Kevin Hagan on Bill King's Show (January 10)
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Also, for those that listen to the OD in the mornings, Phil Savage is always on Wed. mornings. The Wed. before the Clemson game they asked him if he thought they would play Tua. He said "without a doubt." UGA only had mop up duty film to watch. This may have been the coaching move of all time not playing him at Clemson because we had the game under control. I was kind of shocked Phil even said anything when he did. Of course, we can all speculate lol.
1: This might be a little controversial, but when discussing the situation at quarterback I'd have to use plural when assigning blame. That the problem wasn't just a player, but players. When you use words like "revolt", it is an issue. I'm ok with how things played out in the end, but that was Saban's choice to make. Players can't possibly grasp the implications like Saban can. Even if they were right this time, what if they're wrong the next time? You can have an opinion without being insubordinate, if anyone should learn the difference it would be me.
2: "It's not about what Hurts can't do as much as what Tua can do"
I'd tend to agree with that. Tua can run Daboll's offense well. I wasn't a big fan of Daboll's offense, I'm still not sure I am, but that sort of stuff plays into what Tua can do. Hurts is better for a different style offense, I still think he can win a lot of games at QB, and the guy managed 2,780 yards passing as a true freshman. He either needs more time to develop or a different style offense.
3: Not a fan of Smart
With the way the transfer stuff played out, I was already done with Smart. The recruiting board thing just solidified that. There's a right way to do things and a wrong way. Smart did it the wrong way and I wonder how long he can get by on that sort of behavior.
2: "It's not about what Hurts can't do as much as what Tua can do"
I'd tend to agree with that. Tua can run Daboll's offense well. I wasn't a big fan of Daboll's offense, I'm still not sure I am, but that sort of stuff plays into what Tua can do. Hurts is better for a different style offense, I still think he can win a lot of games at QB, and the guy managed 2,780 yards passing as a true freshman. He either needs more time to develop or a different style offense.
3: Not a fan of Smart
With the way the transfer stuff played out, I was already done with Smart. The recruiting board thing just solidified that. There's a right way to do things and a wrong way. Smart did it the wrong way and I wonder how long he can get by on that sort of behavior.
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It's probably a little unfair to say since we weren't in the locker room. It's not like the dissent started in fall camp. I think Hagan mentioned it was after the A&M game when this first started to become obvious and he mentioned it started with the staff.
Not gonna lie that it was not good hearing about that stuff going on, but CNS has publicly stated one of his measuring tools for deciding a starting qb is who wins the team. Apparently and simultaneously, Jalen was losing them as the year went on and Tua was winning them.
I also think it's good that this had nothing to do with anything other than who could distribute the ball better. I really don't think it was a personality thing or racial thing (obviously)...it was just about football.
No one is suggesting we throw raw guys out there who aren't ready to play, that's not what Hagan was talking about. It's not news to anyone wh knows the program that once someone is a trusted starter under Saban, he's very rarely unseated - even if a more talented guy (who also understands the playbook and techniques) is waiting in the wings. There are plenty of examples that we've seen over the years where a starter goes down and the next man up comes along and plays as well, if not better, than the starter did.
Saban's hierarchy of trust isn't why we've won four national titles. But if he can move outside of his comfort zone it will almost certainly guarantee we win a few more before he decides he's done.
I enjoyed that listen, thanks for the link.
I will disagree about the watershed decision moment for Nick Saban. I honestly think it came when Lane Kiffin arrived. Before Lane Kiffin, Saban's philosophy was kind of like a reverse Spurrier in that he just didn't want the other side of the ball to screw up his chances of winning. Alabama played ball control, took time off the clock, established the dominance of the offensive line, and tried to get 17 points on the board to win the game. Then this gimmick offense plague started and people enjoyed seeing all these points and people running all over the field and Saban was faced with a decision: stay the same or adapt. Then the Lane train arrived. Now Alabama has an offensive coordinator who's flashy, arrogant, dangerous, and brings an offense to match. Suddenly we have jet sweeps, we're throwing deep far more frequently than before, and passing and scoring records are falling by the wayside in droves. Let's not forget guys like Blake Sims and Jalen Hurts at quarterback: not just mobile, but very dangerous runners with the ball in their hands, a definite deviation from the Saban quarterback in previous years. This decision couldn't have been easy for him, much like Spurrier finally conceding that he needed more focus on the defensive side of the ball and hiring Bob Stoops to do just that.
So, while pulling Hurts for Tua was a very gutsy move and deserving of all the praise it is getting, I really think shifting offensive philosophies and becoming more dynamic was truly Saban's watershed decision of his latter coaching career. We have two National Titles to show for it already.
I will disagree about the watershed decision moment for Nick Saban. I honestly think it came when Lane Kiffin arrived. Before Lane Kiffin, Saban's philosophy was kind of like a reverse Spurrier in that he just didn't want the other side of the ball to screw up his chances of winning. Alabama played ball control, took time off the clock, established the dominance of the offensive line, and tried to get 17 points on the board to win the game. Then this gimmick offense plague started and people enjoyed seeing all these points and people running all over the field and Saban was faced with a decision: stay the same or adapt. Then the Lane train arrived. Now Alabama has an offensive coordinator who's flashy, arrogant, dangerous, and brings an offense to match. Suddenly we have jet sweeps, we're throwing deep far more frequently than before, and passing and scoring records are falling by the wayside in droves. Let's not forget guys like Blake Sims and Jalen Hurts at quarterback: not just mobile, but very dangerous runners with the ball in their hands, a definite deviation from the Saban quarterback in previous years. This decision couldn't have been easy for him, much like Spurrier finally conceding that he needed more focus on the defensive side of the ball and hiring Bob Stoops to do just that.
