11-1 and we need a new QB and OC

B1GTide said:

Thanks - you should read the thread (and a few others). Most of the posts were pretty thoughtful. Not a lot of "fire Daboll" or "bring on Tua" talk. Mostly just talking about how Alabama can improve.

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I think sometimes fans forget that offensive coordinators call plays for a reason.
For example if you have to keep the tight end in pass protection because your right tackle is getting beat then he can't be in the pass pattern.
The offensive coordinator understands that, the tight end understands that, the head coach understands it...but OHH the arm chair quarterback...."Why in the heck are we not throwing the dang ball to the tight end!!!!???...what an idiot our offensive coordinator is!!!"
And that's the simple truth.
I agree that there's many good points, by great fans, on how the team can improve, but again, our coaches call what they call for a reason.

Bluf: need better OL and QB coaching. Daboll is not a QB coach. He's a TE coach.

Rewatch the game. Now when RBs drive you down and score you stick with it until they stop it, but that was not the game plan because teams have thrown on Allbarn. And I see why they have thrown on them. WR and TE were open all game long. The OL has struggled and need better coaching IMO, but Jalen had the necessary 2-4,seconds to pass if he stays in pocket or steps up. But he gets happy feet and looks to run to soon. He looks down after first option as this is fact stated by 2 Opponent DC. Run the RBs more than Jalen period because Jalen does not and will not see the field as it's first option drop eyes to see running lane. I like Jalen but he either isn't being coached up or he can't force himself to stay in pocket to get the job done. Hell take a sack so what, it's better than running out of bounds 7 yards behind LOS ......

If you are going to just have a QB run then just run the option or something. There is an issue with 3rd down and it's not really all the OC because the plays are there to be made. But to stop or never start using your trio of talented backs.... That's on the OC because your QB can not get the job done in the air on 3rd down and everyone in the stadium knows it but the Bama staff.

Decent defenses will continue to do this to Bama as long as Jalen can't/won't pass on time or read the field and improve his accuracy.

Alasippi said:

I think sometimes fans forget that offensive coordinators call plays for a reason.
For example if you have to keep the tight end in pass protection because your right tackle is getting beat then he can't be in the pass pattern.
The offensive coordinator understands that, the tight end understands that, the head coach understands it...but OHH the arm chair quarterback...."Why in the heck are we not throwing the dang ball to the tight end!!!!???...what an idiot our offensive coordinator is!!!"
And that's the simple truth.
I agree that there's many good points, by great fans, on how the team can improve, but again, our coaches call what they call for a reason.

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Just a blind question - do you believe that Alabama had an aggressive offensive game plan yesterday, or a passive (safe) one?

B1GTide said:

Just a blind question - do you believe that Alabama had an aggressive offensive game plan yesterday, or a passive (safe) one?

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I think we started aggressive and when it didn't work we had to make adjustments as the game went along.
Auburn meanwhile was constantly making defensive adjustments to keep us confused and a little off balance.
I personally love it when we just come out and do the quick hand offs. It seems to me that works better than anything we do, but at the same time, I have to think there's a reason we get away from it. Otherwise I think Coach Saban would step in and say "RUN THE BALL"...
It's not as simple as many think.

Alasippi said:

I think we started aggressive and when it didn't work we had to make adjustments as the game went along.
Auburn meanwhile was constantly making defensive adjustments to keep us confused and a little off balance.
I personally love it when we just come out and do the quick hand offs. It seems to me that works better than anything we do, but at the same time, I have to think there's a reason we get away from it. Otherwise I think Coach Saban would step in and say "RUN THE BALL"...
It's not as simple as many think.

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The jet sweeps early in the first drive worked, as did the off-tackle runs in the first drive of the second half. But those are the only 2 drives in the game that saw Alabama attack the perimeter of their defense. If you watched the LSU game, you saw that this is the weakness in their defense - perimeter runs. It's like Saban and Daboll did their homework, threw in a few plays on those 2 possessions, but just decided to run safe plays the rest of the game. Safe plays that meant challenging the strength of the Auburn defense.

It didn't work. It is fair to criticize things like that. We do not have to know why each individual play failed - all we have to know is that you had better alternatives, were aware of them, and ignored them.

You want to give Saban and Daboll a pass because we do not know exactly where each play broke down? Fine. But at least understand that many of those plays should never have been called in the first place. You take what the defense gives you. You do not attempt to "impose your will" on a team prepared and capable of stopping you.

