Week 12 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

BamaInBham

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Just my personal opinion on what the "Double Secret Committee" appears to be setting up in the latest poll - taking into account that a lot of upsets likely remain. But this is what I see coming, pending upsets, based on my personal opinion of How the whole committee ACTUALLY works, WHY we have a secret Committee in the first place, and what the REAL selection criteria really are, as opposed to the flowery nonsense published as their "Official" mandate.

And for those who may not have heard me discuss it; in my own personal and biased view, the REAL mandate or charter of the "Double Secret Committee" includes the following:
(1) First and Foremost to Maximize TV Revenues for the Six P_ayoff partners (the P-5 Conferences and ND),
(2) As much as possible in light of #1 above, to "Share the Wealth" by giving each partner a chance to place a team in the playoffs as often as can practically be achieved, without "showing your cards", so to speak, AND
(3) Above all else, and At All Costs, PREVENT any repeat of the "Horror" of 2011 when two SEC teams met in the Title game.

Some will disagree. I contend that the results of each of the Three years of P_ayoff selections bears out my theory.

In any event - my prediction as of this week:

First - the Top 4 "Money" slots, in no particular order (Seeding is decided by TV ratings more than by "Merit")
The SEC Champion IF it is 12-1 UGa or 13-0 Alabama
The ACC Champion IF is is 12-1 Clempson or 13-0 Miami
The B1G Champion IF it is 13-0 Wisc'
The B-12 Champion IF it is 12-1 OU.

No real "Drama" so far - that's just straight up how they are lined up, and if we have 4 from that list, there's your 2017/18 bracket. But its likely at least one or two spots might be vacated by Dec. 5 - (for example, if Wisc. loses in the BqG title game). So who comes next? THis is where it gets tricky, as the next NINE spots on the committee poll are occupied by 1 loss UGa and 8 Two loss teams - and there's plenty of time for the committee to change the order - move teams up OR DOWN even if they don't lose. But just going on what we know today - my predictions, IF we still need teams after running through the list above.

The Wild Card - UCF IF they run the table and finish 13-0. I don't see ANY "Group of 5" program even at 13-0 edging out any 12-1 P-5 partner. The Committee can easly put that off on "Strength of Schedule" or some other baloney excuse. But keeping a 13-0 team out and letting a TWO Loss P-5 team in COULD be a potential Anti-Trust problem for the whole P_ayoff scheme. So UCF is this year's "Wild Card". Personally, I see them dropping at least one game, but not before giving everyone at ESPiN a good Scare! LOL!!!

5. aubarn, IF they finish 11-2 and thus win the SEC Title. If aub is SEC champ, both UA and UGa are "out" - or at least further down the list than #5. And yes, I'm saying 11-2 aub gets in BEFORE 11-1 Alabama. The committee gave O$U a "Pass" last year for a mid-season loss to PSU, and the Committee got burned for it. They won't give us the same pass for a week 13 loss, even to the eventual SEC Champ.

6. Alabama if 11-1 AND if both UGa and aub are "out". This is a narrow window, and basically would mean UGa loses to UK or GaTech but wins the SECCG or aub loses to ULM, but then wins the SECC game. In that case, there are NO other "Major" teams with only one loss, and we leapfrog BOTH aub and UGa.

7. Notre Damned IF 11-2. Again, bear in mind we only get here IF we don't have 4 teams from the NINE options above. SO why might an 11-2 ND team leapfrog an Alabama team at 11-1 or 12-1? See Principle #2 above. ND is the ONLY P_ayoff Partner NOT to have appeared in the P_ayoffs so far. That will be enough, AND their losses will be "older" than ours if we lose here at the end.
And besides, its just Hypothetical, because we aren't going to lose to aub Or to UGa, right??? :)

8. B1G Champ IF its 11-2 PSU or 11-2 O$U. The B1G has been in every P_ayoff _racket so far. Even though they are the #1 money conference, they are still going to be standing in line behind 11-2 ND for the reasons stated above.

