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Guards please apply...limit to those who can handle and shoot.

Z

ZRossUA

Scout Team
Aug 31, 2004
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Can someone tell me why we put all of our eggs into the Rico Pickett and Reger Dowell baskets, and we pass on players like Frankie Sullivan and the kid that went to Arkansas (originally from Montgomery)????

While Dowell may still sign with us, Rico was an absolute disaster. Now I know that Sullivan is more of a combo guard, but he can still handle the ball. How many 2 guards did we have last year that could run, dribble, and shoot? NONE. Our guards CAN NOT handle the ball, and we really need to address this. If Riley or Gee didnt get an absolute quick step on their guy, then they had to pick up their dribble and our offensive cohesiveness suffered greatly.

Everyone says that Gottfried is a great recruiter, and I have even said that in the past. However, One McDonalds American, one Strong Small Forward, and an athletic Swingman, and a 5'9 JUCO point dont answer our need of Guards that can handle and shoot. We tend to either recruit shooters (Riley) or handlers (Torrance, Hollinger, Pickett).

Sorry for the vent, I just hate to see us lose out point guard commitment for 09, when we couldve addressed this need in 08 with Sullivan. Instead, we lost him to Auburn. In my opinion, its win the SEC West and make the Sweet 16, our we have a coaching vacany?

Any thoughts?
 
Hillman can handle pretty good. Good enough to make a move to the basket. However, I have thought what you are saying for a while now. We usually only have guards who can shoot, with not ball handling, or guards that can handle, but can't shoot. Steele is an exception. For years it has been frustrating because we have not had someone who can consistently hit midrange jumpers or get to the whole. Kennedy Winston is the last I can remember, and people were so hard on him it was ridiculous.
 
Winston got ripped apart, but every Bama fan would love to have him back on the team...

You are right on Hillman, but he can't shoot consistently. However, he looks like he has fairly good form and he has potential to be a great shooter. If he was 6'6 with his current skills, he would be a lottery pick due to athleticism and potential. While Winston was better all-around player and he wasn't drafted.

This is kinda off subject, but maybe the NBA should join the Euro league in some kind of post-season tournament... It would give guys like Winston a chance to prove themselves. But the NBA would never do that, because a few of its teams would lose due to playing players who are strong in fundamentals.

Think about it. Anthony Randolph and Robert Swift vs. Kennedy Winston and Erwin Dudley (both in Europe), who would you take?
 
So I believe your point is "why did we not sign Frankie Sullivan? (or Courtney Fortner)" Considering they would have been part of the 08 class, and one of those was the PG from JC who signed after the two players were committed, which of the three players would you have not signed? Obviously we would sign the McDonald All-American, and with the current makeup of the team the SF had to be signed (especially considering his talent level). So the decision as framed here was, do we sign Steele or Sullivan. They are both actually a combo guard with Steele being slightly bigger, but Sullivan have a more developed offensive repertoire. It is an interesting question, and one that Gottfried obviously made with his decision. I guess time will tell as to which has the more successful career.
 
TheDon24 said:
hollinger can handle and shoot, he just can't drive to the basket that well.
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That completely proves my point. Winston could do all three. Earnest Shelton could even drive decently by his Senior year. Thats what makes this so frustrating. It really is why we dont have more success in terms of wins. Our offense becomes so stagnant because we dont have guys that can stretch the defense with their shot while also being able to pump fake and take the ball to the basket. We have a few guys with potential, but they need to practice a good bit the offense.

In regards to the recruiting comments, there is no way you can tell me that Gottfried didn't think that one of our guys would leave early. He had to have a backup plan. Many people would look down on it, but scholarships are renewable on an annual basis. So, he could've cut the scholarships of underachievers or players who are always stirring up trouble. He shouldve known that either Hendrix, Steele, Pickett, Tubbs, or Torrance wouldnt have been back. You seriously can't tell me that he knew all of them would be back after last year. So in that case, we get Sullivan, Green, Steele, Mitchell, and wait to sign Brock until late Spring when Pickett decides to transfer. So, in answer to your statement, we wouldnt have to turn down Steele or Brock. We couldve gotten both. We couldve gotten Sullivan or Fortson, and if we wanted, we couldve gotten Brock late. I dont see it being that complicated.

