Alabama QB competition article

Snuffy Smith

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I am not sure what Jalen would accomplish by transferring next year unless he wants to have 2 years to start somewhere. If he sticks around and can graduate in 3 years he can go wherever he wants and start his senior season. If he transfers he sits for a year then has 2 years of eligibility - but if his goal is to get to the NFL in 4 years then he is no better off, other than I guess he would be in the system and learning.


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UAllday

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I am not sure what Jalen would accomplish by transferring next year unless he wants to have 2 years to start somewhere. If he sticks around and can graduate in 3 years he can go wherever he wants and start his senior season. If he transfers he sits for a year then has 2 years of eligibility - but if his goal is to get to the NFL in 4 years then he is no better off, other than I guess he would be in the system and learning.


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If his dreams are in the NFL then he will need 2 years to play. What would be the difference in 4 or 5 years? For Jalen it could be the difference in him getting drafted or not. I'm transferring, sitting a year and having two to play. If he only wants one year to play then he can redshirt, get the best coaching , etc, hang around until tua announces for draft and be ready after that.
 

selmaborntidefan

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What success in the LSU game?




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I was AT the LSU game. That's when my bro and I were looking at each other and saying, "We're not going to win the title this year if we don't fix some blocking issues and get some consistency at QB."

The Auburn game was NOT a surprise to anyone who had been actually paying attention to the two teams.

To be fair - QBs get too much credit AND too much blame (somewhat like coaches do) for things, but the fact remains that Hurts has had PLENTY of games and exposure and PLENTY of BIG games to step up his game.

He hasn't done it.


In most cases, Jalen has basically been ON THE FIELD when we won.


Jay Barker had a more impressive early run than Jalen has had (as in, you know, he actually WON his title game), and let's speak bluntly: he wasn't a very good QB until his senior year. The game has changed too much since then to just sit on "hope so."
 

AlexanderFan

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I think you come out and you don't let Jalen run in any of the easy games. You don't call any running plays for him and you don't allow him to run. Have him take sacks. He has got to get where he becomes a pass first, run to find time second, and the run to gain yards 3rd qb. If you want a qb to progress in the passing game you don't design running plays for him. Why we did that last year idk.
Guess who touches the ball every single play when he's in the game? Jalen Hurts. Guess who can turn every play, regardless of what is actually called, into a quarterback scramble? Jalen Hurts. Why do you think the rest of the offense was on the verge of mutiny? He kept the ball on plays he should've distributed it to the backs and he was late on throws and decided to scramble instead.


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RTR91

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I knew someone would bring that up but sometimes you gotta watch the tape and not just look at the stats and the passes he did make in that game were some very good ones. Maybe I just look at things different, also forgot to mention the Mississippi State game as well.
Initially didn't even go off the stats. I couldn't remember any great passes from the LSU game. When I checked the stats and saw he went 11-24, 183 yards and 1 TD, I felt pretty good about my memory.

ESPN's adjusted QBR for the LSU game was 80.8 (fourth best against P5 teams and seventh best overall on the season). Maybe I should re-watch the game, but I recall it being a pretty blah performance by the entire team.
 

tusks_n_raider

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To be fair - QBs get too much credit AND too much blame (somewhat like coaches do) for things, but the fact remains that Hurts has had PLENTY of games and exposure and PLENTY of BIG games to step up his game.

He hasn't done it.


In most cases, Jalen has basically been ON THE FIELD when we won.
It's because fair or not the entire success or failure of the Offense is funneled through the QB getting the ball in the right players hands.

He is supposed to read the opposing Defense, Make Protection checks w/ the Center, Send RB's or WR's in Motion, Call an Audible if a disaster is about to happen etc etc.

Jalen hasn't reached a level to do all that successfully for whatever reason(s).

In reference to your last comment I almost quickly posted something to the effect of "Dang man that's a little harsh to say..." BUT...

Then I really looked at those game to game stats...

His best numbers (which still are just OK) were against the weakest of teams and his worst stats were against the better/good/great teams.

So as much as I love Jalen I can't really disagree with you. His best moment was probably the comeback and GW drive against MSU.... but we never should have needed to comeback either....plus that game also started the "Built for Moments like this" type boasting.....so....yeah.
 

gtgilbert

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Aug 12, 2011
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If Tua starts, we lose Jalen.

If Jalen starts, we lose Tua and Taulia. Seems like a no-brainer...

Saban knows this and I trust him to make the right decision for the team. If he had kept Jalen in the NCG, I’d be worried.
and likely a whole bunch of WR and RB recruits in the next cycle.
 

RTR91

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It's because fair or not the entire success or failure of the Offense is funneled through the QB getting the ball in the right players hands.
Similar to pitchers in baseball.
In reference to your last comment I almost quickly posted something to the effect of "Dang man that's a little harsh to say..." BUT...

Then I really looked at those game to game stats...

His best numbers (which still are just OK) were against the weakest of teams and his worst stats were against the better/good/great teams.