9. PAC-12 Champ IF its 11-2 USCw or 11-2 Wash. St. Much less TV "Pull" from the PAC compared to the B1G.

Anyway, that's how I see it as of today. Thoughts? :)
It's impossible to "prove" that there is no conspiracy, but where is there any evidence that there is one ? Please give one clear cut example. IMO, the CFPC has done a good or great job. Look at what they've done this year to this point: had undefeated Wisc and Miami behind several one loss teams until they proved a little more; because they play little D, they currently have OU at 4, though many are clamoring for this "flashy" offensive team to be 1 or 2; UCF, who has played almost no one, has been left out in the cold; etc.

There could be a "conspiracy", but I've seen no evidence of it. It could be that the Committee has been fortunate that things have fallen their way to this point. But they've had a couple of tough choices: OSU in 14 & 16. IMO, in both years they made the right, or at least a plausible choice. And in 16 they did not follow the previous conventional wisdom that head-to-head and conf champ would trump all. They made the right choice in taking OSU over PSU.

Those claiming Bama bias, simply have not been paying attention the past 3+ years. It may change later this year but Bama has gotten every benefit of the doubt to this point. If anything, they have been biased in Bama's favor; probably because of CFPC coaches', especially Alvarez's, respect for Bama's style of football and til this year, tough schedule. Until the last couple of days, when I checked the other teams' schedules, I thought Bama had little chance as a one loss team. Since few others have beaten more than Bama's 2 ranked teams, some have only 1 or none, I don't believe Bama's resume is the albatross I once did. IMO, now they still need just a little help, but have a very good chance. Other than AU if they win out - will the Committee choose a 2 loss team, even a conf champion, over a one loss Bama ? Hopefully not, especially with the injuries, 3 of 4 who will return. Also, Bama's strength of record is surprisingly good. Just hope LSU and MSU continue to win and A&M beats OM this week - not necessary but it would grease the skids a bit. They may even get a little bit of credit for "early" FSU. The Committee seems to be impressed with stomping teams you should - Bama has done that.
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Finebaum was talking to a committee member and Paul brought up the Alabama's injuries and the possibility of their losing to Auburn and still getting in. There's no question that this will be in their head, now whether or not it changes anything remains to be seen. I'm not a fan of it being a factor, but they did openly invoke it when explaining Clemson's rank.

And that is absolutely insane, I'm sorry.


So if Clemson gets a "win" against Syracuse because of an injury to a QB, does Clemson also get a LOSS to Auburn, since the Tigers were missing their best running back? Does Auburn get some extra points somewhere because now Pettway is basically out for the year?

What about the six OU injuries against Iowa St? Do the Sooners get credit, too?


This is EXACTLY why this Pandora's box CANNOT ever be opened.


I don't have that good a memory, I'll admit, but I sure as hell seem to recall Ohio State knocking off NUMBER ONE Alabama with a THIRD-STRING quarterback in a playoff game, and I don't think he had any previous career starts, either (I wasn't paying THAT close attention to it).

Iowa St beat OU with a third-string QB who was a converted linebacker.


Am I now supposed to believe that Iowa St is BETTER at recruiting backup QBs than CLEMSON? Are you freaking KIDDING me????


That explanation was utterly asinine.


Let me translate for you: "Certain teams's injuries turn losses into wins but other teams's do not."
 

DzynKingRTR

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

And that is absolutely insane, I'm sorry.


So if Clemson gets a "win" against Syracuse because of an injury to a QB, does Clemson also get a LOSS to Auburn, since the Tigers were missing their best running back? Does Auburn get some extra points somewhere because now Pettway is basically out for the year?

What about the six OU injuries against Iowa St? Do the Sooners get credit, too?


This is EXACTLY why this Pandora's box CANNOT ever be opened.


