Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article) - Page 3
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  1. #27
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    To answer the OP and the article, Tua is not the end of the RPO lovefest. There are just too many programs that benefit from the status quo.

    QBs that can run the RPO are far more common than mobile guys who also have no-foolin' passing ability. And the RPO is the underdog's best friend in that it's a great way for an outmanned team to hang in there against a team possessed of superior talent.

    The only thing that'll change that is a change in rules.

    They'd have to return to the NFL's rule on ineligible receiver downfield...1 yard. Right now, in college, it's 3 yards, which is the sole reason that the RPO / Malzahn / Chip Kelly offense even remotely viable.

    Tua proves that the pro offense, run by a quality passer, who has some mobility, is the most difficult to stop. Think John Elway.

    Trouble is, those guys aren't common. At all. Which means that the RPO will be with us until the rules change, i.e., never.

    I just don't see that genie being stuffed back into the bottle.
    Last edited by 4Q Basket Case; January 12th, 2018 at 10:26 PM.
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  3. #28
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by DC Tide View Post
    Quite a few of Tua's passes were in fact RPOs. And he had several nice read-option plays: a few times reading the DE, and once or twice reading the DT or MLB (can't recall).

    These were, by and large, successful plays. Why *wouldn't* you still run plays like that?
    This is exactly correct. We still ran quite a bit in the 2nd half, and Tua had several nice runs himself. The RPOs put pressure on a defense, and they work well even when your QB isn't a great passer. That offense will still be at a premium. If you have a guy who can read quickly and also make every throw, it should make the offense almost impossible to stop.

  4. #29
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by shaggy View Post
    First time I saw the quick release of Tua, I compared it to Willie Joe...
    I'm glad other people saw the same things I have seen.

    I'm pretty happy to have a Pro Style 'Gunslinger' running our Offense.
    Most Defenses haven't worked that much against the Pro Style for a while.
    They are gonna have to adjust to how we can attack.

  5. #30
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by Ole Man Dan View Post
    First time I saw the quick release of Tua, I compared it to Willie Joe...
    Never heard him called Willie Joe before. Joe Willie and Broadway Joe, yes.

  6. #31
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by Bamabuzzard View Post
    The problem is going to be are there enough talented quarterback who have the ability to run it? If there is, then yes, I could see this shift taking place. The read option allowed lesser talented teams to compete and use the "athletic" part a quarterback to beat you rather than having to do it strictly with his arm. But like I said above, with more and more kids attending these passing camps and getting a higher quality of coaching. There are more and more quarterbacks coming into college who can legitimately spin the ball at a high level.
    I agree. But lets not forget the reason for the spread and RPO: it was because the big Power Five teams were getting all the GREAT players. How many times is Vandy and Wake Forest going to get a GREAT Pro Style passer? The RPO will thrive on the G5 side and Memphis and UCF will still garner headlines. Are there 66 GREAT pro style QBs? Will there ever be 129? So while everyone wants to copy Coach Saban and there will be a shift it will not put the RPO out of business. You know the wishbone is still alive and well at GT, Army, Navy and a few more.
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  7. #32
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by Redwood Forrest View Post
    I agree. But lets not forget the reason for the spread and RPO: it was because the big Power Five teams were getting all the GREAT players. How many times is Vandy and Wake Forest going to get a GREAT Pro Style passer? The RPO will thrive on the G5 side and Memphis and UCF will still garner headlines. Are there 66 GREAT pro style QBs? Will there ever be 129? So while everyone wants to copy Coach Saban and there will be a shift it will not put the RPO out of business. You know the wishbone is still alive and well at GT, Army, Navy and a few more.
    Also, are there 330 competent OL, especially at pass-pro? That is as big of an issue as the QB.

  8. #33
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Great article. I have always thought the RPO was just a gimmick offense for teams whose QB was weak at reading coverages. It works, but it's just a band aid covering a sore spot. Unfortunately the RPO is here to stay because everything is being "dumbed" down.

