Question: Will the short passing game make the running game less important this year?

ChattTide

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I don't think it's time to panic as the sample size is too small. I know we want an O-line like 2012 and RB's like Ingram and Richardson, but we have what we have right now and that is sufficient. I believe the biggest problem last week was the mere fact the O-line was continuously being shuffled. I'm no expert by any means, but I did grow up in Alabama where you could not move up to 1st grade without knowing what constitutes a holding penalty. I agree with a statement I read here on TideFans that stated the O-line is like one player; if four players do their job and one person doesn't, the whole group has made a mistake. What makes those awesome O-lines work is the fact they know where the other guy is going and knows full well they will do their job. The O-line from Saturday was still in competition mode and people kept being shuffled, with the exception of Leatherwood and Wills and Leatherwood apparently got slightly dinged.

AS far as the RB's are concerned, they'll come around. Najee reminds me of Henry in that I believe he gets stronger as the game goes on. It took Henry a while to get going in most games, but would then explode as the game wore on. Give Najee and Robinson time. It's their first time to start as well.

With that being said, I've got to believe the run game will be a strength as the season goes on.

Roll Tide!!
ChattTide
 

81usaf92

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The difference between Henry and Najee is that Henry started hitting the hole way harder and stopped needlessly going side to side trying to make a miracle plays when if he hit the hole it would’ve been a 2 yard gain instead of a 4 yard loss. The Duke game wasn’t really a sign that Najee had dropped that habit, and again in week 1 it’s hard to tell if that is the line or the running backs. But I have a feeling that when we get to aTm and LSU we are probably going to see way more Brian Robinson than Najee.
 

BamaMoon

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The concern IMO is that after fall camp and plenty of time to prepare for mighty Duke, we couldn't muster much of a running game. I agree it's a small sample and it's not time to panic, but it's a legitimate concern.
 

bamamoss2

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I understand that we have a wealth of talent at receivers and QB. I would just like to have the comfort of knowing that if we have a 3rd and 1 we could run it. I do not see this with this OL, YET.
 

B1GTide

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The key difference between having a solid running game and an offense that controls the ball with short passes is simple - in the red zone, throwing windows get tiny. Passes that are open at the 30 yard line are not open at the 5 yard line. So, yes, you can move the ball up and down the field, but teams without solid running games do not score TDs in the red zone - they kick FGs - especially against tough defenses.
 

CoolBreeze

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Lots of hand wringing in this thread about the running game. I guess the long off season has spilled over into the first game which is fair and understandable. Nope, the team as it is will not win a title but it is only the first week. Claims of our RB quality being down as compared to previous years is, well, not factual at all. Suspension of our two deep at any position for a quarter in the first game against a veteran coach is going to hamper your output. That is just common sense. The fact that we can table our running attack, call 10 straight passing plays and dominate in a 42-3 win is pretty indicative of a team that will work to its strengths in any given game to produce the desired results. I know this is a message board where we all come to discuss our concerns but come on guys. I predict this thread will be on page 53 of this board in a couple of weeks.
 

B1GTide

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I was expecting to see Najee really have a break out year this season. Do any of you think that will still materialize?
Najee is ready, and the offense is geared to make it happen. Just have to wait and see how well the o-line comes together.

I remain confident.
 

WMack4Bama

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So....at one point, they put up a graphic and the play distribution was 33 runs and 33 passes. That's decent balance if I say so myself. What we have is inexperience at LG and C. We saw Duke run some triple option on offense (typically what an overmatched team would run against a superior team since they're not used to seeing it) to try to confuse our young LBs.

Well, they did that same thing on defense. Some of the stunts and twists that they ran along their defensive front thoroughly confused our young people up front and it stifled our running game. I think we'll be just fine once the line has time to become a cohesive unit (even without injuries, we won't see its final version until after Deonte Brown returns), we'll be good.
 
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BamaMoon

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I think it's partly due to the offseason discussion about returning to the Bama Standard and how we interpreted that to mean we'd become a more down-hill running type team, which was something we really didn't/couldn't do last year.

There were lengthy discussions about how this would show up big time against an overmatched Duke team. Even in the prediction thread, many people tempered their scoring prediction thinking we'd run more, burn more clock and shorten the amount of series we'd even have in the game.

And then, we saw a running game that really struggled to do much of anything. One time we had a 2 and 1 and on the next 2 running plays we lost about 5 yards.

As I said earlier, I think it's fair to be "concerned" about the matter, but it's way too early to panic too. If the old notion that a team improves the most between week 1 and 2 is true we "ought" to see a big improvement here. And, if we don't against this overmatched team, it might be time to be a lot more concerned. If we don't see a "gelling" by USC then we might have a legitimate problem.
 
