Select Committee on January 6 Insurrection report...

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selmaborntidefan

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Four all beef patties, 6 feet under: the McCPR
I know there's fear of X and Y, and I'm no fan of any kind of a police state.

But I think:
a) you HAVE to put this guy on trial
b) if you want to mitigate riots, hand down some stiff sentences (there already are some) DAILY during the time of the trial (a psychological "you try this and this awaits you, too")

Seriously - if you can't try this President for fraud and inciting to riot and I don't know what all else - how can you ever try anyone for anything ever again unless you have in on your phone video?
 

NationalTitles18

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Before the hearings, I would have said you’d overstated a good case. Now, I think you might have hit the nail on the had.

Donald Trump was clearly out of control. He knew the insurrectionisits were armed and intended to do physical harm to elected leaders of both parties.

He worked with aides to put forward claims he knew were false. He knew he had lost the election, and spiraled into increasingly deranged attempts to overturn it….up to and including overturning the Constitution.

He was definitely temporarily insane, and you could make a case that the insanity wasn’t (and isn’t) temporary.

And after he knew the legal walls we closing in, he attempted to intimidate witnesses. Maybe he did it himself, maybe he had others do it for him.

We all know this, and it feels good to get morally outraged. But that doesn’t do much good for the country, only for our self-perceptions.

The bigger question is, “What will the DOJ (reporting up through to the President) do about it?

And I have a new addition to my list of heroes in Rep. Cheney.

She‘s probably going to get primaried. She’s far from stupid, and knows that the odds are against her. Which is why she’s fast-tracking the investigation as much as she possibly can. Gutsy lady, with principles that Lech Walesa (another of my heroes) would admire.
Thank you. Those of us paying close attention beforehand knew there would be trouble - and perhaps big trouble - but I also most of us also thought he would not go as far as he did, or perhaps that was hope over rational thought from us.

In any case, it's clear now and it's not even a close call - he assembled a militia and the militia was fighting for him and awaiting further orders from him to retrieve the arms and explosives they had stashed. If he was at the Capitol and if things had gone differently for a few key figures then that stash would have gone live because at that point (if the VP and others are killed) there is no turning back for him.

There are several imperfect heroes in this story - Pence and Chaney among them. That's how it usually is with heroes. Of course, the cynical part of me says they were just doing their damned jobs and there shouldn't be much glory in that - and there really shouldn't.

DOJ needs to move on the evidence and I don't care who has to go down - take them all down.
 
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NationalTitles18

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I know there's fear of X and Y, and I'm no fan of any kind of a police state.

But I think:
a) you HAVE to put this guy on trial
b) if you want to mitigate riots, hand down some stiff sentences (there already are some) DAILY during the time of the trial (a psychological "you try this and this awaits you, too")

Seriously - if you can't try this President for fraud and inciting to riot and I don't know what all else - how can you ever try anyone for anything ever again unless you have in on your phone video?
He has to go to prison. Period. And all his minions that helped in the effort, too, including a SCOTUS wife and some congress critters.
 

4Q Basket Case

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There are several imperfect heroes in this story - Pence and Chaney among them. That's how it usually is with heroes. Of course, the cynical part of me says they were just doing their damned jobs and there shouldn't be much glory in that - and there really shouldn't.

DOJ needs to move on the evidence and I don't care who has to go down - take them all down.
Just as there are no perfect people, there are no perfect heroes in history. You have to take the virtues with the flaws.

My all-time hero is Lech Walesa. For those not yet members of the OFC, he was a union leader in Gdańsk, Poland, in the early 80s before the Iron Curtain came down….when such advocacy was literally risking your freedom and life. Long story short, he stared down Jarulezewski (sp?), the Soviet puppet Polish President, got a break from the collapse of the Soviet Union, and won.

Ended up being the president of Poland after the Soviets pulled out, and was a miserable failure whose administrations were plagued by a lot of scandals.

The best revolutionaries aren’t often the best peacetime leaders. That doesn’t diminish their courage and value as revolutionaries.

FWIW, I still have a Polish Solidarity t-shirt, vintage circa 1982-83. Solidarnosc spelling.
 
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NationalTitles18

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Just as there are no perfect people, there are no perfect heroes in history. You have to take the virtues with the flaws.

My all-time hero is Lech Walesa. For those not yet members of the OFC, he was a union leader in Gdańsk, Poland, in the early 80s before the Iron Curtain came down….when such advocacy was literally risking your freedom and life. Long story short, he stared down Jarulezewski (sp?), the Soviet puppet Polish President, got a break from the collapse of the Soviet Union, and won.

Ended up being the president of Poland after the Soviets pulled out, and was a miserable failure whose administrations were plagued by a lot of scandals.

The best revolutionaries aren’t often the best peacetime leaders. That doesn’t diminish their courage and value as revolutionaries.

FWIW, I still have a Polish Solidarity t-shirt, vintage circa 1982-83. Solidarnosc spelling.
I'm in the OFC because I remember. :D
 
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TIDE-HSV

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Just as there are no perfect people, there are no perfect heroes in history. You have to take the virtues with the flaws.

My all-time hero is Lech Walesa. For those not yet members of the OFC, he was a union leader in Gdańsk, Poland, in the early 80s before the Iron Curtain came down….when such advocacy was literally risking your freedom and life. Long story short, he stared down Jarulezewski (sp?), the Soviet puppet Polish President, got a break from the collapse of the Soviet Union, and won.

