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  1. #53
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 81usaf92's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by BamaJama17 View Post
    Scott Frost is their “Golden Boy” and “Hometown hero” and their last QB to lead them to an undefeated and national championship season. Why would they not give him more time?? IE see Jim Harbaugh. I’m sure Tom Osborne has his back 100%. I’m sure Frost can handle the “Mafia” better than any outsider could.
    You are also talking about a program that ran away two very good coaches because they couldn’t get along with the BOT and fan expectations. Frost has about 4 years of clean up to deal with to right the ship to get on an even playing field with Wisconsin, and not to mention being competitive with the monsters in the east. Take it from someone who has lived there and isn’t looking at this from afar. These Nebraska fans think like Alabama fans when they should be thinking like Mississippi St fans in terms of expectations. They will turn on Frost once they are reminded of their place in the world. Nebraska is a 10+ year project in terms of championship potential not a less than 4 year project. It’s like Alabama baseball.

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    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by BamaJama17 View Post
    Scott Frost is their “Golden Boy” and “Hometown hero” and their last QB to lead them to an undefeated and national championship season. Why would they not give him more time?? IE see Jim Harbaugh. I’m sure Tom Osborne has his back 100%. I’m sure Frost can handle the “Mafia” better than any outsider could.
    Two words: Frank Solich
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    Two words: Frank Solich
    Ok yes but he was also unfortunate enough to succeed a coach who won 3/4 NC’s who succeeded a coach that made Nebraska (for that time) a national power. Frost came into a program that has now had 14 seasons of mostly bad teams with a few good here and there.

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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by 81usaf92 View Post
    You are also talking about a program that ran away two very good coaches because they couldn’t get along with the BOT and fan expectations. Frost has about 4 years of clean up to deal with to right the ship to get on an even playing field with Wisconsin, and not to mention being competitive with the monsters in the east. Take it from someone who has lived there and isn’t looking at this from afar. These Nebraska fans think like Alabama fans when they should be thinking like Mississippi St fans in terms of expectations. They will turn on Frost once they are reminded of their place in the world. Nebraska is a 10+ year project in terms of championship potential not a less than 4 year project. It’s like Alabama baseball.
    Well for his sake he better hope those connections he has in Florida still hold up. You really shouldn’t have any problem getting players to come to Lincoln. If West Virginia and Louisville can get good players then so can Nebraska.

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    BamaNation Hall of Fame 81usaf92's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by BamaJama17 View Post
    Well for his sake he better hope those connections he has in Florida still hold up. You really shouldn’t have any problem getting players to come to Lincoln. If West Virginia and Louisville can get good players then so can Nebraska.
    The problem is that Nebraska lived off Missouri and Colorado recruits for years, but they have lost those pipelines probably forever. Basically their core recruits are Nebraska-iowa recruits now.

  6. #58
    Big-12 All American owenfieldreams's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by 81usaf92 View Post
    The problem is that Nebraska lived off Missouri and Colorado recruits for years, but they have lost those pipelines probably forever. Basically their core recruits are Nebraska-iowa recruits now.
    When they left the Big 12 they lost their Texas recruiting & that as much as anything hurt the program. They used to recruit Calif. N.J., and FLA. a lot too but no longer.

  7. #59
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    I know I've beat this to death but.......look at a map.


    Nebraska used to OWN:

    all the way from the middle of Kansas to the Canadian border
    west to Boise, Idaho
    east to St Louis


    and pick off Dallas and Florida recruits.


    What happened?

    N Dakota St became an FCS dynasty (they were already a Division 2 dynasty)
    Kansas St got good
    Kansas had years they were okay
    Missouri got good
    Colorado got good
    TV shows every game so a kid who might go to Nebraska has as much a chance at the NFL at UNT (here in Denton, TX) or TCU as he does at Nebraska
    And no kid nowadays is going to live in the frozen corn crib for four years
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    Big-12 All American owenfieldreams's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    I have a theory about the pattern of HC selections at major programs. It seems to me that when a legend or iconic coach is being replaced there is a set of predictable outcomes that become false steps to mediocrity until the right choice is made. Generally, these bad decisions form a pattern, not necessarily in the same order at different schools but from the same list of options. In OU's case these options can be categorized as follows: the loyal assistant; a former player recommended based on friendship; a big name with gravitas; an assistant from either inside or outside the family. Most of these never pan out and it takes repeated mistakes before a cooler more shrewd head prevails in the selection process. These false steps usually play out over a decade or so before the messiah emerges. Selecting the right HC is at best an inexact science. Interestingly, the 4 most successful coaches at OU have all been hired as assistants with no previous HC experience. Our '90's were a poster child for such missteps. Except for Stallings, your '90's into the 2000's were similar. Texas made mistake after mistake between Royal and Brown. Nebraska...I could go on and on. Look at Michigan. Look at USC.