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bigjue24

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The key difference between having a solid running game and an offense that controls the ball with short passes is simple - in the red zone, throwing windows get tiny. Passes that are open at the 30 yard line are not open at the 5 yard line. So, yes, you can move the ball up and down the field, but teams without solid running games do not score TDs in the red zone - they kick FGs - especially against tough defenses.
I agree with you. I commented on that problem earlier in the thread. I think this is where it could get you beat.
 

BamaMoon

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The key difference between having a solid running game and an offense that controls the ball with short passes is simple - in the red zone, throwing windows get tiny. Passes that are open at the 30 yard line are not open at the 5 yard line. So, yes, you can move the ball up and down the field, but teams without solid running games do not score TDs in the red zone - they kick FGs - especially against tough defenses.
This was precisely the problem against Clemson. Other than the obvious turnovers, this was the ball game. We moved the ball up and down the field enough to win the game but we couldn't put points on the board in the RZ and our kicking game wasn't reliable enough to trust so it put more pressure on the offense. IIRC, the first 3 drives in the second half we got pretty deep in their territory and we came away with exactly "0" points.
 

RollTide_HTTR

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This was precisely the problem against Clemson. Other than the obvious turnovers, this was the ball game. We moved the ball up and down the field enough to win the game but we couldn't put points on the board in the RZ and our kicking game wasn't reliable enough to trust so it put more pressure on the offense. IIRC, the first 3 drives in the second half we got pretty deep in their territory and we came away with exactly "0" points.
Agreed.

This reminds me of this article from a few years ago. Running the ball between the 20s in the NFL isn't all that useful but once you get to the redzone things change. Not only that but when passing in the redzone its more effective the fewer WRs you use in your formation.

(this is based on NFL data but still interesting. and when we play teams like Georgia/Clemson its much more similar to an NFL game)

Quickly Improve Red Zone Efficiency through Personnel Groupings and Play Calling

WS25Jul17-01-1.png

WS25Jul17-03.png
 

JustNeedMe81

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So....at one point, they put up a graphic and the play distribution was 33 runs and 33 passes. That's decent balance if I say so myself. What we have is inexperience at LG and C. We saw Duke run some triple option on offense (typically what an overmatched team would run against a superior team since they're not used to seeing it) to try to confuse our young LBs.

Well, they did that same thing on defense. Some of the stunts and twists that they ran along their defensive front thoroughly confused our young people up front and it stifled our running game. I think we'll be just fine once the line has time to become a cohesive unit (even without injuries, we won't see its final version until after Deonte Brown returns), we'll be good.
What's funny is that you may have to bring this up over and over until we are halfway though the schedule and things start to click for OL...
 

BamaInBham

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Some of Bama's worst rushing efforts have been against weaker programs early in the season. Maybe it's a combination of lack of intensity, experimentation and all out gambling by the opp who know they can't stop Bama's rushing straight up so slant, stack, etc. to stop the running game and leave the passing game wide open.

2008 Tulane 26-99 3.81 (week after Bama's coming out party vs Clemson, 172 total yards)
2012 Western Ky (Willie Taggart HC) 31-103 3.32
2015 La Monroe 35-137 3.91
2016 Western Ky 39-114 3.18
2019 Duke 45-147 3.45

It's too early to come to any conclusions, though IMO, the RBs are not at the typical level of the last 10 years. Especially past Najee.
 

tusks_n_raider

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The lack of run game concerns me. It's nice to have the best passing game in Bama history (and maybe in collegiate history), but you need to be able to run. The O-line needs work and the backs aren't as good as in years past. This is a concern.
I don't think we can fairly say this yet. Last years OL wasn't great at run blocking and this year's starting 5 at OL isn't even settled yet.

It's difficult to say how good any of our RB's are when they seldom have a hole to run through much less a crease.
 

BamaMoon

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It's too early to come to any conclusions, though IMO, the RBs are not at the typical level of the last 10 years. Especially past Najee.
You have the right to that opinion.

I think BR may actually have a better year than Najee (not that I think Najee isn't a good back). Outside of the fumble, I was pretty impressed with Ford too. And the play or two K. Robinson was in on makes me think he could be the change of pace back this year.
 

Ledsteplin

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You have the right to that opinion.

I think BR may actually have a better year than Najee (not that I think Najee isn't a good back). Outside of the fumble, I was pretty impressed with Ford too. And the play or two K. Robinson was in on makes me think he could be the change of pace back this year.
Najee does best running to the outside, rather than between the tackles. He also does well taking a pitch to the outside. Brian, hopefully, will be the bread and butter up the middle. Ford should see play time as well. I thought he did well for his first game, especially with the OL issues.
 

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