Question: How should a team handle Clemson's 3-2-6 defense

bigjue24 · Sep 16, 2019

I was pretty fascinated by watching Clemson's defense against Syracuse this past Saturday. They were blitzing from all over the place. They had several hybrid safety/linebackers on the field. Sometimes they would drop back, sometimes they would blitz. It was a really interesting way to continue to get pressure without all of those D-linemen from last year. I was curious how it should be attacked. I could see reading it being a real problem with the unorthodox nature of it. A QB would have no idea where anything would be coming from pre snap.

My thought is to play the game in a phone booth. When they have that package on the field to run between the tackles with power. That would negate some of the speed and versatility of the hybrid guys and make them match up with bigger stronger guys in a smaller area. It looked like a dream for a team with an Eddie Lacy or Derrick Henry type back and a strong O-line like Bama 2012 or 2015. I know Bama has a tall hill to climb to even get to Clemson, but how do you think it should be attacked?

CrimsonForce · Sep 16, 2019

From watching the Syracuse game, the few times the camera angle showed the secondary during Clemson blitzes there were several WRs open. The QB has to know he's going to get hit and stand in there until the last second and deliver a strike. It's a big risk vs reward. They will either get the sack or if the QB hangs in there and delivers a good ball it will be a long gain or possibly touchdown..

B1GTide · Sep 16, 2019

Did they play that defense against aTm? I don't think that they could stop a decent running attack with that many small bodies on the field.

TitleWave · Sep 16, 2019

bigjue24 said:
... I know Bama has a tall hill to climb to even get to Clemson, but how do you think it should be attacked?

If you're as 'backer-less and as lost getting to and through the gaps as 'Bama appeared against USCe Saturday, see Clemps' 3-2-6 and call 'em with a 4-1-6.

CoolBreeze · Sep 16, 2019

I thought Southern Miss was next up...

BamaInBham · Sep 16, 2019

Again, Clemson using the regular season to prepare for Alabama. This seems like a good D to employ vs Bama.

USCBAMA · Sep 16, 2019

Venables is a lot like Joe L Dunn, only with more talent to work with. He gambles a lot and there are holes in his D (just ask Lane Kiffin who destroyed it in 2nd half of cfp), but he overwhelms with an almost blitzkrieg type attack, with blitzes coming from anywhere and everywhere, making it very difficult to exploit those holes. He hangs his corners out on a a limb a lot, but you gotta have the time to exploit them.

Go back to last year's cfp game. On first pick the DB gambled. Had Tua pumped fake that's a huge gain. On 2nd pick the DB gambled, started sprinting back at snap of ball. Had Tua gone short that's a huge gain. Now those were calculated gambles based on film study, so it's not like Venables was guessing, but the holes were there, Bama & Tua just did not exploit them very well.

Remember, in first 2 Bama-Clemson meetings the Clemson D actually performed poorly with Bama picking it apart.

As for the 3-2-6, I would think a power running game would be successful, but I'm guessing he's working on that because Bama lacks such a thing right now.

At least that's my opinion.

TitleWave · Sep 16, 2019

USCBAMA said:
...As for the 3-2-6, I would think a power running game would be successful, but I'm guessing he's working on that because Bama lacks such a thing right now.

But a few more Najee Davenport wheel routes and there'll be a power catch-and-run game to shred that 3-2-6 from anywhere on the field.

bigjue24 · Sep 16, 2019

CoolBreeze said:
I thought Southern Miss was next up...

I hope you meant that to be in blue font. We are fans and speculate and discuss any game and other teams. I find what they did on defense interesting. They almost went positionless with the back 8 like you see teams doing in the NBA with versatile players running all over the court on offense and defense.

rgw · Sep 16, 2019

TitleWave said:
But a few more Najee Davenport wheel routes and there'll be a power catch-and-run game to shred that 3-2-6 from anywhere on the field.

Davenport looked nice out there for an NFL retiree.

bigjue24 · Sep 16, 2019

B1GTide said:
Did they play that defense against aTm? I don't think that they could stop a decent running attack with that many small bodies on the field.

I'm not sure about that. I will have to try and find a video of that game to go back and see what they did.

TitleWave · Sep 16, 2019

rgw said:
Davenport looked nice out there for an NFL retiree.

