Poll: Bama Opponent Penalty Rankings Going Back To 2010
- Thread starter PitMaster
- Start date
The issue isn't merely a possible disparity between the number of penalties called against Alabama versus our opponents, it's primarily the disparity between the number of penalties typically called against our opponents versus the number of penalties called against them when they play Alabama.
Let's just look at last year's FBS opponents.
USC - averaged 7.6 pen/game - 6 vs Bama
Western Kentucky - averaged 6.6 pen/game - 2 vs Bama *lowest of season
Ole Miss - averaged 4.9 pen/game - 6 vs Bama
Kentucky - averaged 5.1 pen/game - 2 vs Bama *lowest of season
Kent State - averaged 5.3 pen/game - 0 vs Bama *lowest of season
Arkansas - averaged 6.2 pen/game - 6 vs Bama
Texas A&M - averaged 6.2 pen/game - 9 vs Bama
Tennessee - averaged 6.2 pen/game - 1 vs Bama *lowest of season
LSU - averaged 4.8 pen/game - 3 vs Bama
MSU - averaged 5.2 pen/game - 4 vs Bama
Barn - averaged 4.7 pen/game - 4 vs Bama
Florida - averaged 6.8 pen/game - 7 vs Bama
Washington - averaged 5.2 pen/game - 3 vs Bama
Clemson - averaged 6.3 pen/game - 3 vs Bama *lowest of season
So, out of 14 FBS opponents last season, only three had more penalties called against them when they played Bama than they averaged on the season. And five of our FBS opponents - over 1/3 of them - had the fewest number of penalties called against them on the season in the game they played Bama. Another two had only one additional penalty called against them when they played Bama than their lowest of the year, meaning half - HALF - of our opponents apparently committed their fewest or next-to-fewest penalties of the season against us.
This is just one season. Most of the past 10 look similar. It's far beyond a statistical anomaly at this point.
This is good information. Thanks for posting it. However, 4 of the lowest of season denotes, are against really bad teams. I don't expect to get holding calls and the such vs Kent St, Western Kentucky or Kentucky. The Tennessee game was a blowout. Refs pretty much swallowed their whistle in the second half. The rest of the games, which were competitive, were pretty much in line with the season average of our opponent. IOW, if you throw out the 4 worse teams we played last year the rest is average. This gives credence to the philosophy that officials aren't going to call penalties against our opponents when they're over-matched. I'm not saying it's right but I think this date further proves that point..
That's part of the problem though. The idea isn't to pick when to call the penalties and when not to, the idea is just to call the penalties when they occur. Once you go down the path of "swallowing the whistle", who dictates when this occurs? This type of thing can help a 3 score lead vanish for instance.
I would add though that Alabama fans analyzing this really occurred as Alabama developed a strong pass rush, yet the opponents never were called for holding. There was a streak where no holding calls were made at all. This against one of the best pass rushes in the nation. And that's another factor, in theory when you are getting beat you hold more not less right? So, in some aspects the argument is Alabama opponents should have more not less penalties, so the disparity becomes even more alarming.
IMHO, when you have superior athletes and are dominating most games, the refs tend to ignore the holding without even realizing what they are doing.
Well it sure looked like it in the A&M game. Poor Daron Payne got mugged so bad so many times that he ought to hire a personal injury lawyer.
Example #8,736,462 that journalists in general, and sportswriters in particular, are constitutionally incapable of accurately interpreting data -- what it represents, and mor importantly what it doesn't.
Aaron Suttles may be right. That is easy to check. But he is using the wrong stats to do it. Pull up stats for penalties called in all games by each conference crew and compare. Because it is also possible that 7 SEC schools are getting jobbed by officials. Think about it - half of the games played by SEC schools so far this year have been out of conference. So many of those games were called by officials from other conferences.