I don't have that good a memory, I'll admit, but I sure as hell seem to recall Ohio State knocking off NUMBER ONE Alabama with a THIRD-STRING quarterback in a playoff game, and I don't think he had any previous career starts, either (I wasn't paying THAT close attention to it).

Iowa St beat OU with a third-string QB who was a converted linebacker.


Am I now supposed to believe that Iowa St is BETTER at recruiting backup QBs than CLEMSON? Are you freaking KIDDING me????


That explanation was utterly asinine.


Let me translate for you: "Certain teams's injuries turn losses into wins but other teams's do not."
Jones had one start prior to playing us when tOSU blew out Wisky.
 

B1GTide

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

And that is absolutely insane, I'm sorry.


So if Clemson gets a "win" against Syracuse because of an injury to a QB, does Clemson also get a LOSS to Auburn, since the Tigers were missing their best running back? Does Auburn get some extra points somewhere because now Pettway is basically out for the year?

What about the six OU injuries against Iowa St? Do the Sooners get credit, too?


This is EXACTLY why this Pandora's box CANNOT ever be opened.
It already has been - it has been a part of the discussion every year. It doesn't matter whether or not we like it - it is what it is. But no team has ever been given two "mulligans" due to injury, so it really doesn't matter much. You still have to finish the season as a one loss team for the injury mulligan to apply.
 

Jay Hughes

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

First let me say that I firmly believe that Bama is going to win at Auburn!!!

If the following were to happen, do you think that Bama gets in?

Bama loses a hard fought game to Auburn. 10-2

Georgia loses to Georgia Tech which puts them at 10-2

Then Georgia beats Auburn in the SEC Championship game.

Bama 11-1
Auburn 10-3
Georgia 11-2 SEC Champs

Who gets in?
 

AUDub

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

First let me say that I firmly believe that Bama is going to win at Auburn!!!

If the following were to happen, do you think that Bama gets in?

Bama loses a hard fought game to Auburn. 10-2

Georgia loses to Georgia Tech which puts them at 10-2

Then Georgia beats Auburn in the SEC Championship game.

Bama 11-1
Auburn 10-3
Georgia 11-2 SEC Champs

Who gets in?
Man that's a mess.

ETA: Bama, if anyone.
 

selmaborntidefan

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

First let me say that I firmly believe that Bama is going to win at Auburn!!!

If the following were to happen, do you think that Bama gets in?

Bama loses a hard fought game to Auburn. 10-2

Georgia loses to Georgia Tech which puts them at 10-2

Then Georgia beats Auburn in the SEC Championship game.

Bama 11-1
Auburn 10-3
Georgia 11-2 SEC Champs

Who gets in?

Alabama would get in under that circumstance.

And then a month would ensue about how "Alabama always gets the benefit of the doubt" blah blah blah and Saban would tear a new one into whichever two teams we played had the misfortune to play us.
 

rgw

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Nobody should want to play us in a national semis if we get there. Looks like we'll have everyone back and healthy other than Hamilton (God forbid another injury at this juncture).


If we make the semis, I'd would say we would be the clear favorite regardless of the circumstances. We've been playing all season gimped one way or another and a long break would almost reset all that attrition for us but with the benefit of all the depth getting real experience too.
 

CrimsonForce

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

I would put OU at no. 2. They don't play much D but when you have an unstoppable O(to this point anyway and I think that's how Herbie sees it) like they do then I'm not sure it really makes any difference.
But their offense isn't unstoppable. They got beat by Iowa State. I remember hearing the exact same thing about the Oklahoma offense led by Baker Mayfield in 2016 and they got blasted by Clemson in the playoffs. Something like 35-14 IIRC..
 

RTR91

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Something to consider when discussing all the things that could happen with the playoff - rematches.

Does the committee want to have a rematch from the regular season? If not, they will have a hard time putting 11-2 Auburn in as well as 12-1 Clemson and possibly 11-1 Alabama.