So, while pulling Hurts for Tua was a very gutsy move and deserving of all the praise it is getting, I really think shifting offensive philosophies and becoming more dynamic was truly Saban's watershed decision of his latter coaching career. We have two National Titles to show for it already.
Thanks...very interesting to say the least. TBH the departure of so many coaches over the last 2 years has been disconcerting and affected recruiting. Glad to see some movement here...
I guess the thing that gets to me is the implied negative consequences when you say something like "revolt". I don't think you ever want that sort of situation. CNS does take into account winning over the locker room, but he also can't change accordingly from game to game, right? So I guess if anything it speaks to one of the big issues of having a quarterback controversy at all, the kind of harm it can possibly do.
I think the word revolt would only apply to the QB position since it impacts whether or not the team will win so much more so than any other position. The team would not be up in arms if a more talented OLB or TE wasn't playing. I agree with your overall thought but I think the QB situation is handled differently than any other position on the field..
He hit the nail on the head with this- “It’s not so much what Jalen can’t do but what Tua does so very well.”
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Do you think that behind chewing on the sideline (Coach & OC) was because of play calling in which the CLOCK didn't move (incomplete passes); therefore Coach Saban wasn't able to insert Tua at QB in the final minutes like I think maybe he wanted to? That would have better prepared Tua for the NCG. Well, I guess Tua didn't need much preparation in front of a crowd during a BIG game.
Replying to some....
First and foremost I agree wholeheartedly with your last comment - you can disagree with out being insubordinate. I hope it was never actually close to any sort of real "revolt", and this was simply Hagan making a point.
But - and I say this knowing it will be controversial....
I’ve been a fan of Jalen Hurts, and will continue to be so – because (A) he’s a great person, and (B) I’m a fan of EVERY young man who wears the Crimson jersey! And (C) he's played extremely well for UA at times.
But frankly, I’ve said for two years that the decision to pick Jalen over Blake Barnett (and exclusively so) was a mistake from the get go. IMO, it was likely based on our coaches (Saban and probably Kiffin as well) being “Snake Charmed” by Watson in the 2015 NC game, and Saban having been Snake BITTEN by $Cam KNEWton in 2010 and Nick Marshal in 2013.
That, and the fact that BB was a cocky west coast kid and not well liked, whereas Jalen was and is a very well liked by his teammates. Still, the potential was there. Had BB gotten the PT and the undivided attention of the coaches, he had the potential to be a better, more effective version of AJ McCarron. Flame away.
Agree completely. Jalen is an IMMENSELY talented young man, and a great human being! It is not indictment of Jalen's character that he hasn't (yet) been able to master a skill that perhaps fewer than 100 people on this planet possess, and that's reading defenses and making accurate throws to second or third routes in a split second while under intense pressure from a strong rush.
Jalen has become a very good QB - when he has a clean pocket AND time. He's very effective in those situations. Unfortunately, aub and UGa both figured out that he can't function as a passer when pressured IF you also contain his scrambling. That scheme would be the blueprint for every defense Jalen will (or would have) face(d) the rest of his time as our QB.
And not to be ugly about it, but a big part of those 2016 passing yards were jet sweeps, which are recorded as Passes in the stats. Just sayin' .....
Agree completely.
All I can say is, Karma's a funny thing sometimes. Who ever thought Jim "the Senator" Tressel (with his phony "Mr. Clean" public persona) would ever be caught? And yet - he was.....
Not going to flame on you. But yeah, you drove the car into the swimming pool on this one. He can't even break the starting lineup at ASU. And my guess is he'll be a career backup until he graduates.
But let's just say you're right about Barnett, the fact the he wasn't liked by his teammates would have impacted how they responded to him on the field. So the offense would have suffered either way.
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I get that. Something like 900 yards on plays from behind the LOS. But, think about it from another perspective. It got the ball in the hands of playmakers, it resulted in more passing yards and TDs, it helped move the ball at times when Hurts might not have done it via the downfield passing game. It felt kind of like Daboll took the training wheels off early, and to reiterate, not unhappy with where we are now, but reading and seeing about the problems made it feel like some of them might have been avoidable.
The counter to any concerns I might have had with player's unhappiness, or Daboll's playcalling would be look where we are now. And I have to concede that things seem better now, and the future on offense looks brighter than it did toward the latter part of the season. So, all is well that ends well.
I am not a huge fan of counterfactual games and what if scenarios in sports because you can never account for injuries, agents and players or coaches leaving for ostensibly greener pastures. That said, as much success as we have had, Coach Saban's hierarchy of trust has been an issue at times. We almost certainly would have beaten Auburn in 2013 with a more diverse run game - take your pick from Henry, Drake, Jones or Tenpenney. Might have beaten them anyway if Saban had been willing to let a linebacker faster than Trey Depriest out there. Amari Cooper played because Dee White got hurt. It White stays healthy, Cooper might have seen mopup duty. Poor Chris Black probably should have played ahead of Christion Jones.
I agree that Coach Saban's decision to bring in Lane Kiffin was huge, but what he finally did on Monday night was on another level. I do agree with those who have said that if he had stuck with Jalen in the second half and the offense looked the same, it would have meant the end of his tenure. Instead, we are looking at a very, very bright future.
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I agree that Coach Saban's decision to bring in Lane Kiffin was huge, but what he finally did on Monday night was on another level. I do agree with those who have said that if he had stuck with Jalen in the second half and the offense looked the same, it would have meant the end of his tenure. Instead, we are looking at a very, very bright future.
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