Alabama: Tide vs Sooners: X's and O's and Jimmies and Joes

twofbyc

Hall of Fame
Oct 14, 2009
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Agreed but that is assuming Tua is 100% for the game and has good mobility. Fingers crossed that he's fully recovered.
I don’t think their defense has shown any ability to even stop JH.
Now, if Tua gets hurt early and starts missing throws badly again, and stays in the game, all bets are off.
We have seen first hand an injured Tua is not as effective as a healthy JH. But, then again, Georgia’s defense >>>>>>>>>>>>>OU’s defense.


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RTR91

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Well.. maybe. The way Mizzou is NOW.. I agree. However, if Mizzou had remained in the Pac12 they wouldn't have had the SEC to bolster them in a plethora of ways. One of such is bringing up their level of play to the competition. I firmly believe Mizzou being in the SEC has made them a better team. As such if Mizzou were still in the PAC12 they may still be a " PAC12" type team. :)
Yeah but what about them being in the Big 12?
 

NationalTitles18

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https://www.al.com/sports/2018/12/b...I3je-n-Mo9JH3f0cmy9JgGPikASngSzyeeGwc86HeOMKg

[FONT=&quot]Alabama quarterback commit Paul Tyson plans to arrive at Alabama on Friday, having graduated from high school a semester early and ready to take part in on-campus bowl practices.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]The Hewitt-Trussville product said he has a one simple goal: "Help the team any way I can," he said.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Alabama coaches may have already determined how.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Tyson said there have “definitely” been discussions about him mimicking Clemson quarterback Trevor Lawrence as a scout-team quarterback if the Crimson Tide and Clemson meet in the national championship game. Alabama plays Oklahoma in one College Football Playoff semifinal, and Clemson meets Notre Dame in the other.[/FONT]
 

BamaMan09

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I wonder who is imitating Murray leading up to the Orange Bowl ? That's a very intriguing question. Not sure we have anyone who can mimic him.
 

cubzwin

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Jan 30, 2018
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Dude. We quoted you. Since maybe you forgot what you said earlier, let me repost what ​you said.
GratefulSooner: "...I would not be at all surprised if the OU defense in the Orange Bowl is on par with what you saw against an LSU or A&M."
You are entitled to your opinion. Perhaps the OU defense in the Orange Bowl will not only be on par with LSU but will conjure memories of the defensive prowess of the 1986 Chicago Bears.
 

The Ols

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Were the '86 Bears as good as the '85 Bears? JK!!! I was in NO for the SB v NE...19 years old and my hometown team had just won the Super Bowl, in New Orleans...CRAZY.:pDTC_009: on TideFans.com
Dude. We quoted you. Since maybe you forgot what you said earlier, let me repost what ​you said.
GratefulSooner: "...I would not be at all surprised if the OU defense in the Orange Bowl is on par with what you saw against an LSU or A&M."
You are entitled to your opinion. Perhaps the OU defense in the Orange Bowl will not only be on par with LSU but will conjure memories of the defensive prowess of the 1986 Chicago Bears.
 

GratefulSooner

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Nov 30, 2015
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Dude. We quoted you. Since maybe you forgot what you said earlier, let me repost what ​you said....Perhaps the OU defense in the Orange Bowl will not only be on par with LSU but will conjure memories of the defensive prowess of the 1986 Chicago Bears.
HAHA...I love the way you pretend you're just trying to accurately represent what I said in good faith! Funny stuff.

Here is the sentence you chopped. It was the lead in sentence that came directly before the one you quoted:

"I doubt we'll magically morph into the best defense Alabama has seen."

I understand that my prior post could be confusing. I can't understand how anyone thinks I believe we're going to morph into defensive world-beaters.

Top-10, top-20, etc. is pretty arbitrary. But it is not uncommon for fans like me to group teams according to top-10 (elite), top-20 (good), and outside top-60 (bad).

The FEI defensive rankings are the gold standard as far as I'm concerned. They ultimately tie all teams together not just on games and scores, but actually by drives and individual plays (while excluding garbage time.)

Here are the defensive FEI rankings of Alabama and opponents:

Group 1: Elite (top-10)
1 - Alabana
2 - Miss State
3 - Clemson
9 - Georgia


Group 2: Good to Above Average (top-20 to top-60)

12 - LSU
17 - Mizzou
20 - Auburn
58 - Texas A&M


Group 3: Below Average to Bad (Not in top 60)

61 - Arkansas St
65 - Tennessee
85 - Arkansas
98 - Oklahoma
106 - Ole Miss
128 - Louisville

I pointed out that Oklahoma has played in Group 3 all year ("on par with an Ole Miss or Louisville")
I rejected the idea that they were capable of playing a game like a Group 1 defense ("I doubt we'll magically morph...")
I suggested they are capable of playing somewhere the good to above average range ("on par with an LSU or A&M")

The "good to above average" range (top-20 to top-60) is represented by the range from LSU-A&M within the context of Alabama's schedule this year. I assumed everybody here knows there's a big range between LSU and A&M defense, and that juxtaposing those teams would make it clear I'm talking about bracket.