Yes, Green Bay drafted him out of the U for the long haul, it just didn't seem long enough when they unloaded him three years later in 2005. But now that he's reclaimed "senior" grad transfer portal eligibility from the Danielson Rule GB may want to take another look. As we Packer owners remember him as the prototype for Eddie Lacy and are thinking he could be GB's "past-o-type" RB as an NFL unretiree....

ccc2259 · Sep 16, 2019

B1GTide said:
Did they play that defense against aTm? I don't think that they could stop a decent running attack with that many small bodies on the field.

If the 3-2-6 is their formation with 3 safeties, they did employ it against aTm. At least during the portion of the game I watched. It was the first time I noticed the 3-safety thing.

rgw · Sep 16, 2019

To the point of the topic: significant use of a 3-2-6 defense would strike me - without much examination - as a team that may lack a bit for DL depth but has a box safety that can play like a 3rd linebacker. I seem to remember Clemson having a guy last year who fit that mold at safety. Considering Clemson lost their entire DL from 2018, I reckon they are probably thin at DL in terms of experience at the very least and this creates a personnel grouping that gets more experience on the field.

Reminds me a bit of our move to the 3-3-5 under Kines. Just didn't have the bodies to base in 4-3. I doubt they lack the bodies but that is probably their best personnel group at any rate. We had a bit of a problem with stopping the run against top competition in that base front. If Clemson ever happened to play a good offense they may be in trouble if that is their plan to mitigate defensive turnover. Kudos to their staff for having a plan in place to cope with their limitations though.

Bama Lee · Sep 16, 2019

bigjue24 said:
I was pretty fascinated by watching Clemson's defense against Syracuse this past Saturday. They were blitzing from all over the place. They had several hybrid safety/linebackers on the field. Sometimes they would drop back, sometimes they would blitz. It was a really interesting way to continue to get pressure without all of those D-linemen from last year. I was curious how it should be attacked. I could see reading it being a real problem with the unorthodox nature of it. A QB would have no idea where anything would be coming from pre snap.

My thought is to play the game in a phone booth. When they have that package on the field to run between the tackles with power. That would negate some of the speed and versatility of the hybrid guys and make them match up with bigger stronger guys in a smaller area. It looked like a dream for a team with an Eddie Lacy or Derrick Henry type back and a strong O-line like Bama 2012 or 2015. I know Bama has a tall hill to climb to even get to Clemson, but how do you think it should be attacked?

That is a high school defense that many teams run here in dallas. You have to have the right athletes and not be playing a power running team

USCBAMA · Sep 16, 2019

Bama Lee said:
That is a high school defense that many teams run here in dallas. You have to have the right athletes and not be playing a power running team

My understanding is a lot of undersized/undermanned HS teams will run variations of the 3-3-5, 4-2-5, 3-2-6. And agree, power running game is one way to counter it. Joe Lee Dunn basically invented the 3-3-5. Wikipedia credits him doing this at Memphis in early 90s, but it really started at New Mexico and developed further fruition at South Carolina in 1987/1988. In 87 USC had a top 5 defense with a version of this D, though they probably blitzed more and showed more man coverage than a lot of teams would. Dunn produced top ranked defenses at South Carolina, Memphis, & Mississippi State, all schools without an abundance of DL talent at the time. The 3-2-6 Venables is using is apparently a hybrid of the JLD defense.

It's possible, given the incredible talent Clemson lost at DL last year, that Venables is adjusting for a lack of DL experience...or it could be that he thinks this defense is a good counter to what Alabama is doing offensively this year. All just educated guesses, but I'm not surprised to see him borrowing from Joe Lee Dunn as his philosophy and schemes have always had a Joe Lee Dunn flair to them.

TIDE-HSV · Sep 16, 2019

rgw said:
To the point of the topic: significant use of a 3-2-6 defense would strike me - without much examination - as a team that may lack a bit for DL depth but has a box safety that can play like a 3rd linebacker. I seem to remember Clemson having a guy last year who fit that mold at safety. Considering Clemson lost their entire DL from 2018, I reckon they are probably thin at DL in terms of experience at the very least and this creates a personnel grouping that gets more experience on the field.