Ended up being the president of Poland after the Soviets pulled out, and was a miserable failure whose administrations were plagued by a lot of scandals.

The best revolutionaries aren’t often the best peacetime leaders. That doesn’t diminish their courage and value as revolutionaries.

FWIW, I still have a Polish Solidarity t-shirt, vintage circa 1982-83. Solidarnosc spelling.
Likewise, many wartime leaders are turned out of office shortly after the war is over, or after their post-war administration has failed miserably...
 
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JDCrimson

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The Seth Abramson Twitter thread posted a few posts back is really a must read for all concerned citizens following this insurgency...
 

CrimsonNagus

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I know there's fear of X and Y, and I'm no fan of any kind of a police state.

But I think:
a) you HAVE to put this guy on trial
b) if you want to mitigate riots, hand down some stiff sentences (there already are some) DAILY during the time of the trial (a psychological "you try this and this awaits you, too")

Seriously - if you can't try this President for fraud and inciting to riot and I don't know what all else - how can you ever try anyone for anything ever again unless you have in on your phone video?
Sad thing is, we have video of all this and the documentary crew might have what you are talking about.

 

Diogenes

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“I do think criminal prosecutions are possible,” says Ty Cobb, a former top lawyer in the Trump White House. “Possible for Trump and Meadows certainly. And for the others, including lawyers, who engaged fraudulently in formal proceedings or investigations.”
 

Diogenes

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The gullible nature of MAGA followers is disturbing. Maybe I was naïve to believe that all Americans relied on democracy and the rule of law to defend the constitution.

I am about tick some folks off by asking too many rhetorical questions

What is the difference between MAGA and Al-Qaeda?

Yeah, I don’t know either
 
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92tide

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The gullible nature of MAGA followers is disturbing. Maybe I was naïve to believe that all Americans relied on democracy and the rule of law to defend the constitution.

I am about tick some folks off by asking too many rhetorical questions

What is the difference between MAGA and Al-Qaeda?

Yeah, I don’t know either
not sure, but i think al-qaeda is a little more lenient on abortions
 
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selmaborntidefan

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Four all beef patties, 6 feet under: the McCPR
not sure if I have ever shared this before but Meadows and I have some mutual acquaintances. I've never met him but people I know have. From what I hear he is dumb enough to take that deal
The main reason I can believe that is because I personally think you HAVE to be a certain level of dumb to ever go to work for Donald Trump. I know that's a harsh judgment, but other than her reputation for killing people, folks tend to work for Hillary, and she showed a large degree of loyalty and at least had the decency when she had to fire folks of trying to keep it dignified (which every executive should).

But come on. We've known AT LEAST since the USFL days (and some earlier) exactly what Trump is and what he does. It didn't change then, and it hasn't changed to this day. This is a guy - as I've reminded you here before - that hung out with Mike Tyson during Tyson's 1992 rape trial and afterwards SENT HIM A BILL for $2 million for his friendship (as if Jailbird Tyson had any money coming in).

You simply HAVE to be dumb to go to work for this guy. I can't even give some presumed smart people who used the "hey, you should see the stuff we've managed to keep him from doing" argument the benefit of the doubt.

I saw this in a movie years ago, and I honestly can't remember (for real!) what movie it was, although I thought it had Tom Cruise in it. The truth was closing in and so one of the bigwigs in a company typed up a suicide note for himself and another guy and it admitted the wrongdoing and how he couldn't go on (and it was all his fault). He got the nitwit who came in to sign a typed suicide letter, thinking it was genius, and then threw him out the window to his death, leaving him both dead AND with a signed confession to take the blame.

THAT is Donald Trump, folks.
 
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TIDE-HSV

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The main reason I can believe that is because I personally think you HAVE to be a certain level of dumb to ever go to work for Donald Trump. I know that's a harsh judgment, but other than her reputation for killing people, folks tend to work for Hillary, and she showed a large degree of loyalty and at least had the decency when she had to fire folks of trying to keep it dignified (which every executive should).

But come on. We've known AT LEAST since the USFL days (and some earlier) exactly what Trump is and what he does. It didn't change then, and it hasn't changed to this day. This is a guy - as I've reminded you here before - that hung out with Mike Tyson during Tyson's 1992 rape trial and afterwards SENT HIM A BILL for $2 million for his friendship (as if Jailbird Tyson had any money coming in).

You simply HAVE to be dumb to go to work for this guy. I can't even give some presumed smart people who used the "hey, you should see the stuff we've managed to keep him from doing" argument the benefit of the doubt.

I saw this in a movie years ago, and I honestly can't remember (for real!) what movie it was, although I thought it had Tom Cruise in it. The truth was closing in and so one of the bigwigs in a company typed up a suicide note for himself and another guy and it admitted the wrongdoing and how he couldn't go on (and it was all his fault). He got the nitwit who came in to sign a typed suicide letter, thinking it was genius, and then threw him out the window to his death, leaving him both dead AND with a signed confession to take the blame.

THAT is Donald Trump, folks.
How stupid would the country have to be to re-elect him?
 

Diogenes

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How stupid would the country have to be to re-elect him?
Like what Eastman said to Greg Jacob, the other Univ of Chicago lawyer about Pence overturning the election, “we know it’s illegal but they’re not constitutional lawyers and are dumb enough to believe anything we say.”
 
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