Poll: Are Trump and his supporters really conservatives? Why and why not?

selmaborntidefan said:

No Trumpbot here, but any President who ever did anything for the benefit of "all Americans" pretty much did so by accident save for obvious things that we were forced into such as WW2.

And even Japanese-Americans would dispute some points on that.

However, Trump (in particular) has been the most self-centered President of my lifetime.

Part of my beef with Bill Clinton was how he would (in so many cases) tip his hand by viewing things through his particular political poll numbers or success - and Clinton is not in the same solar system with Trump as far as self-centered narcissism. (It was always considered Clinton's big flaw that he desperately wanted everyone's approval - and thus a bunch of contradiction; Trump wants first to do the exact opposite of what he's told is the smart thing and then get your approval of how intelligent he was to do the opposite of what you said).

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Your beef with Bill Clinton is the larger problem with politics these days and why I believe there should be term limits on congress with a ban on them becoming lobbyists after.

Bill Clinton acted in the best interest of his poll numbers. Republicans today refuse to stand up to Trump because they're afraid a portion of their base will make sure they don't get re-elected. Congress should not be something that can be a lifetime career possibility. Republicans in the senate won't stand up to Trump because they're afraid they won't get re-elected. i'm sorry, but you're in office to uphold the constitution, act in the bests interests of our country, citizens, and to the best use of our tax dollars. Now because they're more concerned about losing their jobs they're letting Trump take a dump on ALL of it, at the same time setting a daaaaangerous precedent. One President gets away with it now, next time the guy not on your team has precedent to do it too. Oh, and people need to stop treating voting/politics like it's a damn team sport. And no, voting republican doesn't get to be passed down as a family tradition. That's retarded. Times change, society and technology, knowledge, advances with new information. You make the best choice based on the info you have. And yes, with new information you can CHANGE your stance and should be able to do so without people giving you ..... It's called learning, critical thinking. You don't just do a thing because so and so did a thing.

/rant

Well Trump just called (part of) the Constitution "phony," which doesn't strike me as a very conservative position.

CharminTide said:

Well Trump just called (part of) the Constitution "phony," which doesn't strike me as a very conservative position.

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Actually, if he would have just changed the wording to some sort of squishy thing about "the Constitution is a living document that can change with time," he would have espoused a standard liberal one.



(Note: I'm just sorta having a little fun with you here. In point of fact, I think reasonable libs and cons CAN argue those positions coherently and substantively, but we both know Trump wasn't doing that).

You're conclusion would be wrong. As mentioned previously I don't talk politics or religion. I'm a conservative by nature but not locked into that definition if there is even one for it anymore. I will tell you this, I'm a firm believer in the constitution as it is written not what someone tries to read into it and try to apply what the founders mean as it applied to their time and as far forward as they could see. As far as defending my stance, I need not defend it to you or anyone else. Just because I tend to vote more conservative does not mean I support the calamity that's in the White House. As usual people like you like to lump everyone together or so it seems so by your post.

TIDE-HSV said:

FWIW, I draw a clear line of distinction between Trump supporters in general and conservatives in general. And I agree that there's doubt about the definition of "conservative," which seems to be more about religion in the common terminology currently than anything else...

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However I do think it is fair to say that if you plan to vote for DJT because the Democrat options are so abhorrent, you don't get to dodge the moniker of being a Trump supporter.

81usaf92 said:

There is a difference between a Trump voter and a Trump Supporter. I can get behind the silent tory vote, and the lesser of two evils people. But what I cant is these folks claiming that they are conservatives, and supporting any and every action that DJT does, and defending Trump himself as a conservative. And these same people claiming that anyone that isn't for trump, isn't a true conservative.

This isn't a "if you are a conservative, get up and defend your stance" argument. This is a "If you are a Trump supporter, and you believe you are conservative, defend why you think you and Trump are conservative" argument.

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I will give an answer. I had a conversation with a Trump supporter in my life last night. He is conservative, but doesn't think Trump is.
When someone works 60-70 hours a week, so doesn't have time to pour over news like I do.

With the news breaking hourly, and trying to keep up with it all, and read a variety of sources, many people don't have the time. So they are getting an entirely different set of facts than others. Think about our Grandmas, if they only watch Fox or msnbc and don't go online, they are getting different info. There are people my age (40ish) that only watch the nightly news and don't get down into the minutiae and the mud of online news. So for a large segment of the population- they are unaware of many of the things happening in the world.

I wrote this up and went down into the weeds with each issue, and deleted it all, because those aren't necessarily important to the broader issue. Some things they knew about, some they didn't, and on others just had wrong facts.
To be honest - I prefer to have conversations without looking up things on my phone every minute to prove I'm right, but on some of it, I just had to. They couldn't believe that what they heard was incorrect.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

81usaf92 said:

There is a difference between a Trump voter and a Trump Supporter. I can get behind the silent tory vote, and the lesser of two evils people. But what I cant is these folks claiming that they are conservatives, and supporting any and every action that DJT does, and defending Trump himself as a conservative. And these same people claiming that anyone that isn't for trump, isn't a true conservative.

This isn't a "if you are a conservative, get up and defend your stance" argument. This is a "If you are a Trump supporter, and you believe you are conservative, defend why you think you and Trump are conservative" argument.

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Fair enough. Those who remember the first time Trump ran for president should realize he is neither a conservative nor a Christian even if he claims to be. I believe most voted for him due Hillary Clinton and those who wanted the flow of immigrates stopped or at least slowed to a trickle. Someone will always bring up "the country is based on immigration" and it is true but it's one thing to help build a country and it's another to enter illegally. My problem with both Democrats and Republicans on this issue is the have both had years to fix the problem instead of finger pointing and neither party has. How long have many of them been in office? At least make it easier for them to get their citizenship.

One question for you (not politics) your screen name look like you were a 11 year ** veteran, if that is true what AFSC were you?

81usaf92 said:

3P051.... Security Forces (Defenders Hua)

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Had many friends who were SF, I was Weather Maintenance/Navaides Maintenance for 22 years. We now return you to your normally viewed thread.

81usaf92 said:

3P051.... Security Forces (Defenders Hua)

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my brother was in security forces 98-2018 (last 4-5 yrs in reserves)