  9. #61
    BamaNation Hall of Fame bamaga's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    I listened to some clowns here in Atlanta on 92.9 the game talking about some site, maybe sporting news.com that ranked all FBS coaches. They had Saban ranked #1. The clowns were talking that Dabo has passed Nick because of last year. If I wasn’t driving, I would of called and reminded them that Bama blasted Clemson the year before. To support their argument, they not only mentioned last year, but also the coaching turmoil at Bama, Nicks age vs Dabo’s age and Clemson’s monster 2020 recruiting class . I guess that class has already signed and is a done deal , smh!
    Last edited by bamaga; May 13th, 2019 at 07:19 PM.
    to 16 and beyond........

  10. #62
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by owenfieldreams View Post
    I have a theory about the pattern of HC selections at major programs. It seems to me that when a legend or iconic coach is being replaced there is a set of predictable outcomes that become false steps to mediocrity until the right choice is made. Generally, these bad decisions form a pattern, not necessarily in the same order at different schools but from the same list of options.
    I tend to agree with this. Choosing the replacement is a lot like the NFL Draft. A guy may look fantastic and not pan out.


    Quote Originally Posted by owenfieldreams View Post
    In OU's case these options can be categorized as follows: the loyal assistant; a former player recommended based on friendship; a big name with gravitas; an assistant from either inside or outside the family. Most of these never pan out and it takes repeated mistakes before a cooler more shrewd head prevails in the selection process. These false steps usually play out over a decade or so before the messiah emerges. Selecting the right HC is at best an inexact science.
    I suspect - and you're closer to OU than any of us, so you'd have more knowledge of the situation - some rich powers that be get behind a name (like whoever sold Jerry Jones on Bill Parcells or whoever sells anyone on Jon Gruden) and confirmation bias kicks in.



    Quote Originally Posted by owenfieldreams View Post
    Interestingly, the 4 most successful coaches at OU have all been hired as assistants with no previous HC experience. Our '90's were a poster child for such missteps.
    While in no way do I wish to take issue with your or disagree, OU doesn't seem to have much of a track record of hiring ANYONE as head coach who was ever head coach before.

    Here are the coaches Oklahoma has hired who had previous FBS/Division I HEAD coaching experience:
    Biff Jones (7 years total at Army and LSU)
    Jim Tatum (1 year at UNC)
    Howard Schnellenberger (national title at Miami)


    I'm not trying to pick apart your comments because they're correct as stated - but OU doesn't seem to hire anyone who has ever coached at another school as a head coach regardless. Schnellenberger's national title has to go down as a fluke anyway, although he deserves credit for laying the foundation that Jimmy Johnson used to convince folks he was a better coach than he really was.


    Quote Originally Posted by owenfieldreams View Post
    Except for Stallings, your '90's into the 2000's were similar.
    For the most part, yes.

    Perkins - so far as anyone can tell - was Bryant's hand-picked choice (although saying that now creates a lot of people who claim to have inside information that Coach This Other Guy was really the pick). He got a lot of credit basically because of the draft that gave him Lawrence Taylor and the trade that gave him Rob Carpenter turned the Giants into an NFL playoff team.

    Curry - nobody not named Joab Thomas wanted this guy as head coach. He was a disaster top to bottom, and the fact we could have had Bobby Bowden is still a sore spot with this entire board.

    Dubious - I have no idea who was behind this insanity, but he needs to be shot.


    Now.....the Franchione hire was a tiny bit different and probably minimally similar to OU's hiring of Blake. By the time we chose Franchione, we'd been turned down by Butch Davis (more on that in a moment) and Frank Beamer, and Tommy Bowden and Jackie Sherrill (neither with a prayer at getting it) both called PCs to announce they weren't going to Alabama. While this coaching search was going on, the Albert Means scandal hit the front page of the papers and made the hiring that much harder.

    As far as Davis - he built the Miami monster that Larry Coker blew to pieces, but there has long been a story that Davis had consented to come to Alabama to the point of a behind-the-door handshake deal.........and was then informed of what the NCAA had on us and backed out. I'm not in the position to know but.......once your job starts getting turned down repeatedly and it gets out, it limits the pool from where you can draw fish. Fran as it turned out had built his entire career on winning with OTHER coach's players - he'd never been anywhere long enough to recruit and see it through.

    Despite what some here think, Shula was NOT a guy who "took the job when nobody else would."


    But that is why I've long said Alabama CANNOT be a school that hires a coach with ZERO college head coaching experience. That doesn't guarantee success, but it does play a role in a guy knowing what will and will not work when it comes to kids that age. For every Mark Richt or even Lincoln Riley, there are a dozen Mike DuBoses.

    When Stallings came to Alabama, he had not been a head coach in college for over two decades, during which many changes occurred. However, he HAD been a head football coach in college, he had the advantage of having been in the Alabama culture (7 years as an assistant) which is admittedly a bit unique, and he had worked for the worst owner in the NFL, which meant anything he dealt with on campus was going to be blissful by comparison.

