Yep, but you tried to impose you own criteria on my list. So leave my list the heck alone and write your own.
Misery Index: Michigan, Arkansas, FSU, Nebraska .....
- Thread starter Redwood Forrest
- Start date
If that’s the way you see it then okay. Again I’m done arguing about what average coach is better. Moving on.
I guess I just can't get past this thought - if we were looking for a coach right now and it came down to Bert or Dantonio, I don't see how anyone would choose Bert.
Complete hypothetical but does anyone really think Dantonio would fare any better at Arkansas than Bert? I don't think so..
If you stop at 2015 then I think the consensus is that Bert is an above average coach that Barry alveraz refused to pay the assistants to keep him. Past 2015 he is just an average coach in hot water.
I think dantonio is just a poor man’s Marc Richt. He is going to win a few big games that he shouldn’t but he isn’t really anything to write home about. He is going to get his 8-9 wins a year.
I think CF just probably asked the best question regarding the argument. I think Dantonio would probably be in the same hot water Bielema is in now, but he probably doesn’t have near the negative PR that Bielma does because Dantonio doesn’t make a clown of himself.
He's making somewhere around $9 million/year to finish third in his conference and troll other teams/coaches on the internet. Not a bad gig.
He's taken Michigan to third best in their division, WHAT MORE PROOF DO YOU NEED? All of his antics and nonsense and this is the result. Is this a question anymore?
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I mentioned this in another thread but schools pay coaches like Harbaugh to do more than just win games. Sure, winning games and championships is one way to bring exposure and value to the university. But, there's a lot of other ways to do that and Harbaugh excels in that regard. I'm no Harbaugh fan or apologist but I guarantee you he's earned his $9M by the value he's brought to the university..
I can't believe Jimbo gets the love he sometimes gets. IMO, he is one of the most overrated coaches in the nation. Maybe it's unfair or misguided, but personally he just smells bad. Some have suggested that he might succeed Coach Saban. I doubt it, but if so, my interest in Bama football would sink to an all time low.
If the result of his antics isn't hardware in the trophy case. It will be nothing but a sugar high. Just like the Oregon uniform gimmick. It was cool, trendy, the coolest thing in college sports. All those crazy uniform combinations. But it wasn't sustainable without hardware in the trophy case. Harbaugh might be making the bottom line on an income statement green as green can be. But ultimately it's about winning and winning conference titles and national titles. So yeah, right now the "other stuff" he's bringing to the table is viewed as value. But it will be short lived if it's not followed up with hardware. It's the nature of the beast.
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I could probably do that. For around $50k/yr.
Joe Alleva, give me a call. I could use the money. :biggrin2:
Well Harbaugh won 2 conference titles at San Diego State, he won a division title at SF and made to the NFC Champ game his first 3 seasons, the only coach in history to do so. He did this with a miserable franchise at his hiring and immediately went 13-3, one of the greatest turnarounds in league history. He did not win a PAC12 title, but he went 12-1 at Stanford, one of their best seasons in history and certainly their best in 70 years, Shaw has done well but not that good. He laid the foundation for Shaw's success. He took a 5 win Mich team and immediately won 10 games the next 2 years. This year he was replacing something like 10 starters on D and ~7 or 8 on O. His program is still behind OSU and he has stumped his toe against MSU, who benefitted by Bama/OM type breaks, but the case can certainly be made that he is a top coach. It's only his 3rd year. But Mich is paying for potential. IMO, they would have been fools to pass on him.
I do not like him personally, I can't stand in-your-face type people. I would not want him at Bama for personality reasons. But I can't believe that anyone with a pulse would take Jimbo over Harbaugh other than personality and Jimbo has his own problems in that regard. JH has and will beat MSU, but he does need to beat OSU, a much tougher proposition. Mich badly outplayed them last year with much less talent, they stumbled and bumbled some, but they were also robbed. He's in what is currently the toughest division in college football.
Right now time is on Harbaugh's side. As you've pointed out the circumstances he walked into at Michigan has bought him three-five years. I think he's a very good coach, don't get me wrong. But for me, until he wins some hardware and starts beating the other good teams in his conference. I'll reserve putting him on my "one of the best in the country" list. Again, I'll use Dabo as an example. Dabo won three conference championships (2011, 2015 & 2016) and had a much more accomplished college resume than Harbaugh and it wasn't until he won a NC that he was finally considered one of the best coaches in the country. It seems the standard for getting on that list is getting to the top and winning it. Until then you just have to reside on the "very good" list. Which is where I put Harbaugh currently.
If Bert's wife had her own section in the media guide in a bikini I'd go with Bert. Outside of that I'm going with Dantonio. Is his wife hawt?
Some of y'all have short memories regarding this coaching caliber adjudication deal. Le Smiles is not unemployed but merely biding time until he gets asked for third time - the charm - to step in at his alma mater for another failed and fired Meesheegan predecessor. In this case, it's Hairball following Hokie and RichRot...
Do you have any idea how hard it is to recruit and win at MSU? Seriously? You don't have a clue.
Saban didn't accomplish what Dantonio has accomplished there.
Peterson and Patterson just to name a couple. Urban took over from Zook and in his second year he won the SEC and the BCS. Coach Saban won the west in year two and the SEC and BCS in year three. Harbawl has a way to go.
Coach Saban never even won a conf title in 5 years at MSU, but he walked into a dumpster fire. It took him 4 years at LSU, but he walked into a mess. As you noted, it took him 3 years at Bama after taking over a mess and empty cupboard. Urban took over a talent gold mine at UF. The point is that the context is all important. I think CNS did a terrific job at all 3 stops, but there are many factors that affect the result.
I agree that CJH gets media attention far above what he has accomplished on the field at Mich, and I do not care for him and detest his manner, but that does not change the fact that he is a top 5-10 coach, IMO. Again, Mich would have been a fool to pass on him, even at a high price. I believe the media's inordinate positive attention and his in-your-face manner has blinded some regarding his coaching ability.
As an aside: I think many in the media are looking for anything non-Bama to dwell on.
Heresy: IMO, if JH was at Bama at this time rather than the Big 10, he would be dominating, probably not at Saban's level, but dominating. The Big 10 coaching is far superior to the SEC now. They probably have at least 6 coaches that are better than the 2nd or 3rd best coach in the SEC: Meyer, Harbaugh, Dantonio, Franklin, Chryst and Ferentz. Maybe add Fitzgerald and Lovie Smith. It's too early to put Brohm or Fleck on this list, but they are very promising. Smart is promising, Mullen and maybe Malzahn are decent, that's about it. The SEC better get on the stick. OTOH, I really don't care about the other programs in the SEC except as they can provide quality fodder and excitement for Alabama.
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