Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down - Page 4
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  1. #40
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 92tide's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by dvldog View Post
    You’re right. You know nothing. See we agree on something.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    cute.
    The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.

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  2. #41

    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    I'll just leave this here - Memphis is ~2/3 black. I'm not in a position to fully understand what these statues might make them feel like, so when my black friends tell me they'd rather not have to see these states glorifying the Confederacy, all I can do is say 'okay, then let's remove them'.
    Oderint dum metuant - Lucius Accius

  3. #42
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by 92tide View Post
    you should move to memphis and run for office.
    Nah,

    Memphis has the highest murder rate theyíve had in decades.

    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-sta...est-in-decades

    But yeah, statues that stay in one spot are a problem that should be addressed immediately.

    I say again - take them down, leave them up, I donít care - but this is yet another example of a problem that isnít worth the effort.

    And itís not just Memphis. This is a microcosm of the utter nonsense of humanity. I put this in the same category as people obsessed with school prayer.

    ďLetís address symbols not problems and get re-elected.Ē

  4. #43

    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    “Let’s address symbols not problems and get re-elected.”
    LOL, so you think the mayor and CC are capable of addressing only one thing at a time?

    Never mind, you've made your mind up, don't live here, and have no idea what's actually happening here, so there's not point in debating it with you.

    Memphis will be fine, no need to worry yourself over it.
    Oderint dum metuant - Lucius Accius

  5. #44
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 92tide's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    Nah,

    Memphis has the highest murder rate they’ve had in decades.

    https://www.usnews.com/news/best-sta...est-in-decades

    But yeah, statues that stay in one spot are a problem that should be addressed immediately.

    I say again - take them down, leave them up, I don’t care - but this is yet another example of a problem that isn’t worth the effort.

    And it’s not just Memphis. This is a microcosm of the utter nonsense of humanity. I put this in the same category as people obsessed with school prayer.

    “Let’s address symbols not problems and get re-elected.”
    well, the number of posts you've made about how you don't care about the issue sort of suggests you do. and as was mentioned above, it is a pretty big deal to a lot of folks regardless of whether you think so or not.
    The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.

    - George Orwell

    If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they donít have to worry about the answers.

    ó Thomas Pynchon

  6. #45
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by crimsonaudio View Post
    LOL, so you think the mayor and CC are capable of addressing only one thing at a time?

    Never mind, you've made your mind up, don't live here, and have no idea what's actually happening here, so there's not point in debating it with you.

    Memphis will be fine, no need to worry yourself over it.

    Youíre correct, I donít live there.

    I think they should do what they want, up or down. To get back to the OP, Iím not going to boycott Memphis one way or the other. And Iíll leave this at that.

  7. #46
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by 92tide View Post
    well, the number of posts you've made about how you don't care about the issue sort of suggests you do. and as was mentioned above, it is a pretty big deal to a lot of folks regardless of whether you think so or not.
    Itís been made into a big deal but hey Iím out. Go to Memphis, donít, let them do what they want.

  8. #47
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    It’s been made into a big deal but hey I’m out. Go to Memphis, don’t, let them do what they want.
    I think it is a big deal to a few folks and a little to no deal to most folks.

    A statue of Jefferson Davis was removed from another Memphis location at the same time as the Forrest statue. There is a difference between the two in that the Forrest statue was part of a grave site and Forrest is from the area.

  9. #48
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Tidewater's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by crimsonaudio View Post
    I'll just leave this here - Memphis is ~2/3 black.
    This policy is what you get when you have white flight from urban settings.
    I'm not in a position to fully understand what these statues might make them feel like, so when my black friends tell me they'd rather not have to see these states glorifying the Confederacy, all I can do is say 'okay, then let's remove them'.
    If somebody were to complain about an MLK monument calling it "a monument to plagiarism and womanizing," I'm sure most folks would view that person as being malicious or obtuse or both. Even if true, that is not why we erected monuments to his memory. We wish to remember his virtues.
    I have examined hundreds of these statues and read scores of the speeches given at their dedication and I have never seen one that its proponents say is a monument to racism or slavery. Not one. Those who say they are monuments to racism and slavery are simply up to something. Left-wingers from 1850s to today have been keen to talk about slavery and nothing but slavery because it provides cover for a multitude of their sins. Well, there is another side to that story.
    Tennesseans fought because their state asked them to. Tennessee asked them to fight because the voters of Tennessee voted 102,172 to 47,328 (68% in favor) to leave the Union. The people of Tennessee, like those of Virginia, declined to secede earlier, but, when the president demanded they take part in an unconstitutional and antidemocratic act, they declined. In other words, the cause of the Tennessee was the cause of self-government.
    Why? Some northerners (e.g. John Brown) had murdered southerners, including southerners who did not own any slaves, for example Tennessean James Doyle and his sons, whom Brown hacked to death with cutlasses (e.g. Potawatomie). Many northerners later gave money to him to carry on his “Kansas Work.” Republican officeholders, including the senior senator from Massachusetts and the Republican front-runner for president, knew about Brown’s next attack a year and a half beforehand and told nobody. Republican governors used their offices to protect escaped terrorists. And then a majority of northerners elected a Republican to the office of president. Why would any southerner, slaveholder or not, male or female, white or black want to live in a Union with people so filled with blind, indiscriminate hate?
    Then the president announced a policy so directly opposed to democratic self-government and so contrary to the principles of the Constitution that the majority of Tennesseans refused to take part and refused to remain in a Union led by such men. The people of Tennessee decided democratically to leave the Union and asked Tennesseans to protect the state. These monuments are dedicated to the memories of those who answered that call.
    I guess that is what I would tell them. If we do not come to some reasonable accommodation, then despicable acts of vandalism like this attack on a statue in a Georgia cemetery will continue. Is a statue in a cemetery not allowed either? Or maybe a spirit of tolerance and forbearance is called for.

