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Game Thread: OFFICIAL POSTGAME THREAD: Bama vs. Vandy...

tusks_n_raider

tusks_n_raider

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Tideflyer said:
Would neither surprise nor bother me one bit. Kid can flat throw it. Better arm than Jalen?
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Not 'better' just different. Tua has the faster release and is more likely to pull the trigger but the overall velocity is close between them.

I'm excited about Tua too but a few folks need to simmer down a bit. The best/impressive throw he's had was that out route to Jeudy yesterday rolling right which is making a lefty throw across his body and it was a strike. VERY impressive throw.

He threw a great pass to the TE (Major)in super tight coverage that Jalen could make but probably wouldn't because he wouldn't want to take the risk and would run.

The most eye-popping play was of course the pirouette throw to Smith for a TD. It was a spectacular play but most of the time you don't want your QB chucking it as he's about to get clobbered Favre style. It WAS a perfect pass with a perfect result....but that can be an INT more times than a TD. Jalen's not going to take that risk either.

So jmho they both have excellent arm strength. The difference is Tua has a quicker release and just doesn't shy away from throwing in tight coverage and gives the receiver that opportunity to make the play.

Jalen's arm is strong as well and CAN make these same throws.... but he's not going to 'force throws' when he can run for 10 yards and get a fresh set of downs. He's making ball protection his #1 priority. He's still taking shots downfield it's just more calculated with risk in mind.

I'm super excited about both guys and they both have high ceilings.
 
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KrAzY3

KrAzY3

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Bamabuzzard said:
Again, refer back to my opening statement in bold. You don't sit that type of talent on the sidelines.
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Couldn't the same be said about several other true freshman? I mean Brian Robinson, Najee Harris, and Jerry Jeudy also looked great last game. The thing is that doesn't mean Ridley or Bo should step aside either (though it is easier to share time at receiver and running back).

It also doesn't mean Robinson will continue to get meaningful carries. Part of what we saw clearly was a beaten down team that got dominated even by the second string, however against CSU Tua was completely ineffective (while Hurts has a stellar rating, and his passing was precise). Hopefully he's turned a corner, but even his amazing play was a risk.

I have serious doubts about the wisdom of putting the veteran, proven QB on the bench under almost any scenarios that don't involve the team already up big. I think the focus should be more on developing Hurts as a passer. I think he's ahead of Tua in at least two thirds of the game, and I'd prefer they work on the remaining third than try to get Tua up to speed on the remaining two thirds.
 
B1GTide

B1GTide

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KrAzY3 said:
Couldn't the same be said about several other true freshman? I mean Brian Robinson, Najee Harris, and Jerry Jeudy also looked great last game. The thing is that doesn't mean Ridley or Bo should step aside either (though it is easier to share time at receiver and running back).

It also doesn't mean Robinson will continue to get meaningful carries. Part of what we saw clearly was a beaten down team that got dominated even by the second string, however against CSU Tua was completely ineffective (while Hurts has a stellar rating, and his passing was precise). Hopefully he's turned a corner, but even his amazing play was a risk.

I have serious doubts about the wisdom of putting the veteran, proven QB on the bench under almost any scenarios that don't involve the team already up big. I think the focus should be more on developing Hurts as a passer. I think he's ahead of Tua in at least two thirds of the game, and I'd prefer they work on the remaining third than try to get Tua up to speed on the remaining two thirds.
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That's the thing - to know for sure, you have to put the game at risk by playing Tua when the game is still at risk. Why would you do that with the SEC offensive player of the year at QB while playing for a championship? A play here or there I get, but I would much rather see them focus on continuing Jalen's development. If you win a championship this year it will be because of Jalen's play, not Tua's (IMO).
 
81usaf92

81usaf92

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KrAzY3 said:
Couldn't the same be said about several other true freshman? I mean Brian Robinson, Najee Harris, and Jerry Jeudy also looked great last game. The thing is that doesn't mean Ridley or Bo should step aside either (though it is easier to share time at receiver and running back).

It also doesn't mean Robinson will continue to get meaningful carries. Part of what we saw clearly was a beaten down team that got dominated even by the second string, however against CSU Tua was completely ineffective (while Hurts has a stellar rating, and his passing was precise). Hopefully he's turned a corner, but even his amazing play was a risk.

I have serious doubts about the wisdom of putting the veteran, proven QB on the bench under almost any scenarios that don't involve the team already up big. I think the focus should be more on developing Hurts as a passer. I think he's ahead of Tua in at least two thirds of the game, and I'd prefer they work on the remaining third than try to get Tua up to speed on the remaining two thirds.
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Anybody who really thinks Tua should play significantly needs to google Nick Saban and Drew Henson to see why that's a bad thing and CNS will never do it with an experienced quarterback at his disposal.

https://mobile.nytimes.com/1999/10/...tle-of-unbeatens-spartans-pull-a-stunner.html
 
J

JaxTider

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194
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B1GTide said:
That's the thing - to know for sure, you have to put the game at risk by playing Tua when the game is still at risk. Why would you do that with the SEC offensive player of the year at QB while playing for a championship? A play here or there I get, but I would much rather see them focus on continuing Jalen's development. If you win a championship this year it will be because of Jalen's play, not Tua's (IMO).
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Respectfully, does this approach work against Clemson in January?
 
C

CrimsonProf

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I very much agree with Buzz and, with all due respect, you've got to be blind as a bat to not see that we're running a different offense when Tua is in the game. I fully believe this is because we're going to run into another brick wall of a defense at some point and if Jalen hasn't progressed well enough to utilize the passing game to free up the run game, Tua is going to jump in to make that happen.