Then again, there's no way they put 10-2 Ohio State and 12-1 Oklahoma in the playoffs together, right?
 

selmaborntidefan

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Something to consider when discussing all the things that could happen with the playoff - rematches.

Does the committee want to have a rematch from the regular season? If not, they will have a hard time putting 11-2 Auburn in as well as 12-1 Clemson and possibly 11-1 Alabama.

Then again, there's no way they put 10-2 Ohio State and 12-1 Oklahoma in the playoffs together, right?

Our good man krazy3 was screaming this way back in 2011.

Increase the number of teams in a tournament and you automatically increase the possibility of a rematch.


One of these years, they're going to wind up with all four teams having played round robin in the same season and watch the ratings tank.
 

RT27

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Bama needs to make this easy for the committee. Win out and let them worry about other teams and conferences. We win out AU and UGA go to a bowl not playoff. Then let the others sort themselves out. Time for NICK to be nice to CFP guys and gals, make one team a no brainer, BAMA.
 

RTR91

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Our good man krazy3 was screaming this way back in 2011.

Increase the number of teams in a tournament and you automatically increase the possibility of a rematch.


One of these years, they're going to wind up with all four teams having played round robin in the same season and watch the ratings tank.
Especially when P5 teams start playing each other more because SOS is a factor.
 

selmaborntidefan

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

I would put OU at no. 2. They don't play much D but when you have an unstoppable O(to this point anyway and I think that's how Herbie sees it) like they do then I'm not sure it really makes any difference.

I know that's the perception but tell me...WHERE have we heard this one before?

Remember when OU was running up 60 points a game in both 2003 and 2008?
Remember how in 2003 they were "the greatest team of all-time" before they even won the Big 12, which they didn't?


Besides......let's look at little bit closer at the scoring defenses they've played with overall ranking.....(I didn't do the subtraction thing, just eyesight fwiw)


8. TCU (16.3 ppg, OU got 38)
25. Ohio St (20.4, OU got 31)
32. Texas (21.9, 29)
32. Iowa St (21.9, 31)
54. Kansas St (25.1, 42)
81. Tulane (29.2, 56)
88. OK St (29.9, 62)
106. Texas Tech (33.1, 49)
115. Baylor (36.3, 49)
116. UTEP (37.1, 56)

And this weekend they have 127th ranked defense Kansas......


Folks, they've run up eye-popping numbers against lousy defenses, and the Sooners D themselves is ranked 70th in defense.

Kansas St.....who got 7 points on Vandy and 35 on Oklahoma......

The same Vandy that Alabama massacred.....


Ohio St??? Iowa put more points on the Buckeyes than OU did....



OU is ranked fourth in total offense with 44.3 ppg while we're eighth with 39.9.


We played defenses ranked:
15 - Fresno
18 - MSU
20 - LSU
51 - FSU
71 - ATM (which is basically the same as OU in a tougher conference in which to score)
73 - Vols
79 - Colorado St
91 - Vandy
111 - Ole Miss
112 - Arky


they've played FIVE lower than 80th, we've played three.



Nobody calls us an offensive juggernaut because we play tougher defenses.
 

UntouchableCrew

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

Something to consider when discussing all the things that could happen with the playoff - rematches.

Does the committee want to have a rematch from the regular season? If not, they will have a hard time putting 11-2 Auburn in as well as 12-1 Clemson and possibly 11-1 Alabama.

Then again, there's no way they put 10-2 Ohio State and 12-1 Oklahoma in the playoffs together, right?
I think we could see remathces. I was always confident we wouldn't see Alabama/Georgia rematch in the playoffs (having JUST played in the SEC Title game) but I could see Ohio State/OU or AU/Clemson.
 

UntouchableCrew

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Selma, maybe I'm missing something but the discrepancy in the defenses you listed seems pretty comparable, to be honest. Not that I deny your underlying thesis but I don't know if these defensive rankings really tell that story.

