Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt - Page 3
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  1. #27
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by Bamabuzzard View Post
    I tell you what needs to be supported more by our society, if for nothing more than to curb ever rising cost of the services to the consumer, and that's trade schools. I'm not sure if anyone has had to pay for a plumber, A/C technician, etc. But they can basically charge what they want now days. I've got several friends in the plumbing and heating/air conditioning business and they say all the time. There's simply not enough people entering the field to properly service the demand. Which leads to an increase in wages for those in it, but it also means an overload of work for them to. The buddy in the A/C business said he was still at work installing an a/c at 8:45 the other night.
    Preach it, bro!!
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  2. #28
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by Go Bama View Post
    Sorry, DK. I picked one off the top of my head.

    I have a deceased friend who majored in forestry at UTK. He worked in a seed store the rest of his life.

    I have an employee who owes $50,000. It was money invested for a job which doesn’t earn enough to pay the loan back.

    I have a patient with an MBA who left his job managing a Dollar Store to be a liquor store clerk. Our church financial secretary has an MBA and makes $11 an hour working three days a week.

    I could site numerous people who have student debt, a degree, and a low income or no job. Many of these are highly intelligent people.
    I'm truly sorry your friends invested in education that didn't pay off monetarily.

    But I fail to see how that's my problem.

    I buy a stock, and it goes down, it's my problem.

    I buy a house, the neighborhood goes to the toilet, it's my problem.

    I buy a business, I pay too much or run it into the ground, it's my problem.

    I buy a lemon car, finance it for 72 easy monthly payments, and it's both worthless and inoperable 2 years later, yet I still owe 48 payments, and it's my problem.

    But if I buy education, and it doesn't pay off, all of you guys have to bail me out?

    I hear lots of long sad stories, and, "How would you feel if...." But I don't hear a competing logical position. Is there one out there?
    Last edited by 4Q Basket Case; July 24th, 2019 at 08:35 PM.
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  3. #29
    BamaNation Hall of Fame jthomas666's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by 4Q Basket Case View Post
    I'm truly sorry your friends invested in education that didn't pay off monetarily.

    But I fail to see how that's my problem.

    I buy a stock, and it goes down, it's my problem.

    I buy a house, the neighborhood goes to the toilet, it's my problem.

    I buy a business, I pay too much or run it into the ground, it's my problem.

    I buy a lemon car, finance it for 72 easy monthly payments, and it's both worthless and inoperable 2 years later, yet I still owe 48 payments, and it's my problem.

    But if I buy education, and it doesn't pay off, all of you guys have to bail me out?

    I hear lots of long sad stories, and, "How would you feel if...." But I don't hear a competing logical position. Is there one out there?
    The competing issue is that the sheer number of people in problematic student loan situations has become a drag on the economy--millennials are having to spend so much of their income on their student loan debt that they cannot do the usual things that keep the economy going, such as buying property, and all that fun stuff.

    I get the reluctance some may have at the idea of loan forgiveness, but some sort of relief helps the economy, not just individuals. And frankly, I'm gratified/delighted that there have been a lot of different ideas floated in this thread.
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  4. #30
    Senior Administrator TIDE-HSV's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by jthomas666 View Post
    The competing issue is that the sheer number of people in problematic student loan situations has become a drag on the economy--millennials are having to spend so much of their income on their student loan debt that they cannot do the usual things that keep the economy going, such as buying property, and all that fun stuff.

    I get the reluctance some may have at the idea of loan forgiveness, but some sort of relief helps the economy, not just individuals. And frankly, I'm gratified/delighted that there have been a lot of different ideas floated in this thread.
    You are correct. Student loans are only second to house mortgages, outstripping credit card debt. It amounted to 1.3 trillion, last I looked. Unfortunately, a lot of it is excessive interest rate-based and a lot of it is predatory, as in the companies Secretary De Vos is involved in. It needs to be reformed and the country needs to invest in trade schools, while we have some industry remaining...
    "The cure for boredom is curiosity. There is no cure for curiosity. - Ellen Parr"

    'If today were the last day of my life, would I want to do what I am about to do today?' - Steve Jobs

    I would rather live my life as if there is a god and die to find out there isn't, than live my life as if there isn't and die to find out there is. Albert Camus

    "When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." - Sinclair Lewis

  5. #31
    BamaNation Hall of Fame Go Bama's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by 4Q Basket Case View Post
    I'm truly sorry your friends invested in education that didn't pay off monetarily.

    But I fail to see how that's my problem.

    I buy a stock, and it goes down, it's my problem.

    I buy a house, the neighborhood goes to the toilet, it's my problem.

    I buy a business, I pay too much or run it into the ground, it's my problem.

    I buy a lemon car, finance it for 72 easy monthly payments, and it's both worthless and inoperable 2 years later, yet I still owe 48 payments, and it's my problem.

    But if I buy education, and it doesn't pay off, all of you guys have to bail me out?

    I hear lots of long sad stories, and, "How would you feel if...." But I don't hear a competing logical position. Is there one out there?
    Are you under the impression I was hoping for the student loans to be vanquished? I was just suggesting the interest be removed.