So as much as I love Jalen I can't really disagree with you. His best moment was probably the comeback and GW drive against MSU.... but we never should have needed to comeback either....plus that game also started the "Built for Moments like this" type boasting.....so....yeah.
Yep. Posted about it earlier in the thread. His stats are inflated because of the weaker teams.

In his two years on campus, Jalen has faced 14 teams with a top 50 passing efficiency defense.

In those games, he averages 12-21, 139 yards, 1.1 TD, .5 INT, and a 122.2 QB Rating.

In the 15 games against weaker pass defenses, he averages 15.1-22.6, 194.3 yards, 1.7 TD, .2 INT, and a 177.5 QB Rating. If we take out the two FCS games (Mercer and UT-Chattanooga, his stats go to 16.7-23.9, 199.9 yards, 1.5 TD, .2 INT, and a 156.3 QB Rating.

His stats are somewhat inflated from those weaker defenses.
 

Bamabuzzard

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This statement right here let's me know that during his conversation with Mr. Hurts both parties understand Jalen is transferring if he isn't named the starter. Mac Jones, start warming up son.


"But I think at the end of the day everybody has career decisions that they'll have to make," Saban said. "Nobody knows what the outcome of the situation will bring for us. We don't want any players not to be able to fulfill their goals and aspirations in our program here. We don't want that for any of our players."

http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/23251358/nick-saban-alabama-says-jalen-hurts-father-same-page
 
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tusks_n_raider

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This statement right here let's me know that during his conversation with Mr. Hurts that both parties understand Jalen is transferring if he isn't named the starter. Mac Jones, start warming up son.

http://www.espn.com/college-footbal...ban-alabama-says-jalen-hurts-father-same-page
Yeah I just don't see this ending too well come late August....

CNS is going to make a self HC career decision and program changer to start a once in a lifetime PHENOM QB. One that will make our offense truly 2-dimensional and extremely explosive and take the pressure off a Defense with a new secondary.

Jalen will have to make a career decision to stay and receive the QB coaching he's wanted while only being a play away from going back in.....or.... sit out and graduate and then have 2 years at a new school with yet ANOTHER OC to learn from.

On the bright side I do feel extremely encouraged over Mac Jones progress. Everything I've seen, heard, and read looks and sounds like he's already the 2nd Best Passing QB on the team.

We will be more than fine with Mac as QB2.
 
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Bamabuzzard

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Yeah I just don't see this ending too well come late August....

CNS is going to make a self HC career decision and program changer to start a once in a lifetime PHENOM QB. One that will make our offense truly 2-dimensional and extremely explosive and take the pressure off a Defense with a new secondary.

Jalen will have to make a career decision to stay and receive the QB coaching he's wanted while only being a play away from going back in.....or.... sit out and graduate and then have 2 years at a new school with yet ANOTHER OC to learn from.

On the bright side I do feel extremely encouraged over Mac Jones progress. Everything I've seen, heard, and read sounds like he's already the 2nd Best Passing QB on the team.

We will be more than fine with Mac as QB2.
With CNS bringing Coach Dan Enos on staff (quarterback coach) I am very comfortable in Mac Jones. Coach Enos is WELL respected in his field and is known for being an excellent quarterback coach. If it comes down that Hurts doesn't win the job (which I'd be shocked if he does beat out Tua and named starter), I wish the young man and his family all the best of luck where ever they end up.
 

selmaborntidefan

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It's because fair or not the entire success or failure of the Offense is funneled through the QB getting the ball in the right players hands.

He is supposed to read the opposing Defense, Make Protection checks w/ the Center, Send RB's or WR's in Motion, Call an Audible if a disaster is about to happen etc etc.

Jalen hasn't reached a level to do all that successfully for whatever reason(s).

In reference to your last comment I almost quickly posted something to the effect of "Dang man that's a little harsh to say..." BUT...

Then I really looked at those game to game stats...

His best numbers (which still are just OK) were against the weakest of teams and his worst stats were against the better/good/great teams.

So as much as I love Jalen I can't really disagree with you. His best moment was probably the comeback and GW drive against MSU.... but we never should have needed to comeback either....plus that game also started the "Built for Moments like this" type boasting.....so....yeah.

Look, I like the kid, okay? What he did when he BEGAN was REALLY phenomenal.

But set aside the "well, Alabama is unbeaten in 2016" stuff and ask yourself.....what did he REALLY do?

He fumbled his first ever snap against USC. Of course, it's not fair to judge him entirely on that, either.

USC - he was 6 of 11 for 118 yards, 110 of which came on TWO TD pass plays to Ardarius Stewart. Keep in mind that the long TD pass was only about a 14-yard pass that Stewart ran the rest of the way on his own. Also - the defense scored enough to win the game by itself (Marlon's pick six).

He DID have a good game against WKU, hardly a stellar national power. Again keep in mind that the defense and special teams scored as many points as WKU did.


And that leads us to Ole Miss 2016.

Hurts was 19 for 31 for 158 yards. What was important was his RUSHING. I have to admit that without a running QB who could take some time off the clock, we probably DO lose the Ole Miss game. Of course, if you look closer, we had THREE NOTs (Jackson's punt return, Payne's fumble recovery, and Allen's 75-yard rumble), too. This was a strange game all the way around, and I'd hate to put my whole legacy on this one game. But yes, Hurts does deserve credit, and I won't blame him for the fumble on the not called targeting hit that got Ole Miss a TD.