  10. #49
    BamaNation All-American gtowntide's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by Tidewater View Post
    This policy is what you get when you have white flight from urban settings.

    If somebody were to complain about an MLK monument calling it "a monument to plagiarism and womanizing," I'm sure most folks would view that person as being malicious or obtuse or both. Even if true, that is not why we erected monuments to his memory. We wish to remember his virtues.
    I have examined hundreds of these statues and read scores of the speeches given at their dedication and I have never seen one that its proponents say is a monument to racism or slavery. Not one. Those who say they are monuments to racism and slavery are simply up to something. Left-wingers from 1850s to today have been keen to talk about slavery and nothing but slavery because it provides cover for a multitude of their sins. Well, there is another side to that story.
    Tennesseans fought because their state asked them to. Tennessee asked them to fight because the voters of Tennessee voted 102,172 to 47,328 (68% in favor) to leave the Union. The people of Tennessee, like those of Virginia, declined to secede earlier, but, when the president demanded they take part in an unconstitutional and antidemocratic act, they declined. In other words, the cause of the Tennessee was the cause of self-government.
    Why? Some northerners (e.g. John Brown) had murdered southerners, including southerners who did not own any slaves, for example Tennessean James Doyle and his sons, whom Brown hacked to death with cutlasses (e.g. Potawatomie). Many northerners later gave money to him to carry on his ďKansas Work.Ē Republican officeholders, including the senior senator from Massachusetts and the Republican front-runner for president, knew about Brownís next attack a year and a half beforehand and told nobody. Republican governors used their offices to protect escaped terrorists. And then a majority of northerners elected a Republican to the office of president. Why would any southerner, slaveholder or not, male or female, white or black want to live in a Union with people so filled with blind, indiscriminate hate?
    Then the president announced a policy so directly opposed to democratic self-government and so contrary to the principles of the Constitution that the majority of Tennesseans refused to take part and refused to remain in a Union led by such men. The people of Tennessee decided democratically to leave the Union and asked Tennesseans to protect the state. These monuments are dedicated to the memories of those who answered that call.
    I guess that is what I would tell them. If we do not come to some reasonable accommodation, then despicable acts of vandalism like this attack on a statue in a Georgia cemetery will continue. Is a statue in a cemetery not allowed either? Or maybe a spirit of tolerance and forbearance is called for.
    I guess the MLK monuments never bothered me because he stood for peace and the brotherhood of all men and women regardless of their race. His private life shouldn't stain his accomplishments for an entire race of people in our country.
    These confederate monuments are of men who supported slavery of a race of people who are still feeling its effects. This doesn't mean all people that fought for the south were supporters of slavery in any way. What I don't understand is why so many people want to memorialize men who supported slavery. It was wrong then and it's wrong now.

  11. #50
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Go Bama's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    When I was in dental school I used to walk past the Forrest statue every day. If I knew then that he was buried there then I have forgotten it. Forrest park is one city block. My dorm was across the street from the NW corner of the park and the dental school was/is across the street from the SE corner. We students learned to ignore the daily requests for money from the winos who infested the park. It was in no way a nice place.

    I think most people’s impression of Forrest is that of a slave trader, ruthless yet effective general, and member of the KKK. I had no idea he had ever changed his mind on racism, but even so, if I’m an African-American living in Memphis I wouldn’t care to see a statue of a former slave trader or KKK member regardless of how contrite he was.

  12. #51
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Go Bama's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    This is off topic but is somewhat related.

    I have a friend, Jerry Flippin, a lawyer who just turned 90. We go to church together and he is a patient of mine. Mr Flippin is one of the most unique characters I’ve ever known and he has a plethora of stories.

    His grandparents lived in Milan during the Civil War. His grandfather was captured by the Yankees at Shiloh, but he was able to escape so he came home to Milan to check on his family. They had substantial land and a large house. After a few days of being home, the grandfather left to go join General Forrest’s regiment leaving his wife and two children at home.

    Shortly thereafter, a troop of Union soldiers came through Milan. They were instructed to get supplies so they took all of Mr Flippin’s grandmother’s food, livestock, clothes, blankets, everything. Before they left the Union captain rode up to the grandmother who at the time was a young woman holding her two young children, one of which would have been Mr Flippin’s mother or father, I don’t know which. The Captain asked her where her husband was. Distraught she told him he was with Forrest. The Captain then noticed she was wearing a Free Mason pendant on a necklace and he wanted to know if her husband was a Free Mason. The grandmother replied that indeed her husband was a Free Mason. The Captain then instructed his men to put everything back because evidently he was a Free Mason, too.

    Mr Flippin broke down in tears as he was relating this story to me so I took it for the truth. I’ve related it the best I can recall.
    Last edited by Go Bama; December 25th, 2017 at 06:14 AM.

  13. #52
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 92tide's Avatar
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    Re: Avoid Memphis - Confederate statues coming down

    Quote Originally Posted by Tidewater View Post
    I have examined hundreds of these statues and read scores of the speeches given at their dedication and I have never seen one that its proponents say is a monument to racism or slavery. Not one
    that is because the whole point of the lost cause narrative is to try to glorify the confederacy and pretend it had nothing to do with slavery and racism. a lot of folks have fallen for it.
    The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.

    - George Orwell

    If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they donít have to worry about the answers.

    ó Thomas Pynchon

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