I'm not saying "OU's defense might become as good as LSU's defense in 3 weeks." I'm saying "Best case scenario, OU's A-game after bowl prep in a single game could be top-20 good". That is "on par" with LSU's C-game (average) during the regular season. If I was setting a range on LSU's bowl potential, the high water mark would be way above their average regular season performance as captured in the FEI rankings.
 
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RollTide_HTTR

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I'm not saying "OU's defense might become as good as LSU's defense in 3 weeks." I'm saying "Best case scenario, OU's A-game after bowl prep in a single game could be top-20 good". That is "on par" with LSU's C-game (average) during the regular season. If I was setting a range on LSU's bowl potential, the high water mark would be way above their average regular season performance as captured in the FEI rankings.
Wait, aren't these rankings essentially averages? So, LSU's average would be top 12 and OU's would be 98th.

Regardless, I kind of understand what you are saying but I also think you're simply wrong. Can the OU defense play above their ranking? Sure. Can they perform on the level of an LSU? Nope.
 
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CrimsonForce

Hall of Fame
Dec 20, 2012
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HAHA...I love the way you pretend you're just trying to accurately represent what I said in good faith! Funny stuff.

Here is the sentence you chopped. It was the lead in sentence that came directly before the one you quoted:

"I doubt we'll magically morph into the best defense Alabama has seen."

I understand that my prior post could be confusing. I can't understand how anyone thinks I believe we're going to morph into defensive world-beaters.

Top-10, top-20, etc. is pretty arbitrary. But it is not uncommon for fans like me to group teams according to top-10 (elite), top-20 (good), and outside top-60 (bad).

The FEI defensive rankings are the gold standard as far as I'm concerned. They ultimately tie all teams together not just on games and scores, but actually by drives and individual plays (while excluding garbage time.)

Here are the defensive FEI rankings of Alabama and opponents:

Group 1: Elite (top-10)
1 - Alabana
2 - Miss State
3 - Clemson
9 - Georgia


Group 2: Good to Above Average (top-20 to top-60)

12 - LSU
17 - Mizzou
20 - Auburn
58 - Texas A&M


Group 3: Below Average to Bad (Not in top 60)

61 - Arkansas St
65 - Tennessee
85 - Arkansas
98 - Oklahoma
106 - Ole Miss
128 - Louisville

I pointed out that Oklahoma has played in Group 3 all year ("on par with an Ole Miss or Louisville")
I rejected the idea that they were capable of playing a game like a Group 1 defense ("I doubt we'll magically morph...")
I suggested they are capable of playing somewhere the good to above average range ("on par with an LSU or A&M")

The "good to above average" range (top-20 to top-60) is represented by the range from LSU-A&M within the context of Alabama's schedule this year. I assumed everybody here knows there's a big range between LSU and A&M defense, and that juxtaposing those teams would make it clear I'm talking about bracket.

I'm not saying "OU's defense might become as good as LSU's defense in 3 weeks." I'm saying "Best case scenario, OU's A-game after bowl prep in a single game could be top-20 good". That is "on par" with LSU's C-game (average) during the regular season. If I was setting a range on LSU's bowl potential, the high water mark would be way above their average regular season performance as captured in the FEI rankings.
If you just take out the bit about LSU then I think most would agree. The problem with bringing up LSU is they are borderline an elite defense and there's no way OU could reach that level. I don't see OU even reaching the level of playing LSU's "C" game as you put it. I could see OU playing above their heads and being somewhat comparable to an above average defense (A&M). The problem with saying that OU could play on par with LSU or A&M is that LSU is only a couple spots away from elite and A&M is only a couple spots away from below average. You just picked too wide of a range. Stick with the A&M comparison as a best case scenario and it's more believable..
 

BamaMoon

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Very interesting...
I've been fascinated with P. Tyson's committment. If Bama were not in the middle of the greatest dynasty in college football and recruiting QBs at a level like we've never seen, Tyson would be the biggest news in the state of Alabama in decades!

FWIW, I know he's a real talent and didn't get a scholly at Bama because of who he is. In a perfect world he'd win the QB job in 2020 and win 2 or 3 NC at Bama, play in the NFL for 10 years and then come back to Bama to be our HC and win titles like his grandfather did!!! OK, back to reality...

It'll be interesting to see how he competes with other top, 5 star rated QB recruits that'll be coming in to the program while he's there.