Reminds me a bit of our move to the 3-3-5 under Kines. Just didn't have the bodies to base in 4-3. I doubt they lack the bodies but that is probably their best personnel group at any rate. We had a bit of a problem with stopping the run against top competition in that base front. If Clemson ever happened to play a good offense they may be in trouble if that is their plan to mitigate defensive turnover. Kudos to their staff for having a plan in place to cope with their limitations though.

IOW, a Mark Barron...

rgw · Sep 16, 2019

Also I think this is a good defense for competing against our current offensive mix because we aren't a strong power run team. The 2012 Alabama squad would run for 300+ on Clemson running this defense.

B1GTide · Sep 16, 2019

This has been Clemson's 3rd down defense for as long as Venables has been there. Venables does something a little different than most DCs when he runs it - he brings down his "bigger" safety so as to make you guess what he will be doing. The Venables 3-2-6 looks a lot more like a 4-2-5, but the personnel make it a 3-2-6. The main strengths of this defense the way that Venables runs it:

* It is very hard, if not impossible, to predict who will be rushing the QB. He sometimes sends 6, sometimes only 2. Crazy, and not determined by down/distance in any predictable way.
* It puts 7 men in the box unless you have 4 WRs spread out, and then there are still 6 in the box. They are smaller, but have numbers to keep rushing gains from turning into game breakers.
* It means that TEs and slot receivers are covered on every play. This was huge in stopping the slant run by Tua/Alabama last year - still a staple in this year's offense.

How do you beat it? It starts with disciplined o-line play. Because pressure can come from anywhere, every o-lineman and TE has to know who he is responsible for on every snap, no matter what happens. You also have to be able to run the ball between the tackles. Because of the alignment, there are gaps at the LOS, even if they run blitz on every snap. Why? Because these guys are not big enough to eat up the space. You also have to have a QB who can make quick post-snap reads and get the ball out in less than 2.5 seconds. You generally have 2-2.5 seconds to get the ball out when Clemson runs this defense and sends an extra man off the edge.

Alabama has the personnel to beat this defense, even against Clemson's defensive personnel. The real question - will you be able to run it up the middle by then? Without that piece, they can really come after Tua, every play, the entire game.

Evil Crimson Dragon · Sep 16, 2019

B1GTide said:
This has been Clemson's 3rd down defense for as long as Venables has been there. Venables does something a little different than most DCs when he runs it - he brings down his "bigger" safety so as to make you guess what he will be doing. The Venables 3-2-6 looks a lot more like a 4-2-5, but the personnel make it a 3-2-6. The main strengths of this defense the way that Venables runs it:

* It is very hard, if not impossible, to predict who will be rushing the QB. He sometimes sends 6, sometimes only 2. Crazy, and not determined by down/distance in any predictable way.
* It puts 7 men in the box unless you have 4 WRs spread out, and then there are still 6 in the box. They are smaller, but have numbers to keep rushing gains from turning into game breakers.
* It means that TEs and slot receivers are covered on every play. This was huge in stopping the slant run by Tua/Alabama last year - still a staple in this year's offense.

How do you beat it? It starts with disciplined o-line play. Because pressure can come from anywhere, every o-lineman and TE has to know who he is responsible for on every snap, no matter what happens. You also have to be able to run the ball between the tackles. Because of the alignment, there are gaps at the LOS, even if they run blitz on every snap. Why? Because these guys are not big enough to eat up the space. You also have to have a QB who can make quick post-snap reads and get the ball out in less than 2.5 seconds. You generally have 2-2.5 seconds to get the ball out when Clemson runs this defense and sends an extra man off the edge.

Alabama has the personnel to beat this defense, even against Clemson's defensive personnel. The real question - will you be able to run it up the middle by then? Without that piece, they can really come after Tua, every play, the entire game.

Yep...………….get the O Line jelled ( once Brown comes back I think things start to work out better), and get the running game in gear. Shame Sanders is out for the season, but the guys that Bama have should be able to run with a better blocking line, and those little "tricks" with the WR running it might help as well

Question: How should a team handle Clemson's 3-2-6 defense

Suspended

Hall of Fame

TideFans Legend

All-American

Hall of Fame

All-American

All-SEC

All-American

Suspended

Suspended

Suspended

All-American

All-American

Suspended

All-American

All-SEC

Senior Administrator

Suspended

TideFans Legend

Hall of Fame

TideFans.shop - NEW Stuff!