B1GTide said:

Just a blind question - do you believe that Alabama had an aggressive offensive game plan yesterday, or a passive (safe) one?

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Punted on 4th and inches to start the game. There’s your answer. Saban just can’t beat good Auburn teams for some reason. He is too conservative in big games IMO.

gman4tide said:

When we did ground n pound yesterday, we were successful? We just kept going away from it, for some reason?

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Alasippi said:

I think sometimes fans forget that offensive coordinators call plays for a reason.
For example if you have to keep the tight end in pass protection because your right tackle is getting beat then he can't be in the pass pattern.
The offensive coordinator understands that, the tight end understands that, the head coach understands it...but OHH the arm chair quarterback...."Why in the heck are we not throwing the dang ball to the tight end!!!!???...what an idiot our offensive coordinator is!!!"
And that's the simple truth.
I agree that there's many good points, by great fans, on how the team can improve, but again, our coaches call what they call for a reason.

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How do you slow pass rushes down? Something every OC should know. Its not long pass plays.

colbysullivan said:

Punted on 4th and inches to start the game. There’s your answer. Saban just can’t beat good Auburn teams for some reason. He is too conservative in big games IMO.

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I wondered about that also. We have gone for it in other games with 4th and inches, why not v Auburn? Jumbo package with Bo would surely work. I have said it in another post, but I just think there were a lot of strange things that happened in this game that had never happened this year (or at least I don't remember it) :
2 bad snaps in a row from the Center
Bad field goal attempt with the holder/kicker resulting in bobbled ball
Not going for it with 4th and inches
Damien off sides on the punt, giving them another 1st down
Jalen only had one turnover this year and got his 2nd one in the game that mattered most

That's not counting the usual penalties the refs don't call on Auburn or whoever our opponent is.
We did have one of our worst games for penalty yards this year I think.

I truly believe if the game was played at our field, most of these mental errors would not have happened. It would have helped a lot with the momentum to at least give us a better chance to win. I was hoping that last throw by Jalen would have been a touchdown just to make the score look more respectable for the committee and for stats, but it was not meant to be. We missed it be a few yards.

Tideflyer said:

Agree with this. You win or lose at the LOS on both sides of the ball. Our O line and D line play this year have been far from dominant, IMO.

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With what we lost to the NFL you could see this coming with D line. The real head scratcher for me is the inconsistent O line play we've had over the past several seasons. We've had some big misses in recruiting on the D line the past few cycles to go along with the talent we lost last season. But we've generally recruited well on the O line usually getting one to two 5 star linemen each cycle plus really good 4 stars to go with them. The struggles on the O line are at times maddening.

B1GTide said:

The jet sweeps early in the first drive worked, as did the off-tackle runs in the first drive of the second half. But those are the only 2 drives in the game that saw Alabama attack the perimeter of their defense. If you watched the LSU game, you saw that this is the weakness in their defense - perimeter runs. It's like Saban and Daboll did their homework, threw in a few plays on those 2 possessions, but just decided to run safe plays the rest of the game. Safe plays that meant challenging the strength of the Auburn defense.

It didn't work. It is fair to criticize things like that. We do not have to know why each individual play failed - all we have to know is that you had better alternatives, were aware of them, and ignored them.

You want to give Saban and Daboll a pass because we do not know exactly where each play broke down? Fine. But at least understand that many of those plays should never have been called in the first place. You take what the defense gives you. You do not attempt to "impose your will" on a team prepared and capable of stopping you.

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So let me ask you one. Did Urban and his offensive and defensive coordinators absolutely blow the game against Iowa with bad coaching or did your team just get whipped on a particular night?

CrimsonEyeshade said:

rgw said:

I do think we need to inspect the offensive staff though. This wasn't one game. This was a season's worth of data points. When we played any team that had some players on defense or a competent scheme in place, we struggled to stay on the field on third down and our point totals significantly declined. It culminated in an absolutely embarrassing performance against the best defense we've played this season. We ain't paying tens of millions of dollars for staff to score 14 points against our biggest rivals in the most important game of the season. Pure and simple. I will not accept that and you're being a weak-minded human being if you do.

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Even given your credibility on this board, RGW, this is a sentiment I don't understand. When we lose a game, especially to Auburn, it's as if our disappointment clouds everything we learned by playing and watching competitive sports. Sometimes you lose. Sometimes, it's because the other team is better. Sometime it's because you don't play your best.