#Bamaproblems
 

BamaMan09

All-SEC
Feb 26, 2009
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If you just take out the bit about LSU then I think most would agree. The problem with bringing up LSU is they are borderline an elite defense and there's no way OU could reach that level. I don't see OU even reaching the level of playing LSU's "C" game as you put it. I could see OU playing above their heads and being somewhat comparable to an above average defense (A&M). The problem with saying that OU could play on par with LSU or A&M is that LSU is only a couple spots away from elite and A&M is only a couple spots away from below average. You just picked too wide of a range. Stick with the A&M comparison as a best case scenario and it's more believable..
I think Ole Miss is a reasonable comparison though maybe somewhat better. I keep thinking of the style that Ole Miss has played the last three years as a good reference for this game. Or is that a stretch ?
 

soonerknight

Suspended
Dec 14, 2018
10
0
0
Wait, aren't these rankings essentially averages? So, LSU's average would be top 12 and OU's would be 98th.

Regardless, I kind of understand what you are saying but I also think you're simply wrong. Can the OU defense play above their ranking? Sure. Can they perform on the level of an LSU? Nope.
I believe TCU has better defense than LSU. LSU is not the be all to end all so I would not say OU will play like them at all. I will say that I have spent all season appalled at our defense And this is not the worst defense to play in the playoffs last years OU Defense was. LOL!

We know how that game went. Our D was hoping holes 3 miles wide for Georgia. Just need a better DC oh wait we fired the last one so maybe this game will be different. Don’t count the Sooners out we may have a reslly bad defense but it does enough to help win.
 

RollTide_HTTR

Hall of Fame
Feb 22, 2017
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I believe TCU has better defense than LSU. LSU is not the be all to end all so I would not say OU will play like them at all. I will say that I have spent all season appalled at our defense And this is not the worst defense to play in the playoffs last years OU Defense was. LOL!

We know how that game went. Our D was hoping holes 3 miles wide for Georgia. Just need a better DC oh wait we fired the last one so maybe this game will be different. Don’t count the Sooners out we may have a reslly bad defense but it does enough to help win.
I'm definitely not counting OU out. OU is essentially my 2nd team. Watch every game. Your offense with this coach makes you incredibly dangerous even without a real defense.

That said, IMO it's going to take some bounces going your way for you guys to pull off the upset in this game.

Also pretty sure LSU is ranked higher in most advanced stats than TCU. I agree they are not the best defense ever or anything. But their secondary is arguably the most talented in college football
 
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B1GTide

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Apr 13, 2012
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TCU's defense is actually very similar to LSU's, but with a weaker secondary. Their stats are remarkably similar with very little gap in most categories. LSU's offense is better, and as a team LSU rates out quite a bit better, but the defenses are statistically pretty close.

ETA - the one thing about LSU - they play so much better at home that they are like 2 different teams. I don't have the inclination to compare their stats home vs on the road, but their defense played above their heads against GA and Alabama.
 
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soonerknight

Suspended
Dec 14, 2018
10
0
0
I'm definitely not counting OU out. OU is essentially my 2nd team. Watch every game. Your offense with this coach makes you incredibly dangerous even without a real defense.

That said, IMO it's going to take some bounces going your way for you guys to pull off the upset in this game.

Also pretty sure LSU is ranked higher in most advanced stats than TCU. I agree they are not the best defense ever or anything. But their secondary is arguably the most talented in college football
The stats that I saw at seasons end had TCU D and ISU D ranked just below Georgia and Alabama. TCU was higher ranked than ISU not by much I believe overall Defense was #11. LSU may have a good secondary but OU is 11th in the nation with running offense and 6th with passing offense. People say oh OU their O is good but we average 28 passes a game. This is less than Alabama! We score on most othose but we run average of 35 times a game. we are not your typical spread offense. We use space to get the defenders and we hardly throw those stupid slants we used to do. OU’s efficiency on O is breaking records. Our D has broken ecords as well! LOL!
 

crimsonaudio

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ETA - the one thing about LSU - they play so much better at home that they are like 2 different teams. I don't have the inclination to compare their stats home vs on the road, but their defense played above their heads against GA and Alabama.
LSU Scoring Defense:
@ home: 13.6 ppg
road / neutral sites: 31.2 ppg

LSU Rushing Defense:
@ home: 142.00 ypg
road / neutral sites: 135.60 ypg

LSU Passing Defense:
@ home: 194.4 ypg
road / neutral sites: 224 ypg

LSU Total Defense:
@ home: 336.4 ypg
road / neutral sites: 359.6 ypg

It's amazing how much worse their scoring D numbers are considering the average ypg numbers home / away aren't that far off...
 

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