Link: Supreme Court ruling on Native Lands in Oklahoma

crimsonaudio

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I guess it's almost everything east of OKC.

This will be interesting to watch unfold. I suspect there will be lots of fallout - both positive and negative - from this that will add to the argument.

Not sure this is the right decision at this particular point in history.
 

TIDE-HSV

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This will be interesting to watch unfold. I suspect there will be lots of fallout - both positive and negative - from this that will add to the argument.

Not sure this is the right decision at this particular point in history.
IDK exactly what you mean. I'm not sure there was any other decision, which is basically what Gorsuch said. The court held the US to its word...
 

crimsonaudio

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IDK exactly what you mean. I'm not sure there was any other decision, which is basically what Gorsuch said. The court held the US to its word...
Too late for me to get into it now, I just think it's time to figure out how to incorporate the native-american lands instead of this 'separate but equal' stuff which is really neither.
 

MobtownK

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I guess it's almost everything east of OKC.

I don't really know what the long term implications will be, but I will say that after working with the Tribes in Florida on projects as mundane as road work borrow pits, that were not on reservations, but just in the state, they take very seriously the responsibility of land rights and history.
Ended up we wrote a standing MOU for borrow pits and pre approved them for emergency road work. Otherwise repair after hurricanes could get delayed. Each and every shell and sand put had to be vetted.
This will reach into aspects none of us have thought of.
Just on it's face, it makes sense, a criminal investigation of a Native American should involve the Tribe if on historic tribal lands.
 

Tidewater

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From the article:
"certain major crimes committed within the boundaries of reservations must be prosecuted in federal court rather than state court, if a Native American is involved. ... Less serious crimes involving Native Americans on American Indian land will be handled in tribal courts. ...Then there's the issue of past decisions — many of them are now considered wrongful convictions because the state lacked jurisdiction. A number of criminal defendants who have been convicted in the past will now have grounds to challenge their convictions, arguing that the state never had jurisdiction to try them."

That would not make them innocent, it would mean their cases would be tried in a Federal court. From what my lawyer friend explained to me, for criminal trials, you would much rather have your case tried in a state court than federal one. The accused is much more like to be found guilty in a federal trial.
 
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Im_on_dsp

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I wonder about the private land ownership of land within those areas.
Will those sales be invalidated?
To me that's the much much bigger issue. From the legal perspective the worse case is that some guilty criminals may go free. Not earth shattering. However, if you had lived your whole life somewhere in the area and your entire financial worth tied up in real estate and now all of a sudden you don't own it anymore? We're probably talking hundreds of thousands of people too.
 

uafanataum

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To me that's the much much bigger issue. From the legal perspective the worse case is that some guilty criminals may go free. Not earth shattering. However, if you had lived your whole life somewhere in the area and your entire financial worth tied up in real estate and now all of a sudden you don't own it anymore? We're probably talking hundreds of thousands of people too.
That's not what the article said though. It said to compare this to the tribes having county governance. He said that most counties own very little of the land that they have jurisdiction over. The tribes will not own most of the this land. They will just have jurisdiction.
 

Tidewater

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That's not what the article said though. It said to compare this to the tribes having county governance. He said that most counties own very little of the land that they have jurisdiction over. The tribes will not own most of the this land. They will just have jurisdiction.
I had to look this up, but the Dawes Act of 1887 forced the "civilized tribe" (Choctaw, Chickasaw, Creek, Cherokee, and Seminole) members to patent a specific acreage and let the Federal government sell the remainder of the land within the reservations.
The federal government has used a similar procedure with the Creeks of northeast Alabama. At first, the Creek Reserve was all set aside for the Creeks. Then each Creek head of household had to patent 640 acres within the reserve, and the Federal government sold the rest. Then, unscrupulous speculators swindled the Creeks out of their patents ("Make you mark here and I'll give you a bottle of firewater.")
Not sure if something similar happened in the Nations after Dawes.
 
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Bamaro

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This will be interesting to watch unfold. I suspect there will be lots of fallout - both positive and negative - from this that will add to the argument.

Not sure this is the right decision at this particular point in history.
It will get interesting. In the end there will have to be some sort of compensation/reparations paid, as there should be.
 
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TIDE-HSV

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Too late for me to get into it now, I just think it's time to figure out how to incorporate the native-american lands instead of this 'separate but equal' stuff which is really neither.
I agree with that. Most don't realize that most historic reservation lands long ago passed into private hands, mostly white hands. Thus it's a real anomaly for tribal law to hold sway simply because the PTB never got around to formally abrogating the treaties they long ago dishonored. Of course, politically, they don't want the firestorm that would kick up, even if it's just recognizing the reality of the situation...
 
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TIDE-HSV

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That's not what the article said though. It said to compare this to the tribes having county governance. He said that most counties own very little of the land that they have jurisdiction over. The tribes will not own most of the this land. They will just have jurisdiction.
This is correct. For some reason, the last several posts just didn't pop up before I made my post above...
 

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