Daboll frustrated - Wanted to start Tua in November

TIDE-HSV

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Only at the Capstone could we be one week into a reign as national champions and finding as much fault as we can over both how we got here and how we are going forward.

I do say this calmly and with a smile - it’s just kind of funny.....
Don't you remember the rule? We only got to enjoy it for 24 hours... ;)
 

92tide

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:) pretty good. But these sentiments do filter down to the media and the program, as well as to us weak fans who take it too seriously :). But we gotta keep the board straight.
my wife and i got to go to the u-dub game last year. i was pretty psyched because i had never been to anything bigger than an seccg (no bowl games, etc) and we do a lot of work with folks from washington state. we had really good tide pride seats we bought from my uncle. the non-stop whining by our fanbase during that game made it pretty much un-enjoyable.
 

JDCrimson

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Feb 12, 2006
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We try to make it seem like it's some disagreement between Daboll and coach when it could be just what was reported. These guys in most ways are like you and me. They have families and pressures at home just we do.

Daboll is not a southerner, a career NFL coach, has a large family with another child on the way. I have 2 kids and rely on my parents more than I thought I would to help see after them. Imagine six kids 2000 miles away from your family support network, no friends, a wife at home all day with those kids and a husband gone 16 hours a day... Sounds like a pretty miserable situation reegardless of the money you are making.

So the chance to move back to home state in the predictable NFL rigors, no recruiting responsibilities for same or better money and the wife is happy. It's a no brainer.

Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
 

81usaf92

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Until you gave me a neg, I never directed any criticism at you personally. I pointed out the absurdity of people going on about how they knew what Saban should do better than he does. You assumed I was directing that at you, and started dishing out negatives. I think the reason you responded as you did was because I was making a good point that made you uncomfortable.
Whatever makes you sleep better at night...

Moving on
 

BamaMoon

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This isn't sour grapes (because he left) toward Daboll. But regardless of whether he could work under Saban or not, got frustrated or not. He had to jump on the opportunity to be an OC in the NFL. Because based on the guy's NFL track record as an OC. He'll be back as a position coach within three years, if that. I certainly hope not and maybe he'll go on to be one of the best OC's in the NFL. But his track record says otherwise. He had no choice but to jump on the offer and the $$$ that came with it.
You are probably onto the right tract about his career. He had OC experience before, but limited success. He wasn't an OC in New England. So he basically took advantage of a great opportunity to jump back to the OC level at the NFL level. It is what it is.
 

Go4Two1966

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He should have been put in at the second half of the AU disaster. Saban's actions were obviously due to desperation. I think he resisted as long as possible, so I assume if not starting Tua (or giving him substantial playing time) contributed substantially to why we have lost the third OC in essentially one year, Daboll had decided to leave before we even put on shoulder pads for the NC.
 

BamaInBham

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He should have been put in at the second half of the AU disaster. Saban's actions were obviously due to desperation. I think he resisted as long as possible, so I assume if not starting Tua (or giving him substantial playing time) contributed substantially to why we have lost the third OC in essentially one year, Daboll had decided to leave before we even put on shoulder pads for the NC.
That's easy to say in retrospect. Bama was in that game til the 4th qtr.

By most accounts, Daboll left for reasons other than the QB - personal and professional. Frankly, if he left because the HC, after considering the OC's input, made a different decision, he shouldn't be wanted - the HC always calls those shots. I doubt he did.
 

STONECOLDSABAN

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He should have been put in at the second half of the AU disaster. Saban's actions were obviously due to desperation. I think he resisted as long as possible, so I assume if not starting Tua (or giving him substantial playing time) contributed substantially to why we have lost the third OC in essentially one year, Daboll had decided to leave before we even put on shoulder pads for the NC.
Its easy to say that now, but you have to remember, Going into the iron bowl. We had won almost every game for the previous two years by 14 points or more.
Ole miss- 2016 (lapses by the special teams and defense at the end)
LSU- 2016 (they could still be playing and LSU wouldn't have scored in that game)
Clemson-2017
Texas A&M (Garbage TD near the end)
Miss state. (Jalen played a good game)

So I know we could see offensive problems earlier in the season, but when you win almost every game by 14 points or more its kind of difficult to make that change. We were also barely ever turning the ball over under Jalen. We were up after the first drive of the second half iron bowl and then the wheels fell off.
 
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KrAzY3

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This isn't sour grapes (because he left) toward Daboll. But regardless of whether he could work under Saban or not, got frustrated or not. He had to jump on the opportunity to be an OC in the NFL. Because based on the guy's NFL track record as an OC. He'll be back as a position coach within three years, if that. I certainly hope not and maybe he'll go on to be one of the best OC's in the NFL. But his track record says otherwise. He had no choice but to jump on the offer and the $$$ that came with it.
I can't really argue with what you said, but my perspective is colored by my belief all along that he was a pro guy who might not be cut out for the college game anyway.

So, looking at it the other way around, let's say he did have ambition to be a part of the college game, he was in the best possible situation. He had Tua for two more years, we know he loves the deep ball, we know Tua can throw it, he'd have weapons all over the place. Even with Hurts, his offense was the 15th scoring offense, so that should only improve with a better fit for his system at QB. He'd have been set up for 3 good years as coordinator at Alabama, and we know at that point he'd have practically been guaranteed a head coaching job in college. Either way his leaving tells me he never really wanted to be there and perhaps accurately realizes he's not cut out for dealing with college kids.
 

uafanataum

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I see it this way. After turning Tua loose and seeing the result as well as Freeze (shiver) already spending time in T-Town CNS ain't leaning toward the conservative scheme.
Can you imagine our talent with an aggressive offense and a defense that never allows more than 14 ppg (except for during bowl games) If Saban is truly looking to go more aggressive on offense with all this talent then the next few years could be sprcial!
 