Maybe this won't happen - but if it doesn't happen, it's because Jalen has worked hard enough to run those plays themselves.
 
J

JaxTider

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194
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In the case of the smith TD, that wasn't "forcing a throw", it was hitting an open receiver for a TD while under duress.

In my mind that is a good play.
 
J

JaxTider

Suspended
Jan 10, 2017
194
0
0
Bamabuzzard said:
Disclaimer before I even post what I'm about to post. *Jalen Hurts is our starting QB and needs to be our starting QB. He gives us the best chance to win.*


After watching Tua play yesterday, the amount of plays he played and the types of plays they allowed him to run despite the game being completely out of hand. I believe at some point during this season we're going to see packages for Tua during parts of games to create a vertical, downfield passing attack. Our running game looked absolutely abusive yesterday but let's be realistic. We won't do Clemson like that. We won't do that in the four team playoffs. I can easily see playing a defense (Clemson for example) and they've clamped down on our running game and have taken away our short horizontal passing game. Tue comes in with a pre-prepared set of plays he's comfortable with and they use him to take the top of the defense and take advantage of the defense "squatting" on routes when Hurts is in there.

Guys, the passes that kid threw yesterday were amazing. The ball comes out of his hand like lightning. I thought Gary Danielson was about to have an orgasm in the booth watching Tua throw. You could tell he was genuinely in aw of Tua's arm and passing skills. We've got something very, very special in #13.

Again, refer back to my opening statement in bold. You don't sit that type of talent on the sidelines. You find a way to make him apart of your offense. Even if it's in a non-starter role.
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This.

We have to be prepared to beat Clemson, not Miss State and LSU.
 
KrAzY3

KrAzY3

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Ok, so the Tua stuff started before the season. Some were calling for a QB battle from day one and expecting/hoping for Tua to overtake Hurts. They've been lurking and waiting for Tua to finally have a better day. It didn't happen on A-Day, it didn't happen against FSU, it didn't happen against Fresno St., it didn't happen against CSU, but finally, finally they got their chance to pop their heads up and run their mouths.

This is absurd right now though. Hurts has played great, and one game, Tua has one good game once the opponent was already decimated and now we're supposed to get Tua ready to play in Hurts place? Are you serious? Like what is wrong with you?

Against CSU Tua was such a mess he had to be pulled so Hurts could come in and get some first downs! Did you guys already forget that? A couple good passes and you're back to play Tua, we need Tua crap. Give me a break. Hurts is the one that helped decimate Vanderbilt, Tua came in when it was all over...

I really like Tua, he has potential, I wish his redshirt could have been saved. But, he's the backup. He should be the backup. Hurts already beat a full strength FSU team this year, which I still firmly believe was one of the best teams in the country (injuries and the hurricane helped completely derail them). Alabama has the guy they need.

Now, part of the issue is I think Daboll dropped the ball on development a bit against Fresno State and CSU. This game he dominated the clock better, had Hurts running a bit less, and distributing a bit more. Yes, there will be growing pains as Hurts is developed as a passer, but if you can't comprehend that he's already a championship caliber quarterback and Alabama is lucky to have him... I'm sorry, but that's your shortcoming.
 
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T

teamplayer

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JaxTider said:
This.

We have to be prepared to beat Clemson, not Miss State and LSU.
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It is certainly fine to discuss all aspects of our team and what we think we need to improve upon to win championships. That is why most of us come to Tidefans; however, if we lose to Miss. St. and LSU or OLE MISS, we probably won't earn the right to play Clemson or whoever else may make it to the playoff. We have to be prepared to beat everyone on our schedule and probably UGA in Atlanta before worrying about beating whoever remains.
 
J

JaxTider

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KrAzY3 said:
Ok, so the Tua stuff started before the season. Some were calling for a QB battle from day one and expecting/hoping for Tua to overtake Hurts. They've been lurking and waiting for Tua to finally have a better day. It didn't happen on A-Day, it didn't happen against FSU, it didn't happen against Fresno St., it didn't happen against CSU, but finally, finally they got their chance to pop their heads up and run their mouths.

This is absurd right now though. Hurts has played great, and one game, Tua has one good game once the opponent was already decimated and now we're supposed to get Tua ready to play in Hurts place? Are you serious? Like what is wrong with you?

Against CSU Tua was such a mess he had to be pulled so Hurts could come in and get some first downs! Did you guys already forget that? A couple good passes and you're back to play Tua, we need Tua crap. Give me a break. Hurts is the one that helped decimate Vanderbilt, Tua came in when it was all over...

I really like Tua, he has potential, I wish his redshirt could have been saved. But, he's the backup. He should be the backup. Hurts already beat a full strength FSU team this year, which I still firmly believe was one of the best teams in the country (injuries and the hurricane helped completely derail them). Alabama has the guy they need.

Now, part of the issue is I think Daboll dropped the ball on development a bit against Fresno State and CSU. This game he dominated the clock better, had Hurts running a bit less, and distributing a bit more. Yes, there will be growing pains as Hurts is developed as a passer, but if you can't comprehend that he's already a championship caliber quarterback and Alabama is lucky to have him... I'm sorry, but that's your shortcoming.
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And why do you think people talk up Tua? Because they don't like Jalen? Or because they think Tua, given a bit of experience, would be a better QB against the better defenses?
 
colbysullivan

colbysullivan

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JaxTider said:
And why do you think people talk up Tua? Because they don't like Jalen? Or because they think Tua, given a bit of experience, would be a better QB against the better defenses?
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Because the backup QB has always been the fans’ most popular player, going back many years.

Seriously just stop posting, you aren’t going to convince anyone.
 
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