US pulling out of Syria - Page 2
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  1. #14
    BamaNation First Team Its On A Slab's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by GrayTide View Post
    I always though hindsight was 50/50.
    "Revenge is best served with cold cuts." - Tony Soprano

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  3. #15
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Displaced Bama Fan's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Its On A Slab View Post
    The worst mistake we've ever made was in thinking some cultures are ready for liberal democracy.

    I can remember this place getting giddy during the Arab Spring. While there is still hope for places like Tunisia(maybe), by and large, all that occurred by throwing out the neo-fascist pan-Arabists....was to bring in an invasion of ISIS, Islamist, anti-democratic forces, all with the full support of the gangsters in charge in Moscow.

    Assad is a murderous thug, as has his family been for generations. But a benign one at that. I.e., he enslaves, impoverishes, and abuses Syrians, but rarely causes trouble outside his country's borders. (Numerous incursions with Israel put an end to that).

    Hindsight is always 20/20. I'm sure Ronald Reagan would have loved to have taken out Quaddafi. He pretty much tried with those F-111 bombing runs. And taking out Saddam didn't do anything more than create a different set of problems for the US. Iran had been wanting Saddam gone for decades, and we did their job for him without them firing a shot.

    Had Obama ordered a unilateral pullout from Syria, heads would have exploded in right-wing circles. Yet, Trump made this decision with hardly a voice raised. Oh yeah, Aunt Pitty Pat clutched his pearls yesterday, but he will fall back in line like the rest of them.
    Obama ordered us into Syria to begin with. We had no reason to be there but hey...he "promised" to get us out of Afghanistan and Iraq too, but we're still there. But you're right, we created power vacuums that can't be filled now without our intervention.

    As for Assad, I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't think he's the murderous thug. His brother, who runs the Republican Guard, on the other hand, is bat [crap] crazy. The Assad in "power" never wanted the gig. He's an Ophthalmologist by training and wanted to live in London. When his brother wrapped his car around the light post, the elder Assad called him home thinking he would probably be better than the younger crazier than hell brother. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked out.
    Last edited by crimsonaudio; December 20th, 2018 at 12:05 PM. Reason: you know the policies - we're a bit more lax over here but don't push the boundaries...

  4. #16
    BamaNation Hall of Fame MattinBama's Avatar
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  5. #17
    BamaNation First Team Its On A Slab's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Displaced Bama Fan View Post
    Obama ordered us into Syria to begin with. We had no reason to be there but hey...he "promised" to get us out of Afghanistan and Iraq too, but we're still there. But you're right, we created power vacuums that can't be filled now without our intervention.

    As for Assad, I've said it before and I'll say it again, I don't think he's the murderous thug. His brother, who runs the Republican Guard, on the other hand, is bat [crap] crazy. The Assad in "power" never wanted the gig. He's an Ophthalmologist by training and wanted to live in London. When his brother wrapped his car around the light post, the elder Assad called him home thinking he would probably be better than the younger crazier than hell brother. Unfortunately, it hasn't worked out.
    So, you're saying that Bashir Assad is the Michael Corleone of the Assad crime family. The hand-picked successor gets killed, and he gets pulled into the family business.

    He may have wanted that life as a docile, London opthalmologist, but the power and money was too great.

    He may be a nicer, more polished thug than Saddam, but he's still a thug.

  6. #18
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Tidewater's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Its On A Slab View Post
    So, you're saying that Bashir Assad is the Michael Corleone of the Assad crime family. The hand-picked successor gets killed, and he gets pulled into the family business.

    He may have wanted that life as a docile, London opthalmologist, but the power and money was too great.
    I do not think Bashar was given a choice.

  7. #19
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Displaced Bama Fan's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Tidewater View Post
    I do not think Bashar was given a choice.
    "You take over the family business or your crazy brother Maher takes over and murders your kids, rapes your wife and sells her to a roving band of sheep herders."

    So he took over the business.

  8. #20
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Displaced Bama Fan's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Quote Originally Posted by Its On A Slab View Post
    So, you're saying that Bashir Assad is the Michael Corleone of the Assad crime family. The hand-picked successor gets killed, and he gets pulled into the family business.

    He may have wanted that life as a docile, London opthalmologist, but the power and money was too great.

    He may be a nicer, more polished thug than Saddam, but he's still a thug.
    His dad was Hafez, btw.

    Saddam was in the "other" country where of course, both of his boys were bat "crap" crazy...I remember reading one story about one of the sons beating the national soccer team on the soles of their feet for losing a match.

  9. #21
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Tidewater's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Time to pull out one's Clausewitz and ponder a bit.
    For me, the question goes back to "What are the U.S. interests in Syria, and how vital are they?"
    Some interests are more vital than others (maintaining constitutional order, protecting the territorial integrity of the U.S. are ones you obviously go to the mat over. Other interests are not so vital (e.g. protecting the U.S.-Argentina trade relationship).
    Clausewtiz said that the intensity of the interest is proportional to the amount of effort a country expends defending it. If Argentina declared it was outlawing trade with the United States, the U.S. would probably not go to war over that. If Mexico announced it was taking California back, the U.S. would go to war to prevent this.
    I always thought that Obama got the effort level in Syria about right. Daesh is a bunch of scary murdering buttholes deserving of as much death as the U.S. wanted to deal out, but they are not an existential threat to the U.S.
    Insurgencies never have a surrender ceremony on the deck of the USS Missouri. Generally, they just peter out. So, if the U.S. policy is to attrit Daesh down to the level where they do not threaten the U.S. or its allies, then maybe we are about at that point. If the U.S. policy is to aid the most democratic faction in winning the war against Assad, then we are going to need a lot more forces and a lot more will. Neither seem available. Maybe we can settle for helping the anti-Assad Kurds maintain their enclave.
    Do the Iranians benefit from this? Probably. Do the Russians benefit from this, sure. That in and of itself is no reason to continue to expend blood and treasure in a policy that contains no viable theory of victory.
    The bigger issue for me is the loss of the services of Saint Mattis of Quantico, which seems to be related to this policy announcement.

    That really does bother me.

  10. #22
    BamaNation Hall of Fame BamaJama17's Avatar
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    Re: US pulling out of Syria

    Can we just reunite the Ottoman Empire already for the sake of stability??? **partial blue font**

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