CoastGhost

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That's what I'm getting at though. He basically had the same offense, the same things he wanted to do. I would hope a good college coordinator is going to tailor what he is doing for the players on the field (whose abilities might vary greatly). The idea that he wanted another guy playing QB makes it more ominous to me. It's one reason I said a change had to be made at halftime, because Daboll clearly wasn't going to call different plays, and what he was calling clearly wasn't working.

So we get to the second half, Tua is in, viola the offense works. But that doesn't excuse the playcalling in the first half when the quarterback was a different guy. The team was still 3-14 on third downs, they still lost time of possession, it was less yards and less points than they put up the previous championship game (with Hurts playing the entire game and the game ended in regulation). It was not a masterful performance overall and the way Daboll is departing reinforces my concerns about him. I worried all along he was just a pro guy that was somewhat limited in what he could do, and his leaving does nothing to change my mind on that. I was open to the idea of his staying since yes, now he has his guy at QB, but still not enough for him.

To be clear though, I am happy with the idea of Tua starting at QB. But, I'd be lying if I said I was completely happy with how things played out.
I believe some credit must be given to Georgia's ability to shut down the run and pressure Jalen enough to impact his read time. Kirby knew if he could do that there would be some success against Jalen. What he probably did not expect was Thor coming out in the second half, flinging lightening bolts all over the field and maintaining his composure in a manner similar to Hurts. Jalen's mentoring throughout the year had to make the last part of that possible to my thinking.
 

CoastGhost

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He should have been put in at the second half of the AU disaster. Saban's actions were obviously due to desperation. I think he resisted as long as possible, so I assume if not starting Tua (or giving him substantial playing time) contributed substantially to why we have lost the third OC in essentially one year, Daboll had decided to leave before we even put on shoulder pads for the NC.
"Desperation" is not a word I would use to describe a coach with 6 national championships. That was a heck of a tough decision. Smart, gutsy, exasperated, exhausted - plenty of other choices but desperate? Nah ...
 

KrAzY3

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"Desperation" is not a word I would use to describe a coach with 6 national championships. That was a heck of a tough decision. Smart, gutsy, exasperated, exhausted - plenty of other choices but desperate? Nah ...
I don't see it as desperation either, especially when you consider that the entire thing was Saban's design really. He recruited a guy, he chose not to redshirt him, he gave him playing time early and often, he let him work with the first team some, and when the time came he turned to him.
 

imaloyalone

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"Desperation" is not a word I would use to describe a coach with 6 national championships. That was a heck of a tough decision. Smart, gutsy, exasperated, exhausted - plenty of other choices but desperate? Nah ...
While desperation might not be the right word, it’s safe to say he was backed into a tight corner - one of the most difficult ones he’s faced in his time at UA.
 

KrAzY3

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While desperation might not be the right word, it’s safe to say he was backed into a tight corner - one of the most difficult ones he’s faced in his time at UA.
This is just my perspective, but the way I see it he set that whole thing up though. The easy way out was an entirely different scenario, one he didn't choose. I incorrectly advocated for just redshirting Tua, basically putting whomever they could at backup (convincing Bateman to stay, graduate transfer, what ever), and in doing so avoiding that whole mess before it started. Under that scenario, there is just no way the pressure would have mounted like it did. I still think that path could have worked out for Hurts, but Saban wasn't willing to bet it all on Hurts.

Tua wouldn't have seen any time in games, he wouldn't have worked at all with the first team, plenty of 5 star, future first round picks have taken this route, so while I'm sure some people would have been really impressed with his talent, there's just no way that it would have been nearly as big a deal because you don't yank the redshirt off a guy in November and give him his first playing time in the playoffs (even if the QB has broken ribs). Even a pro guy like Daboll would have understood why you don't do that. Beyond that though, Saban didn't force the offense into being a Hurts friendly, short stuff type offense like we saw Kiffin do with Hurts. He let them keep in a lot of downfield, pro-style elements even though that clearly wasn't what was best for Hurts. So, when the time came for Tua, he had things set up so they could work for him. The narrative that Saban screwed up with Tua seems to overlook that Saban put Tua in that position in the first place. He never had to do that, he chose to.
 
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BamaInBham

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While desperation might not be the right word, it’s safe to say he was backed into a tight corner - one of the most difficult ones he’s faced in his time at UA.
It seems obvious that he had been planning for this contingency. He had been talking about Jimmy Garopollo and the spark he had provided the 49er's for a couple of weeks - it's possible Tua's entrance was what he was hinting at. He had seriously planned to put Tua in vs Clemson, but he wasn't needed. He had done the same in this game. Phil Savage had said before the game, that he thought Tua would play. He may have put him in earlier in the game, but the score was a "Jalen manageable" 6-0 til 7 seconds before the half. IMO, he had probably already made up his mind to put Tua in as he entered the half, i.e., he was not backed up against the wall by the coaches and/or players. Not that they didn't want a change, I'm sure they did.
 
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