St Thomas being kicked out of MIAC for being too good

Marg

1st Team
Mar 24, 2003
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This is just hard to believe...

St. Thomas has an enrollment about twice the size of the next largest school in the MIAC and is one of just two league members with at least 100 players on the football team, according to Pat Borzi of MinnPost. Add in the fact that in 2017 the Tommies’ conference results included an 84–0 rout of Hamline and a 97–0 thrashing of St. Olaf, and it starts to make sense why other schools wanted them gone.

St. Thomas only started dominating football after current coach Glenn Caruso arrived in 2008, but the school has begun to dominate most other sports, too. Since the 2013–14 school year, St. Thomas has 72 MIAC titles across all sports; the next closest league member has 16.
https://www.si.com/college-football/2019/05/22/st-thomas-removed-miac-competitive-parity-division-iii
 

Pilot172000

1st Team
Sep 25, 2017
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Winnsboro, LA
If I was St. Thomas, I would be suing the heck out of the MIAC for damages. I know its just DIII but how much money did St. Thomas bring into the conference that they are entitled to? Either way I would work to find an amicable solution that is less embarrassing.
 

DzynKingRTR

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Dec 17, 2003
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It's not necessarily just football here. They dominate every other sport in the conference as well. From a competitive balance standpoint on sports across the board, it seems they've outgrown the conference.
It seems their conference just stinks because they do not have a lot of national championships in sports (except for the dance team).
 

AUDub

Hall of Fame
Dec 4, 2013
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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
It seems their conference just stinks because they do not have a lot of national championships in sports (except for the dance team).
Don't forget that this is D3 we're talking about here. Conference priorities are very different, as they should be in a non-scholarship conference mostly comprised of small liberal arts schools. St Thomas being 3x the size of other schools and focusing on athletics is the opposite of what the MIAC wants, which is very low level athletics.
 

Bamabuzzard

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Aug 15, 2004
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Don't forget that this is D3 we're talking about here. Conference priorities are very different, as they should be in a non-scholarship conference mostly comprised of small liberal arts schools. St Thomas being 3x the size of other schools and focusing on athletics is the opposite of what the MIAC wants, which is very low level athletics.
Is there something in the bylaws (<---not sure if that's the right term) quantifying when a school is in violation of what the "conference wants"?
 

AUDub

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Is there something in the bylaws (<---not sure if that's the right term) quantifying when a school is in violation of what the "conference wants"?
Nope. But in the end, conferences are just teams who want to play together. If enough teams don't want you, then there you have it. Remember, this is D3.

And let's face it, you can hardly blame the conference at large here. St Thomas is basically clubbing baby seals in every sport in a conference they don't belong in. They're a competitive team loading up the trophy case in what is essentially the rec division.
 

B1GTide

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Apr 13, 2012
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They were one of the 5 founding schools of this conference 45 years ago. They improved while the other schools fell behind, so they get voted off the island. Typical today.
 

AUDub

Hall of Fame
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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
They were one of the 5 founding schools of this conference 45 years ago. They improved while the other schools fell behind, so they get voted off the island. Typical today.
Again, this is D3. The whole point of D3 was to create a place for schools who want to compete without being goaded into an athletics arms race. They chose to focus on athletics recently. If they want to play at a higher level, cool, their call, find a conference where that’s acceptable. Let’s not pretend these other schools taking issue with it are in the wrong as they get slaughtered year after year.

It's the MIAC, not D1, those other schools want to play similar schools and they want their students to have a chance.
 

B1GTide

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Agree to disagree. The other schools are wrong. There would be no conference without St. Thomas. It would never have existed.
 

AUDub

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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Agree to disagree. The other schools are wrong. There would be no conference without St. Thomas. It would never have existed.
The MIAC is all academic schools. They build new academic buildings, not new sports facilities. And St Thomas just recently decided to pour money into athletics as well. They outgrew the conference. They spend money like they want to be a sports school, which is fine, but not a fit for the MIAC.
 

B1GTide

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Apr 13, 2012
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The MIAC is all academic schools. They build new academic buildings, not new sports facilities. And St Thomas just recently decided to pour money into athletics as well. They outgrew the conference. They spend money like they want to be a sports school, which is fine, but not a fit for the MIAC.
Doesn't change anything. The conference does not exist without them. I would argue that this can't possibly be about education as St Thomas meets or exceeds all academic requirements for the conference. This is all about wins and losses. They can't beat them so they get rid of them.
 

AUDub

Hall of Fame
Dec 4, 2013
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Give me ambiguity or give me something else.
Doesn't change anything. The conference does not exist without them.
Bold statement. Maybe the conference wouldn’t exist in its current form, but just because they were a founding member doesn’t necessarily make that true.

I would argue that this can't possibly be about education as St Thomas meets or exceeds all academic requirements for the conference.This is all about wins and losses. They can't beat them so they get rid of them.
It’s about parity.

When setting up a small, regional football conference for D3 schools, the conference is almost certainly more about competitive balance and good competition than trying to build a powerhouse athletic conference. The fact of the matter is that St Thomas has more money to pump into things like facilities and training programs, and the competitive balance and good competition are gone. This isn't the Big Ten or SEC, and it's not the conference's or other team's fault that St Thomas has the money and talent to grow out of that conference. The conference just wants to provide a fun football environment for student athletes that want to play (with no promise of reward or an NFL future) and the fact of the matter is that St Thomas doesn't allow that anymore. They’re spending money and focusing on athletics like a D1 school. Let them go compete with someone more on their level, rather than slaughtering lambs to fill the trophy case.
 
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