  6. #32
    BamaNation Hall of Fame jthomas666's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by TIDE-HSV View Post
    You are correct. Student loans are only second to house mortgages, outstripping credit card debt. It amounted to 1.3 trillion, last I looked. Unfortunately, a lot of it is excessive interest rate-based and a lot of it is predatory, as in the companies Secretary De Vos is involved in. It needs to be reformed and the country needs to invest in trade schools, while we have some industry remaining...
    Yeah--one of my BILs owns his own welding company. He's pulling in more than my wife and me combined.
    This is the darkest timeline.

  7. #33
    BamaNation Hall of Fame CharminTide's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    I agree that any student debt relief without reform addressing the cost of education is like putting a band-aid on a gunshot wound. I hope that this gets asked at one of the Dem debates, but I wouldn't expect it next week. Given that Trump hires people like DeVos who personally profit from student loan debt, it's clear that a solution to this problem can only come from one party, and they need to be pressed on it. Unfortunately, that kind of fiscal restraint is probably more suited to the general election rather than a primary.

    It's appalling that the government charges me 7% interest on my student loans. My mortgage is 3.5%. Education is probably the most cost-effective investment we can make, and I agree that interest should be waived on these loans. IMO the role of good government is to help citizens better themselves through schooling, not to profit off the poor and middle class families who can't afford tuition on their own.

  8. #34
    BamaNation Hall of Fame BamaFlum's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Based on this thread, what I could stand behind would be a greatly reduced interest rate type forgiveness so people could more effectively pay off the principle; however, just waiving a magic wand and making student debt disappear is wrong on many levels.


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  9. #35
    FB Moderator Bamabuzzard's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by BamaFlum View Post
    Based on this thread, what I could stand behind would be a greatly reduced interest rate type forgiveness so people could more effectively pay off the principle; however, just waiving a magic wand and making student debt disappear is wrong on many levels.


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    Agreed. I also think any governmental backed educational loan needs to go through a lot of scrutiny before being issued to a prospective student. I like the idea of giving some level of scrutiny to the degree or field of employment they are seeking. I have no problem with private companies issuing student loans for whatever interest rate and terms they can get on the open market. But anything affiliated with the government/taxpayer funds. I would be on board with favorable low or no interest loans with the understanding that the government isn't going to hand out loans like candy on Halloween for degrees that do not have an active/"employable" presence in society.
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  10. #36
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by Bamabuzzard View Post
    Agreed. I also think any governmental backed educational loan needs to go through a lot of scrutiny before being issued to a prospective student. I like the idea of giving some level of scrutiny to the degree or field of employment they are seeking. I have no problem with private companies issuing student loans for whatever interest rate and terms they can get on the open market. But anything affiliated with the government/taxpayer funds. I would be on board with favorable low or no interest loans with the understanding that the government isn't going to hand out loans like candy on Halloween for degrees that do not have an active/"employable" presence in society.
    I could agree with this idea but it realllly depends on the specifics. I can see a situation where this would cause a lot of unintended consequences. For example, Teachers in some states net out less than $20k. Wouldn't it be a bad investment to give them a loan? But at the same time we need MORE well educated teachers not fewer.

  11. #37
    FB Moderator Bamabuzzard's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by RollTide_HTTR View Post
    I could agree with this idea but it realllly depends on the specifics. I can see a situation where this would cause a lot of unintended consequences. For example, Teachers in some states net out less than $20k. Wouldn't it be a bad investment to give them a loan? But at the same time we need MORE well educated teachers not fewer.
    Being a teacher is a very "employable" field. But loaning someone $50,000-$100,000 for a general "music degree" (extraordinarily broad) would be a no go. Had a neighbor years ago whose daughter majored in "Music" and ended up working at a "Sound Gallery" that sold audio equipment. The degree was worthless on the open market from the get go. Yet she was strapped with student loans out the wazzoo, with mama and daddy having to help.
    The existence of God isn't determined in the thoughts of man. God exists, no matter what man thinks.

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  12. #38
    BamaNation Hall of Fame 92tide's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by Bamabuzzard View Post
    Being a teacher is a very "employable" field. But loaning someone $50,000-$100,000 for a general "music degree" (extraordinarily broad) would be a no go. Had a neighbor years ago whose daughter majored in "Music" and ended up working at a "Sound Gallery" that sold audio equipment. The degree was worthless on the open market from the get go. Yet she was strapped with student loans out the wazzoo, with mama and daddy having to help.
    i know several folks with degrees in music who are gainfully employed and some who are doing quite well.
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  13. #39
    FB Moderator Bamabuzzard's Avatar
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    Re: Sen Elizabeth Warren introduces bill to eliminate college loan debt

    Quote Originally Posted by 92tide View Post
    i know several folks with degrees in music who are gainfully employed and some who are doing quite well.
    I'd be interested to know if the music degree they have is a general music degree/much like a general studies degree or more specialized and was the degree required for the job? Either way, this is something that would have to be addressed with any type of reform in governmental educational loans. The "line" would have to be drawn somewhere and there would be those who would not qualify, even though someone could point to several examples and say "You see, that person found a job." Someone mentioned interior designing. Which is another one of those jobs that even though we could find examples of people who found gainful employment in that field, is the rate of "employability" (I don't even know if that's a word) of someone with an interior design degree/certification stable enough to justify a government backed loan?
    Last edited by Bamabuzzard; July 25th, 2019 at 10:26 AM.
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