In fact, you are saying that he would have to choose, but we were recruiting J'Mison Morgan after we already had Green, Steele, and Mitchell. Back when we thought we still had Hendrix for next year. So instead of going after a offensive guard in Sullivan, we were recruiting a defensive center to go along with our frontcourt of ("Hendrix", Green, Jemison, Gee, Coleman). Maybe Im missing something here, but it looks like Coach had an extra scholly, he just didnt do a good job of getting after Sullivan early and he had to suffer by losing him to Auburn.

If you know of that timeline better, then please tell me. But Im pretty sure that we had an open scholarship that entire time, but we chose to go heavy after Morgan and we lost out on a few great guards from the state. Then had to settle for a JUCO point. The best of luck to these guys this year, Ill be at every home game, just like the past 5 years. Hopefully Ron well help answer my point of this thread, but if he isnt 100%, then we will continue to suffer.

By saying all that, I still think that Steele comes back strong, and we make a run to the Sweet 16. I just wish Hendrix wouldve stayed.

ROLL TIDE!
 
ZRossUA said:
In regards to the recruiting comments, there is no way you can tell me that Gottfried didn't think that one of our guys would leave early. He had to have a backup plan. Many people would look down on it, but scholarships are renewable on an annual basis. So, he could've cut the scholarships of underachievers or players who are always stirring up trouble. He shouldve known that either Hendrix, Steele, Pickett, Tubbs, or Torrance wouldnt have been back.
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Did I miss something? I didn't know that Torrance had left the program. Man take a few weeks off and see what you miss.

:BigA:
 
Yeah, I definitely did not mean Torrance left the program. I was meaning that there were major rumors surrounding all 5 of them, and the possibility of any of them leaving after last year.
 
ZRossUA said:
Yeah, I definitely did not mean Torrance left the program. I was meaning that there were major rumors surrounding all 5 of them, and the possibility of any of them leaving after last year.
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:conf2: uh, ok I apologize I thought you meant that Coach should have known they were all leaving. I guess I'm just not following on where Coach didn't recruit properly. Didn't he actually oversign according to strictly class size so it would appear he was preparing for the eventuality of having attrition happen. I'm not trying to be argumentative but it just seems like Coach gets blamed for things left and right. I mean if I want to get upset about a player he didn't sign it would be Stanley Robinson at UConn. He is a legitimate impact player. I'll wait until Frank Sullivan has done something at the college level before I get upset. Take a look at his profile: Frank Sullivan under things he needs to work on a perimeter shot, shooting off the dribble, and passing. These are the items you are saying our current Guards can't do, so how would he fix those problems?
 
GrandBayTider said:
:Take a look at his profile: Frank Sullivan under things he needs to work on a perimeter shot, shooting off the dribble, and passing. These are the items you are saying our current Guards can't do, so how would he fix those problems?
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That is what Scout says. I have seen him play, and I guarantee that he can do all three of those on the collegiate level. He will be Auburn star within the next two years, unless he realizes what an idiot he is for going there and transfers.

I am not blaming "Coach" for what he does. I am blaming him for not recruiting for a glaring weakness that we have had since Winston left. Thats all. He maybe recruiting in case of attrition, but my major point is that he is not recruiting for our weaknesses. You were the one that pointed out that we wouldve had to drop a current recruit to add Sullivan, and I said that was not the case. He was actively recruiting a number of players, but he wasn't recruiting for a certain need we have. I think we wouldve been better served by going after Sullivan very hard early instead of standing there with our tail between our legs when Morgan turned us down. I was merely responding to your comment about us not having room, but we did have room. We STILL have room. And actually now, we are standing here PRAYING that the kid from Muscle Shoals wants to come here in 2010. He would definitely fulfill this need, WAY more than Sullivan.

Sullivan CAN play, He can shoot off the dribble. He can flat out score. Trust me on that one. I dont think its that hard to get a guard who can shoot and drive. Many teams have them, except for Alabama.
 
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