Kent State and UTC aren't even worth talking about.

UK - 20 of 33 for 262, 2 TDs, 0 INT. But again....the defense scored 7 points and only gave up 6. I was at that game and even with those stats it didn't feel like he was improving all that much.

Arky - Hurts had a good game, 13 of 17 for 253, 2TD, 1INT. But even those stats are inflated. 67 of those yards came on a pass play of 20 yards to Stewart, who ran the next 47....oh and fumbled the ball away. You can't blame the fumble on Hurts, but the fact is he had TWO completions the entire game of more than 16 yards and MOST were under 11.

Tennessee - AGAIN, the defense and special teams scored 14 points and the D only gave up 10. Hurts completed 17 of 27 for 172 yards, but he did splending with his legs, rushing for 3 TDs and over 100 yards.

ATM - now again, I was at this game. And the way I recall it, we SHOULD have been blowing ATM out by about three TDs at halftime and yet we only led by six points. But just as a reminder, we went right down the field against them and got first and goal at the ten. Hurts took two losses for five yards and missed a pass to Ridley and we settled for three. On the second drive, we had first and goal at the 9 and Hurts threw a pass to OJ for a 2-yard loss, a run for no gain, and an incomplete to Ridley - and we got a SECOND FG. On the third drive, he did finish with a 5-yard toss to OJ for the TD. On a later drive towards the end of the half, Hurts got us first and 10 at the ATM 14 and we had Jacobs for a loss, Jacobs for a gain, and an incomplete to Ardarius, followed by a missed 29-yard FG. At the end of the half, he threw a meaningless pick.

To open the second half after ATM scored, Hurts had THREE incompletions and we would have had to punt but got bailed out by a DPI that gave us new life.

His stat line was 15 of 25 for 164, 2/2. But 46 of that came on the same basic play that got a lot of his yards where Stewart catches the ball and runs.

LSU - 10 of 19 for 107 yards is never impressive. He had the run that won the game, but one surmises that a competent passer would have blown out LSU.

MSU - okay, he flung the ball for 347 yards. Keep in mind that Kentucky's QB threw for 292 and Danny Etling for 215 (he had Fournette so, less passing)

I mean, YEAH, he threw for a bunch of yards, mostly to Ardarius on the same play they couldn't stop.

Auburn - again, he had a decent enough game, but we kept leaving points on the board. On the first scoring drive we had 2nd and 1 at the eight and he got sacked for a loss and we settled for a FG. right before the half we had first and 10 at the Auburn 13 and had two incompletions and a short run by Bo and settled for another FG. Decent but nothing to write home about.



Let me summarize it like this: Jalen Hurts has had TWENTY-NINE football games to learn to know when to pass and hasn't done it against a defense of any calibre. Tua had ONE HALF of football against an elite level defense when he entered the game down 13-0 and DID know what to do with one exception.

I surmise that 29 games' experience and Tua won't throw the awful pick he did against UGA.

I don't have the same confidence in Jalen to know when to pull the trigger.
 

RTR91

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Really enjoy the work the guys at CFB Film Room do. Here are their pass charts for Jalen and Tua:









Since these charts don't include throw aways or "tap passes," the totals are different from what you will find elsewhere.

On their website, they have a breakdown of dropbacks, attempts, completetions, etc. For 2016, they say Jalen threw the ball away 29 times plus 354 attempts (that's a total of 383 - one more than any other source), so the numbers here are off just a bit.

Taking the 29 throw aways out of the discussion, Jalen had 26 passes and 258 yards not included in the 2016 chart. That's 7% of his passing attempts and 9% of his passing yards in 2016.

In 2017, Jalen had 15 TAs while Tua had 3, which means Jalen had 5 "tap" passes to Tua only having 1.

Pretty comparable numbers in 2017 overall, and there was clearly improvement in play calls of tap passes.

The noticeable difference comes in the two players' scrambling. Jalen had 426 dropbacks in 2016 and 318 in 2017; Tua had 86 this year. In 2016, Jalen did not attempt a pass, throw the ball away or take a sack on 26 plays (6.1%). In 2017, the numbers increased when he did throw the ball at all or take a sack on 31 plays (9.7%). Tua didn't throw the ball or take a sack on 4 plays (4.7%).

This could be the biggest number of all. It highlights why the WRs were frustrated throughout the year. Why would he scramble more in year two compared to year one when teams didn't have the game plan to defend him yet?
 

CoastGhost

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I love Jalen. If he doesn't want to compete to be the best, or cannot accept the results of that competition, that should inform his NFL future.

Stay or go, but don't let your Dad drive your decisions. At least they not pulling a BB. Next up.
 

CajunCrimson

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Ultimately, I don't blame him for leaving, if he does. But, I'm guessing that CNS doesn't handle even veiled ultimatums very well....

To be the man, you've got to beat the man......

 

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