  9. #34
    BamaNation First Team DC Tide's Avatar
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    I agree with y'all that we have a QB who is capable of running more than a single-read RPO, and that Alabama's offense will be more than a one-trick pony.

    However, I don't think there's anything inherently "dumb" about RPOs ... they're a smart way of getting a numerical advantage on the defense, just like the zone-read or even old-school power blocking. For the longest time I associated RPOs with long-developing plays like Nick Marshall's infamous TD pass in the Kick 6 Iron Bowl. Most RPOs, though, are quick reads and, for that reason, *can* be run in the NFL even with its 1-yard beyond the line of scrimmage blocking rule.

    Here's a good example of an RPO in the NFL:


    Look familiar? I'm pretty sure this slant to Foster on Bama's first TD drive was a similar play (skip to 4 minutes 44 seconds in the video):


    In fact, most of Tua's plays on that drive were one successful RPO after another. As Crimsonaudio says after posting a CFN preview, "I'll take it!"

  10. #35
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by DC Tide View Post
    Quite a few of Tua's passes were in fact RPOs. And he had several nice read-option plays: a few times reading the DE, and once or twice reading the DT or MLB (can't recall).

    These were, by and large, successful plays. Why *wouldn't* you still run plays like that?
    To avoid injury to your star player. We have possibly the best running backs in the country and need to use them better. We had very good but very frustrated receivers this year. Going to a more pro-style offense would make better use of all that talent while putting less stress on the QB.

  11. #36
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by DC Tide View Post
    I agree with y'all that we have a QB who is capable of running more than a single-read RPO, and that Alabama's offense will be more than a one-trick pony.

    However, I don't think there's anything inherently "dumb" about RPOs ... they're a smart way of getting a numerical advantage on the defense, just like the zone-read or even old-school power blocking. For the longest time I associated RPOs with long-developing plays like Nick Marshall's infamous TD pass in the Kick 6 Iron Bowl. Most RPOs, though, are quick reads and, for that reason, *can* be run in the NFL even with its 1-yard beyond the line of scrimmage blocking rule.

    Here's a good example of an RPO in the NFL:


    Look familiar? I'm pretty sure this slant to Foster on Bama's first TD drive was a similar play (skip to 4 minutes 44 seconds in the video):


    In fact, most of Tua's plays on that drive were one successful RPO after another. As Crimsonaudio says after posting a CFN preview, "I'll take it!"
    I wouldn't consider either of those plays "RPO," in that, in the first, the QB was never a threat to run the ball himself. It was just a play action pass (PA). In the second, I don't think the scramble was ever planned. The pass play just broke down...
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  12. #37
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    In most RPOs, the "R" part is a hand-off to the RB, not a QB run. That was the case in the Wentz pass and in the Tua slant to Foster.

  13. #38
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by crimsonaudio View Post
    I sure hope Tua is part of a movement back to where the QB isn't just some incredible athlete, but rather a technician who also has physical skills. I miss the days of GRAT QB's that could pick a defense apart - seems like that's such a rare trait now...
    I feel like Baker Mayfield was like this in a way except with the attitude (him against the world when it isn't). Tua has a lot MORE upside too than Baker. Who knows what would have happened had Tua played the entire game.
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  14. #39
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    Re: Tua - the end of the read option lovefest? (article)

    Quote Originally Posted by DC Tide View Post
    In most RPOs, the "R" part is a hand-off to the RB, not a QB run. That was the case in the Wentz pass and in the Tua slant to Foster.
    Well, I guess I need to go back to school. I thought the distinguishing feature was that the OL run-blocked while the QB isolated on a DB, usually a safety or a LB, trying to clear an area for a pass, or, if the defender stayed back, either the QB ran or handed off to a RB. RPO doesn't strictly require a mobile QB, but it certainly helps. I'll look at the Wentz pass again, but it looked to me as if the OL pulled up and pass-blocked...
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