I think the refs may look at it this way when it comes to calling holding on Bama's opponents. If they call holding properly, the game will never end because of all the flags thrown. If the opposing O line starts to play properly and not hold, the QB will be removed from the field in a body bag. So on some level, conscious or subconscious, they allow the holds to occur.
But the rule makers take the opposite stand and teach the ref to call every play a TD, completion, first down and etc. so they can "review it and get it right." THIS IS TEACHING THE REF TO CALL A SLOPPY GAME. JUST MAKE A CALL AND WE'LL FIX IT. We will also add an hour to the game.
Your barking up the wrong tree because I agree with you. I'm just providing rationale for the discrepancy. I've come to terms that we're not going to get holding, or really any calls, against the cupcake teams on our schedule. It's not right but I understand it. That in and of itself really skews the penalty analysis of our opponents. It's also SOP across all sports that once the game is a blowout the officials pretty much stop calling fouls to move the game along unless it's something egregious. Again, not saying it's right but that's just how it is. A referee isn't going to call an over the back foul in a basketball game that's a 30 point blowout in the second half. In the same vein an official isn't going to call holding or much of anything else when we're ahead 41-0.
I wholeheartedly agree that there should've been more holding calls against our opponents over the years. However, how many holding calls has Alabama been called for during that time period? Does anyone really think our o-line has been called for holding every time they should've been? There has to be some balance to it because holding could be called on every play..
Fantastic information, and proves the point, "IMO".
Sure, I agree that all games should be called the same and called fairly. That said, I do understand the human reluctance to heavily penalize clearly outmanned opponents.
But there's really no excuse to see that kind of favoritism in a NC game.
It wasn't just "Herbie" in the booth Cheering for Clempson that night. There were some cheerleaders in striped shirts out on the field as well.......
Since this discussion has to do more with what teams have done against Alabama compared to the rest of their games, I looked at their averages in every other game of the season to compare.
From 2013-2016, Alabama has had 12 games where the opponent had 3 or more less penalties than it averaged in every other game. That's 21%.
In that same time span, it's had 7 opponents (12%) be called for 3 or more penalties than it averaged in every other game.
Also, Alabama has won the penalty battle 22 times (39%).
Alabama has had 9 games (16%) of being called for 3 or more penalties than it averaged on the season and 6 games (11%) of being called for 3 or less penalties than it averaged on the season.
From 2013-2016, Alabama has had 12 games where the opponent had 3 or more less penalties than it averaged in every other game. That's 21%.
In that same time span, it's had 7 opponents (12%) be called for 3 or more penalties than it averaged in every other game.
Also, Alabama has won the penalty battle 22 times (39%).
Alabama has had 9 games (16%) of being called for 3 or more penalties than it averaged on the season and 6 games (11%) of being called for 3 or less penalties than it averaged on the season.
You are so right Carl. Per an SEC official, Clemson should have had at least 5 penalties, resulting in 14 less points.Fantastic information, and proves the point, "IMO".
Sure, I agree that all games should be called the same and called fairly. That said, I do understand the human reluctance to heavily penalize clearly outmanned opponents.
But there's really no excuse to see that kind of favoritism in a NC game.
It wasn't just "Herbie" in the booth Cheering for Clempson that night. There were some cheerleaders in striped shirts out on the field as well.......
Bingo.
Suttles point that it "indicates SEC officials call fewer penalties across the board" is "well duh". The problem is that "a penalty is a penalty". If something is clearly a penalty throw the flag. I just want consistency and fundamental fairness. If Levi Wallace's arm draped on a receiver is DPI then the TAMU DB's arm wrapped and holding the jersey of DeVonte Smith early in the game is as well.
And to your point Krazy, only one holding call (which was declined) in the last two games against teams with scrambling QB's. Coaches will tell you it is even more difficult for O-linemen and receivers NOT to hold in those circumstances because the natural instinct is to "grab" or "reach" when the QB starts to scramble. If anything there should have been an increase in holding calls the last two games.
Ohio State payoffs have begun, they have started climbing after the loss, OSU now up to #71
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