Link: D.J. Durkin Helping Behind the Scenes at Alabama

KrAzY3

Hall of Fame
Jan 18, 2006
10,617
4,542
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kraizy.art
It is amazing to me that a head coach can be fired "without cause" when a kid died under his supervision
Because the death was a fluke thing. You expose 10,000 kids to the exact same environment and 9,999 will be just fine. Yes, you want all 10,000 to live but this is the type of thing that does occasionally kill people, and it isn't like anyone involved expected it to happen. This wasn't a, "if you do this he'll die" and the head coach was like ah forget about it, I'm going to do it anyway type situation. This was a series of events that produced an unlikely outcome no one saw coming.

The guy was cleared for a reason, just because something happens "under your supervision" does not mean you were to blame. I for the record do hold him somewhat accountable, just apparently far less than some people here who have stated something like this should never, ever happen (even though people will continue to die from heat exhausting under circumstances in which no one expected it to occur).

Edit: To put it another way, a poster said something about promising to keep players safe. That's all well and good, but say a player gets in a car wreck after practice and he dies. May be he had an undiagnosed concussion or something even and that was a factor. Is Saban to blame though? Sometimes you get into these areas where yes, the coach could prevent it if he was prescient, and yes the players are under their care, but you can only control so much.
 
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ecraj

Scout Team
Jan 24, 2009
196
16
37
Florence, AL
The same way Butch Jones did.

In other words......never. Because that's not part of his job description.
I know it's not in his job description. It's called a hypothetical question that are frequently asked on this site. It's just something to think about. Thank you.
 

danb

All-SEC
Dec 4, 2011
1,088
6
0
Hazel Green, AL
So I’m guessing the early reports of him being on campus were just folks jerkin our gherkin about Durkin?


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scrodz

1st Team
Jan 29, 2008
430
60
52
Baltimore, MD
The reality - he did not get fired because this player died. He was fired because he directly delayed treatment, which led to his death. Everyone here understands the risks of heat injuries, but there was a clear failure in this program, and this death might have been prevented.
No, he was fired because of the mob's reaction to the initial decision to keep him, and the potential for negative recruiting. While he was "the man in charge", the trainers and medical staff that screwed up didn't report to him. They reported to an AAD.
 

bamabelle1991

All-American
Jan 1, 2009
4,040
179
87
South Alabama
You ever read the Junction Boy's story? Shameful!!! Should have never been allowed to coach again!!! Thankfully though for us Bama fans he was! ;) Read where he, Durkin, had also been in contact with NFL teams. The man will and should be forgiven for his negligence and indirect role for the tragic death of one of his players. He will always bare the guilt for the kids death no matter what. That will haunt him and follow him the rest of his life everywhere he goes.

I understand that is not punishment enough for some and really not sure whether there should be more or not myself, don't know much about the circumstances and environment of the team he was running. But I doubt there would be near the blow back if it had been another school besides Bama that was getting his help from him, but who knows. Call me a homer but I trust coach Saban when it comes to his program and it being run correctly and safely. He knows what advisement to take and not when it comes to assistant coaches and other advisors and I doubt Durkin will disease his program with his presence. :)


Because the death was a fluke thing. You expose 10,000 kids to the exact same environment and 9,999 will be just fine. Yes, you want all 10,000 to live but this is the type of thing that does occasionally kill people, and it isn't like anyone involved expected it to happen. This wasn't a, "if you do this he'll die" and the head coach was like ah forget about it, I'm going to do it anyway type situation. This was a series of events that produced an unlikely outcome no one saw coming.

The guy was cleared for a reason, just because something happens "under your supervision" does not mean you were to blame. I for the record do hold him somewhat accountable, just apparently far less than some people here who have stated something like this should never, ever happen (even though people will continue to die from heat exhausting under circumstances in which no one expected it to occur).

Edit: To put it another way, a poster said something about promising to keep players safe. That's all well and good, but say a player gets in a car wreck after practice and he dies. May be he had an undiagnosed concussion or something even and that was a factor. Is Saban to blame though? Sometimes you get into these areas where yes, the coach could prevent it if he was prescient, and yes the players are under their care, but you can only control so much.
No, I have no clue who Bear Bryant is or who and what the "Junction Boys" were. But, correct me if I am wrong, nobody who was part fo the Junction Boys died during the training.

As for the definition of "under supervision", a coach isn't responsible for the kids when they leave practice. You don't get a concussion because of a coaching blunder. I think he was cleared by the Board of Regents for Univ. of Maryland in order as a CYA decision. If they fired him for cause, for directly or indirectly causing Jordan McNair's death, then that opens the doors for the McNair family to OWN the University of Maryland. The Board did what they had to do.

A coach promises to keep kids safe while under his watch--practice and games. What happens when the players aren't on the clock, isn't a coaches responsibility. It's absolutely a "one in a million" type situation--I get that. I don't believe it was a "fluke" because the trainers knew what was happening and neglectfully did not render aid to him. Had he been put in the cold tub, he would more than likely have survived. A fluke accident would be getting hit in the head and blowing a blood clot, planting your foot wrong and blowing out your knee. CJ Fuller, of Clemson, died from a fluke--he had surgery and later blew a clot that killed him. He was on the training table when it happened, but that isn't the fault of the trainers--because, yes, it was a fluke. Causing a player to have a heat stroke by denying him water, noticing that he is struggling and neglecting to render aid is not a fluke. It wasn't on purpose, but it was 100% preventable and neglectful.