We aren't guaranteed anything for our money or for the privilege of being fans. Nor should be we assessing what this team and this coaching staff has accomplished for our university on a game-by-game basis. How about a little context from the past decade, much less an 11-1 season? We played badly in our rivalry game. That stings like hell. But after a decade, do you think Nick Saban really needs any prodding from us on the task of improving his players?

If you do, sorry, but that's weak-minded, too.

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I don't even really like that I went to the money there either in retrospect. The point is that they're high-profile and expected to put our team in the best position to win. I truly believe yesterday was the worst coaching job at Alabama since Shula or Franchione. Our kids were not put in a position to win on offense. Maybe if we had the 2015 or 2016 defense then we could've slummed it on offense to a tough win in Jordan-Hare. We didn't. This offense needed to come to score points and they only scored 14. It was a pathetic performance and I'm not carrying water for anyone who lay turds in games with that much at stake. I'm not arguing for torches and pitchforks at the AD. I'm just arguing that we shouldn't sunshine pump this performance and instead call it for what it was. We performed so poorly I don't even think we deserve playoff consideration despite being clearly one of the four best rosters in college football. We looked like a borderline top-25 team when we have 3 or 4 top recruiting classes on campus.

rgw said:

I don't even really like that I went to the money there either in retrospect. The point is that they're high-profile and expected to put our team in the best position to win. I truly believe yesterday was the worst coaching job at Alabama since Shula or Franchione. Our kids were not put in a position to win on offense. Maybe if we had the 2015 or 2016 defense then we could've slummed it on offense to a tough win in Jordan-Hare. We didn't. This offense needed to come to score points and they only scored 14. It was a pathetic performance and I'm not carrying water for anyone who lay turds in games with that much at stake. I'm not arguing for torches and pitchforks at the AD. I'm just arguing that we shouldn't sunshine pump this performance and instead call it for what it was. We performed so poorly I don't even think we deserve playoff consideration despite being clearly one of the four best rosters in college football. We looked like a borderline top-25 team when we have 3 or 4 top recruiting classes on campus.

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RGW are you a mod?

The terms of evaluation are just different for Alabama under Saban because

1. The only goal is a national title (with some sub-task goals underneath that such as win the West then SEC)

2. We sign one of the best classes in recruiting each year (and often the best)


For Alabama, Ohio State, etc the only goal is the championship.

We are significantly more talented than any team outside of the other "up" blue bloods of the day. Auburn has players but we are more talented top to bottom. Injuries affected defensive performance and turned this matchup into one where we needed to probably break 30 to have a chance. We got 14 points with 3 future NFL tailbacks that participated (2 more behind them that didn't), a lock to be 1st round pick at WR, a solid run blocking OL group, and a quarterback who can throw it and run it pretty well.


We give Gus Malzahn our offense, how many points do you think they'd score? That is basically his dream talent mix.

Alasippi said:

So let me ask you one. Did Urban and his offensive and defensive coordinators absolutely blow the game against Iowa with bad coaching or did your team just get whipped on a particular night?

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I have watched that one twice - we just didn't show up. Sadly, Meyer teams do this once every year. They just don't show up.

B1GTide said:

I have watched that one twice - we just didn't show up. Sadly, Meyer teams do this once every year. They just don't show up.

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My point exactly...No matter who's coaching 18-22 year olds....it happens, and there's absolutely nothing a coach can do about it. You just do the best you can!I hope your Thanksgiving Holiday was good and I can't wait for Monday(Blue font on the last five words)

Bamabuzzard said:

Part of being a good OC/playcaller is being one step ahead or in this case one play ahead of your opponent. You go left when they think you're going right. Kind of like what Auburn's OC did to our DC. I'm afraid our staff may have gotten so use to simply "out talenting" other teams that they may have gotten a bit rusty on how to out scheme a defense when we're not able to simply line up and run over them.

Any time in Saturday's game when it looked like our defense was getting a bead on their offense their OC was able to shift gears and get our DC back off balance. May I ask why our OC wasn't able to do this, seeing that it's been acknowledged throughout many threads that from top to bottom we had the superior talent?

I completely understand there are games in which it's just not your night. But those games dang sure as heck don't need to be when all the marbles are at stake. In games like this and of this magnitude "it just wasn't our night" doesn't fly. Not from a coaching perspective. Sorry. The staff simply laid an egg in the biggest game of the year.

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If we both traded blows the whole game, I could guy that - maybe. But not after yesterday's debacle.