AAPI/ Atlanta massage parlor shooting, NS version

B1GTide

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no, never

the US government should not have the power to kill it's own citizens. Locking them up for life is cheaper and a far worse punishment.
This is where my wife is at. Neither of us believe in the death penalty, but for different reasons. Hers more like yours, but mine more based on a distrust of our judicial system.
 
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DzynKingRTR

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Our justice system is adept at keeping people in prison. It is not as adept at letting the innocent back out.

Probably both for the same reason - corporations make money from it.
No they are not adept at it. Lots of scum get let out for "good behavior." I have been personally affected by this so I know.
 

MattinBama

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No they are not adept at it. Lots of scum get let out for "good behavior." I have been personally affected by this so I know.
There are of course those cases. However in general terms our system is geared for keeping people in, turning non-violent criminals into career criminals, or making it so the chances of their returning are much higher.
 
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DzynKingRTR

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There are of course those cases. However in general terms our system is geared for keeping people in, turning non-violent criminals into career criminals, or making it so the chances of their returning are much higher.
And since DNA has gotten much better, the number of actual innocent people in prison or on death row are not nearly as high as some of you believe. Some people have even been let out after DNA cleared them. Some people have watched Shawshank Redemption too many times.
 

B1GTide

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And since DNA has gotten much better, the number of actual innocent people in prison or on death row are not nearly as high as some of you believe. Some people have even been let out after DNA cleared them. Some people have watched Shawshank Redemption too many times.
DNA can only help a tiny percentage of the people who have been falsely imprisoned.
 

Jon

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No they are not adept at it. Lots of scum get let out for "good behavior." I have been personally affected by this so I know.
my pedophile rapist ex family member is getting out of jail next week. He got a ten year sentence for Rape in 2017. Alabama law offers no early release, no "good time" for rape and yet he goes home next week. So yeah this needs reform badly
 

MobtownK

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my pedophile rapist ex family member is getting out of jail next week. He got a ten year sentence for Rape in 2017. Alabama law offers no early release, no "good time" for rape and yet he goes home next week. So yeah this needs reform badly
I'm sorry that he's getting out, and that he's your family.

Cases like that are one huge reason I'm all for the death penalty. Not to sit in prison for 10 years. Get the appeals done, and let justice be served.
 
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MattinBama

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And since DNA has gotten much better, the number of actual innocent people in prison or on death row are not nearly as high as some of you believe. Some people have even been let out after DNA cleared them. Some people have watched Shawshank Redemption too many times.
And the numbers are not nearly as low as you believe.


The rate of wrongful convictions in the United States is estimated to be somewhere between 2 percent and 10 percent. That may sound low, but when applied to an estimated prison population of 2.3 million, the numbers become staggering. Can there really be 46,000 to 230,000 innocent people locked away? Those of us who are involved in exoneration work firmly believe so.
Even on the low end those are not numbers to be proud of as a society.

“Some people have even been let out” is not exactly that big of a thing to cheer for when those people spent years locked away & had their entire lives ruined. And those are just the lucky few where DNA was able to exonerate them.
 

Jon

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I'm sorry that he's getting out, and that he's your family.

Cases like that are one huge reason I'm all for the death penalty. Not to sit in prison for 10 years. Get the appeals done, and let justice be served.
so first, not my family, ex family. He was married to one of my wife's sisters more than a decade ago. SIL kicked him to the curb ~2008 after an incident I'd rather not elaborate on that resulted in Felony #1. The girl he hooked up with next had daughters and that lead to felony #2 and his current incarceration.

sorrier to tell you that he is on his way back to Mobile

but I wouldn't even want the state to kill him, that is getting off easy. Give him life with no parole in the worst prison in Alabama. That is a far more appropriate punishment
 
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Crimson1967

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so first, not my family, ex family. He was married to one of my wife's sisters more than a decade ago. SIL kicked him to the curb ~2008 after an incident I'd rather not elaborate on that resulted in Felony #1. The girl he hooked up with next had daughters and that lead to felony #2 and his current incarceration.

sorrier to tell you that he is on his way back to Mobile

but I wouldn't even want the state to kill him, that is getting off easy. Give him life with no parole in the worst prison in Alabama. That is a far more appropriate punishment
Before his crimes became public knowledge , did you have any intuition he wasn’t someone you’d let watch your kids?

I hope the people he hurt have been able to lead normal lives despite what this (TF banned word) did to them.
 
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Jon

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Before his crimes became public knowledge , did you have any intuition he wasn’t someone you’d let watch your kids?