I understand that Durkin needs forgiveness, and that comes with time. I honestly can't imaging the daily hell he probably puts himself through with all of the "what ifs". I sincerely have empathy for him. Being a consultant to Bama's quest for another National Championship probably gives him some hope and I'm cool with that. But my opinions on his culpability stands. He bears some responsibility for what happened to Jordan McNair, regardless of what the Maryland Board of Regents said in their CYA report.
 

twofbyc

Hall of Fame
Oct 14, 2009
12,222
3,371
187
Don’t know all the details so I can’t comment - “off season” training allows limited or no direct involvement by “coaching staff”, I thought.
Regardless, head coach is captain of his “ ship” and is ultimately responsible for everyone on it, rightly or wrongly.
As a former “captain” I was responsible (but not culpable) when one of my deckhands came back on board from a bar drunk and I ordered him to his bunk, but as soon as I went to the wheelhouse to move the vessel he went back out on deck, fell of the boat and got pinned between the dock and the boat (I never knew he was in the water). Ultimately my responsibility but not my fault.
Same with this guy. What I know of the facts indicate he’s not at fault, but it was his player so his responsibility.
Have no problem with Maryland cutting him loose or CNS seeking his help.
Freeze OTOH brings up character/moral compass issues that I’m glad didn’t come to Bama.


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BamaInMo1

All-American
Oct 27, 2006
2,012
481
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Cumming, GA
No, I have no clue who Bear Bryant is or who and what the "Junction Boys" were. But, correct me if I am wrong, nobody who was part fo the Junction Boys died during the training.

As for the definition of "under supervision", a coach isn't responsible for the kids when they leave practice. You don't get a concussion because of a coaching blunder. I think he was cleared by the Board of Regents for Univ. of Maryland in order as a CYA decision. If they fired him for cause, for directly or indirectly causing Jordan McNair's death, then that opens the doors for the McNair family to OWN the University of Maryland. The Board did what they had to do.

A coach promises to keep kids safe while under his watch--practice and games. What happens when the players aren't on the clock, isn't a coaches responsibility. It's absolutely a "one in a million" type situation--I get that. I don't believe it was a "fluke" because the trainers knew what was happening and neglectfully did not render aid to him. Had he been put in the cold tub, he would more than likely have survived. A fluke accident would be getting hit in the head and blowing a blood clot, planting your foot wrong and blowing out your knee. CJ Fuller, of Clemson, died from a fluke--he had surgery and later blew a clot that killed him. He was on the training table when it happened, but that isn't the fault of the trainers--because, yes, it was a fluke. Causing a player to have a heat stroke by denying him water, noticing that he is struggling and neglecting to render aid is not a fluke. It wasn't on purpose, but it was 100% preventable and neglectful.

I understand that Durkin needs forgiveness, and that comes with time. I honestly can't imaging the daily hell he probably puts himself through with all of the "what ifs". I sincerely have empathy for him. Being a consultant to Bama's quest for another National Championship probably gives him some hope and I'm cool with that. But my opinions on his culpability stands. He bears some responsibility for what happened to Jordan McNair, regardless of what the Maryland Board of Regents said in their CYA report.
Question (not trying to be a jackwagon here):
Was Durkin there when the incident happened? Had anything like this happened formerly under his watch while he was present? Is it quite possible/plausible that the coach/coaches who were present were over zealous in trying to prove their own coaching prowess or were just over zealous in trying to toughen kids up with Durkin not present because they knew if he had been present he would not have allowed these actions to go on? Who was the medical staff who was on site reporting to? Why aren't they getting a bad wrap for not stepping in on behalf of this young man?
I don't know what all happened because I was certainly not there but seems to me that people are trying to hang this mill stone around one person's neck ( the one person involved who appears to have not even been present ) and not the people who were there and directly involved.
You get down to it further and by the logic of people throwing him under the bus the AD should be fired because he is ultimately in charge of the football program and in charge of hiring Durkin to begin with.
A young man died. That is tragic. People on sight did not do their jobs (especially training staff and any medical staff) and of this there can be no doubt. While I agree with him being responsible for the players you can't hold him responsible for the death unless you can prove he actually gave instructions to his staff to handle practice/practices in this manner and if you can prove that then the AD and university President need to go as well because if this were not an isolated incident they should have known and stepped in.
 

rgw

Suspended
Sep 15, 2003
20,852
1,351
232
Tuscaloosa
I'm going off what I remember but I think Durkin was present for the incident and at any rate he's the CEO for the operation so he has to own something like a player death.
 

BamaInMo1

All-American
Oct 27, 2006
2,012
481
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Cumming, GA
I'm going off what I remember but I think Durkin was present for the incident and at any rate he's the CEO for the operation so he has to own something like a player death.
Don't necessarily disagree that he has some responsibility but others do as well and no one seems to want to speak about that.
 

Bama-94-00

All-American
Nov 1, 2004
3,201
45
67
Huntsville/Madison, AL area
Question (not trying to be a jackwagon here):
Was Durkin there when the incident happened? Had anything like this happened formerly under his watch while he was present? Is it quite possible/plausible that the coach/coaches who were present were over zealous in trying to prove their own coaching prowess or were just over zealous in trying to toughen kids up with Durkin not present because they knew if he had been present he would not have allowed these actions to go on? Who was the medical staff who was on site reporting to? Why aren't they getting a bad wrap for not stepping in on behalf of this young man?
...
He should not have be there since it was off season (in late May as I recall). The strength & conditioning coaches and staff run off season conditioning/training. Football coaches can only do on the field work during spring practice and in-season practices. The FB coaches may have come on the scene when the session was stopped after the player collapsed.
 

rgw

Suspended
Sep 15, 2003
20,852
1,351
232
Tuscaloosa
Don't necessarily disagree that he has some responsibility but others do as well and no one seems to want to speak about that.
Nobody knows who they are so he's the totem for focusing all disgust for this incident. If this happened here, nobody would be talking about Scott Cochran. It would all be about Nick Saban. That is just the way it is.
 

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