    Who has been successful at Alabama?
    Bryant - three colleges before he came
    Stallings - one head coaching job in the NFL and one in college
    Saban - years as a head coach at both NFL and college


    Wallace Wade never had head coaching experience before Alabama, but let's at least acknowledge that the 20s was a century ago and things have changed dramatically since then. Even Steve Spurrier had several years screwing up and learning what wouldn't work in both the USFL (which was basically glorified college ball) and at Duke before he became a Florida coaching legend.


    OU has found what works for them, and that's great.
    Alabama has done the same - and ironically, it's the opposite of what works at OU.

    Both our schools have done a BUNCH to screw up hiring. I'll admit that. And both have done a good job at times as well.







    Texas made mistake after mistake between Royal and Brown. Nebraska...I could go on and on. Look at Michigan. Look at USC.[/QUOTE]
    My New Year's resolution for 2019 is this year I'm not going to drink anymore. I'm not going to drink any less, either.

    I was married for 25 years, but if I'd killed her on the honeymoon, I'd have been out in less than 20.

    Butch Jones has richly earned his title, The Archbishop of Talentbury

    After reading all the horrible things drinking will do to you....I gave up reading.

  11. #63
    BamaNation Hall of Fame selmaborntidefan's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by bamaga View Post
    I listened to some clowns here in Atlanta on 92.9 the game talking about some site, maybe sporting news.com that ranked all FBS coaches. They had Saban ranked #1. They clowns were talking that Dabo has passed Nick because of last year. If I wasn’t driving, I would of called and reminded them that Bama blasted Clemson the year before. To support their argument, they not only mentioned last year, but also the coaching turmoil at Bama, Nicks age vs Dabo’s age and Clemson’s monster 2020 recruiting class . I guess that class has already signed and is a done deal , smh!
    An argument could be made in Dabo's favor for RECENT history - yes. Let's admit that.

    He's 2-2 against Saban, but he lost one close game AND he's 2-0 against Urban Meyer.
    He also beat Bob Stoops pretty handily twice.
    He also beat Jimbo Fisher the least 3 times they met.

    If we're talking total career vs total career, it's not even close.

    If we are talking RIGHT NOW and recent since Dabo built his monster? A rational person CAN make that argument.

    I don't agree with that argument because I think Dabo benefits from playing in the modern version of the WAC.

    During the virtual same time frame we're talking about (2015-18), Dabo has lost twice to unranked opponents.
    Saban has not.

    At this point, Dabo's success can be attributed to the defense he's now losing.
    Let's see what he does NOW.

    Because what cost Alabama national championships in 2013 and 2016, in particular, were INJURIES and LACK OF DEPTH due to so many guys going to the NFL.
    My New Year's resolution for 2019 is this year I'm not going to drink anymore. I'm not going to drink any less, either.

    I was married for 25 years, but if I'd killed her on the honeymoon, I'd have been out in less than 20.

    Butch Jones has richly earned his title, The Archbishop of Talentbury

    After reading all the horrible things drinking will do to you....I gave up reading.

  12. #64
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    An argument could be made in Dabo's favor for RECENT history - yes. Let's admit that.

    He's 2-2 against Saban, but he lost one close game AND he's 2-0 against Urban Meyer.
    He also beat Bob Stoops pretty handily twice.
    He also beat Jimbo Fisher the least 3 times they met.

    If we're talking total career vs total career, it's not even close.

    If we are talking RIGHT NOW and recent since Dabo built his monster? A rational person CAN make that argument.

    I don't agree with that argument because I think Dabo benefits from playing in the modern version of the WAC.

    During the virtual same time frame we're talking about (2015-18), Dabo has lost twice to unranked opponents.
    Saban has not.

    At this point, Dabo's success can be attributed to the defense he's now losing.
    Let's see what he does NOW.

    Because what cost Alabama national championships in 2013 and 2016, in particular, were INJURIES and LACK OF DEPTH due to so many guys going to the NFL.

    I dont see how Dabo can be compared to Saban yet. Saban has a lot of history, and Dabo has a long ways to go. He is probably not even worried about being remembered as better than Saban right now. He just wants to beat Saban. I believe an argument could be made for the coaching staff of Clemson being on par or better than Bama right now. Bama has had a lot of changes.

  13. #65
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 81usaf92's Avatar
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    Re: What's your top 10 list of active college football coaches?

    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post

    Despite what some here think, Shula was NOT a guy who "took the job when nobody else would."



    .
    Its kinda hard to say that he took a job that no one wanted when Croom and Coughlin both expressed interest. I think its one of those many nostalgic fantasies that many come up with to justify why someone couldn't live up to a certain standard.


    Quote Originally Posted by selmaborntidefan View Post
    Texas made mistake after mistake between Royal and Brown. Nebraska...I could go on and on. Look at Michigan. Look at USC.
    Its what happens when bluebloods play the good ole boy system.
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