UA OppOU Opp
158
1825
2032
5132
7154
7381
7988
91106
111115
112116
 

selmaborntidefan

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Selma, maybe I'm missing something but the discrepancy in the defenses you listed seems pretty comparable, to be honest. Not that I deny your underlying thesis but I don't know if these defensive rankings really tell that story.

UA OppOU Opp
158
1825
2032
5132
7154
7381
7988
91106
111115
112116

A couple of points here.


Statistics are - once again - a WINDOW. They're not infallible. Just because Team A played a tougher schedule than Team B does not necessarily mean Team A will win when they meet.

We're hearing about what an "unstoppable offense" Oklahoma has. They basically score five points more per game than we do. But we'd have to delve further.

But Okie State's offense is actually a full point plus per game BETTER than Oklahoma is.

Why aren't we hearing about how awesome Okie State's offense is?

TCU gave up 31 points to Okie St.....but that's actually 14 points BELOW their season average. They gave up 38 to OU, too, but that's still 7 below.

That's the best defense OU has played.



OU is getting a truckload of credit for two things: 1) they beat Ohio State in Columbus (but uh they didn't beat them as badly as Iowa did); 2) they score a bunch of points....but in part because they HAVE to.

Baylor is NOT the Baylor of past years (they've only beaten Kansas)....but they still pumped in 41 points against OU.


Please understand I'm NOT arguing that OU is undeserving of a playoff spot if it plays out. But.......I'm saying they're getting a bunch of hype based on the fact that eye-popping offensive stats get attention.

The fact the Big 12 defenses aren't all that good is ignored.
 

UntouchableCrew

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Like I said I don't disagree with the underlying thesis that they've played some soft Big XII defenses, but I do think their offense (and Mayfield) are legit. I think they're one of the few potential playoff teams that could score against us. I also think our offense would run the ball down their throats so it wouldn't matter, but still.
 

selmaborntidefan

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Like I said I don't disagree with the underlying thesis that they've played some soft Big XII defenses, but I do think their offense (and Mayfield) are legit. I think they're one of the few potential playoff teams that could score against us. I also think our offense would run the ball down their throats so it wouldn't matter, but still.
They would score early.


Then - unlike Big 12 defenses - we'd adjust and Baker Mayfield would probably leave the game after actually getting hit (a la Colt McCoy).
 

TomFromBama

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Re: Week 11 College Football Playoff rankings. Alabama in familiar spot at number 1!

The BCS would have put the same teams in, and it had no hidden agenda. Just sayin'. :cool:
Respectfully, the BCS would have put the same top 2 or 3 in the bracket every year, and the same top 4 in 2015. But there's no way to say with any certainty who would have been #4 in either 2014 or 2016, for the reasons I stated above - including: the fact that the Harris poll no longer exists, and due to the very real distortion we've seen ever since 2014 in both the AP and the Coaches poll as the voters tend to bring their votes into alignment with the Committee poll as each season has reached its final 2-3 weeks.

Thus, Any BCS Simulation you could run today (or any season starting with 2014) would be skewed by (A) having to use AP rather than the Harris Poll, and (B) above referenced distortion of the "legit" polls.

As for the "Double Secret Committee", common sense tells us there's only ONE reason any organization changes from a relatively transparent system to a relatively Non-Transparent system - and that's true in ANY Human endeavor. Lack of transparency is a problem and raises ethical concerns ANY time human beings (and money) are involved - That's why every State in the USA has "Sunshine Laws" to reduce secret government actions, and "Public Service Commissions" to (in theory) monitor Utility companies, and why the US Securities and Exchange Commission (the Other SEC) has so many reporting requirements for Publicly traded corporations.

You reduce transparency because you don't want the public to see what you are doing. Period. The agenda here is hardly "hidden" - its right out in the open, and that agenda is to pick the teams without the public being privy to HOW they are picked.
 

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