I hope the people he hurt have been able to lead normal lives despite what this (TF banned word) did to them.
I had a few concerns, he often "joked" about highschool girls but he was super young at the time too (like 22-23) and then once he was a little to active trying to get a niece of ours who was 15 to drink with him when we were all staying somewhere. It ended up with he and I having words very late in the evening when just the 3 of us remained up after everyone else went to sleep. He maintained he was just having fun and had no ill intentions. My spidey sense was tingling and I stayed up all night until he finally crashed. The next day I wrote the whole thing off as me being over concerned. My wife was incredibly upset with me for it until about a year later when we all realized what he was likely trying to do that night. He was an incredibly charming, good looking and very likeable guy. When what happened in felony 1 came out I was in the process of helping to plan a birthday party for him.

First time he went to court over all of this several others came out of the woodwork. Friends of his younger sister, girls he went to HS with. One incredibly brave girl came to his first trial and sat next my SIL in the court room and as soon as he saw her he turned white and plead guilty to a lesser charge. She had been raped by him at a sleepover with his little sister when she was 14 and he 17. I will never forget her amazing bravery and what it meant to our family. I don't think she was even going to testify, she was shaking like a leaf, but it scared him badly. Trial 2 was several years and sadly several more victims later, though I am only certain of the 1 he was convicted for, his live in girlfriends 13 year old daughter. Last I heard she is doing poorly as is her Mom who was warned very explicitly by multiple members of our family when she started seeing him. I am sure the guilt she carries is immense. But as I said, he is good looking, charming and very likeable. He also has, or at least I hope had, a family that coddled, enabled and deflected for him. When she was warned his entire family assured her that it was just a nasty divorce with bad feelings and he was a poor victim. She bought it, sadly.

The worst part of all of this is it is actually far, far worse than I can even put here publicly not because I want to protect him. I would love to out him here, but his victims are all still in the area and they don't need it known and I am trying to hold on to my anonymity.

to answer your very first question he actually was around my kids. But no I never let any men around my kids without me or my wife around.
 

MobtownK

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I had a few concerns, he often "joked" about highschool girls but he was super young at the time too (like 22-23) and then once he was a little to active trying to get a niece of ours who was 15 to drink with him when we were all staying somewhere. It ended up with he and I having words very late in the evening when just the 3 of us remained up after everyone else went to sleep. He maintained he was just having fun and had no ill intentions. My spidey sense was tingling and I stayed up all night until he finally crashed. The next day I wrote the whole thing off as me being over concerned. My wife was incredibly upset with me for it until about a year later when we all realized what he was likely trying to do that night. He was an incredibly charming, good looking and very likeable guy. When what happened in felony 1 came out I was in the process of helping to plan a birthday party for him.

First time he went to court over all of this several others came out of the woodwork. Friends of his younger sister, girls he went to HS with. One incredibly brave girl came to his first trial and sat next my SIL in the court room and as soon as he saw her he turned white and plead guilty to a lesser charge. She had been raped by him at a sleepover with his little sister when she was 14 and he 17. I will never forget her amazing bravery and what it meant to our family. I don't think she was even going to testify, she was shaking like a leaf, but it scared him badly. Trial 2 was several years and sadly several more victims later, though I am only certain of the 1 he was convicted for, his live in girlfriends 13 year old daughter. Last I heard she is doing poorly as is her Mom who was warned very explicitly by multiple members of our family when she started seeing him. I am sure the guilt she carries is immense. But as I said, he is good looking, charming and very likeable. He also has, or at least I hope had, a family that coddled, enabled and deflected for him. When she was warned his entire family assured her that it was just a nasty divorce with bad feelings and he was a poor victim. She bought it, sadly.

The worst part of all of this is it is actually far, far worse than I can even put here publicly not because I want to protect him. I would love to out him here, but his victims are all still in the area and they don't need it known and I am trying to hold on to my anonymity.

to answer your very first question he actually was around my kids. But no I never let any men around my kids without me or my wife around.
When my sister was 14, I was 21. There was one guy who always tried to get her off by herself and give her whiskey. I tried to keep an eye on her. But I was naive myself, and a bit resentful that she was always my responsibility. And everyone made fun of me for keeping her under my thumb. He kissed her. But thats as far as it went. I barely remember threatening him and any other guy who came near her with death. But as we got older, my threats got more serious. I'm not intimidating, at all - but can be mean. And my now husband helped me balance keeping her safe, and not being a control freak when she was around.

I was always terrified of having girls because people are just awful. My 5 year old is gorgeous and its scary.
We've taught all of them very explicitly what you do when someone tries something. Hopefully it will be enough.
 

Jon

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Crimson1967

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