrive in once football is gone and how the revenue is going to look. I'd love to hear your apparently highly detailed take on it.

And Troy has the largest school-funded subsidy of anyone in the state

I'm sure you'll come back with "but, uhh, mah feelings, UAB shouldn't have a program just cause!!!!" and not actually give me any real numbers. Attendance after last 2 home games = 35,001 average and our actual ticket sales revenue will easily dwarf Troy and USA. Get back to me later

sources:
http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/finances/
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics/#/
https://sports.vice.com/en_us/artic...ford-football-so-why-is-it-choosing-otherwise

Let’s cut through all the bs, shrack. UAB football at the fbs level is simply not a product that many folks outside of the south side of Bham are interested in supporting financially or otherwise. It’s a product that only an elite few and the Bham news media seem to be clamoring for( if anyone else, I want to know who). Other than providing Coach Bill Clark(whom I actually like)and his staff with nice salaries and additional athletic schollies that come with a football program, what exactly is UAB’s end game or business objective on this?
 
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Ole Man Dan

Hall of Fame
Apr 21, 2008
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Gadsden, Al.
Poor support and poor attendance were factors in UAB dropping football.
UAB looked at Football like if was a money pit they had to continuously shovel money into.
There was also a lot of dissension over the BOT also representing The University of Alabama Tuscaloosa. The City of Birmingham kept making noise for UAB to separate itself from UAT, but they never followed thru with the finances to keep the program on it's feet.
 
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JDCrimson

Hall of Fame
Feb 12, 2006
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I would like someone to look up and compare the success of UAB basketball as well as any other relevant sport before and after football? My recollection is that basketball was much more competitive prior to rise of football and basketball had conference affiliation then in the Metro conference, I think. My perception is the addition of football has been a major distraction for UAB and has to a degree hampered its role in strategy of the whole UA system which is to function as a professional graduate level research institution which btw the way I know for a fact has had a declining ability to fund the fellowships to attract the top research doctors.

Shrank you make a great argument that athletics functions basically as marketing expense whose primary objective is to function as an undergraduate institution for a stand alone institution. That is not the core mission for UAB. UAB football was a bully agenda pure and simple by Bartow that has morphed into a welfare program.

UAB is part of a larger system, the UA system and its multiple campuses whose individual budgets consolidate into a larger system budget. At this level, expenses saved on one campus may be redeployed for better return on another campus. President Watts works for the Chancellor for the entire system if he said you need to find cuts in your overall operating budget the low hanging fruit is in athletics even if that meant those savings would be redirected toward Tuscaloosa to capitalize on the highly profitable out of state enrollment growth whose core mission primarily is to function as an undergraduate institution. A $30 million investment in higher funding in research fellowships probably will generate an additional $1 billion in research grants.

You are basically suggesting that UAB deserves to have a football program and further an athletics program for an ultimate purpose that the entire system could absorb the impact to get it back on track to do what it was setup to do. In response using your premise, I would argue that Tuscaloosa should have its own medical school never mind that it already has one 60 miles down the road. Thankfully, the Chancellor and the Board see this as also a duplicate program and a waste of valuable funds. UAH is not pursuing major athletic status because the PTBs recognize it is a money pit and the UAH campus is fulfilling its mission toward the entire system just fine without D1 football.

Y'all better figure out way to support your athletics there because when inflation overtakes your ability to operate and a donor dies or loses interest there will be no second lifeline from the UA system.


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